Thoughts on X-Plane 12

[Unster]

I've flown some time in the demo. It has some modest improvements, but I don't think it's enough to justify the $60 price tag as an existing XP11 owner. There should be a discount for owners of the previous version to upgrade.

I mostly like the look of the new water and also the ability to adjust the shadow rendering distance, though I feel it's still not great enough. Lighting is a bit improved, it's a little more toward blue, maybe more realistic. Ground & tree textures are improved, but I already have mods for those in XP11 so the improvement is almost non-existent for me. Buildings disappointingly still look the same. I don't like the new 3D tree pop-in as you get closer. I wish it could be turned off and just fly with tree sprites that look good enough IMO. I know there are supposedly much improved weather effects, but I haven't played with them yet, and I don't think they'll be useful to me because even on a clear day the frame rate is mediocre, worse than in XP11 with my mods.

If you've played the demo or have the full version, what do you think?

[grandafam1]

There has never been a special upgrade price going from one major version to the next, and there shouldn't be here. To get the software-only version of an FAA approved for real life flight training simulator for the cost of 5 Starbucks ... it's a steal.

No one had a problem coughing up $79 to pay for MSFS, which cannot be used for actual flight training regardless of the hardware attached.

What do I think? I think the VR implementation needs polish (using an Index outside of the Steam environment) but everything else I have tried impressed me greatly. I have the full version of XP12.

[Unster]

Well, I wasn't planning to have a debate about the price, but why would anyone pay $79 for MSFS when you can try it for a dollar in the Xbox game pass? At most it would be about $48 with the discount there to keep it.

As far as this game goes, I'm just looking at the value of it. I already paid the full $60 price for XP11, and there's nothing really groundbreaking in XP12. It's small evolution from the previous product. In some games, this would even be a free update.

[Maki Nishikino]

Bought it and ended up refunding it as I was just not really that impressed.

[Unster]

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

Bought it and ended up refunding it as I was just not really that impressed.

I'm just curious. Why didn't you try the demo first?

[Maki Nishikino]

Originally posted by Unster:

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

Bought it and ended up refunding it as I was just not really that impressed.

I'm just curious. Why didn't you try the demo first?

I did, wasn't till after I bought it that I came to the conclusion I had made a mistake. I'm really glad that Laminar Research issued me a refund.

[Unster]

Originally posted by Maki Nishikino:

Originally posted by Unster:

I'm just curious. Why didn't you try the demo first?

I did, wasn't till after I bought it that I came to the conclusion I had made a mistake. I'm really glad that Laminar Research issued me a refund.

I'm surprised they do that actually. Couldn't people keep the game installed and keep playing it? I know with Steam you can't do that because it authenticates the game each time. Not sure how it's handled when it's a direct download.

What made you realize the full game wasn't right for you even though you liked the demo enough to buy the full game? Was it some performance issue or you're just not that much into flying anymore?

[Maki Nishikino]

Originally posted by Unster:

I'm surprised they do that actually. Couldn't people keep the game installed and keep playing it? I know with Steam you can't do that because it authenticates the game each time. Not sure how it's handled when it's a direct download.

I would assume the key I entered when I bought it was revoked. I didn't test it, as soon I saw the money back I deleted it.

Originally posted by Unster:

What made you realize the full game wasn't right for you even though you liked the demo enough to buy the full game?

Too much like XP 11 for me. I needed the full version as I was going to fly on VATSIM thus why I bought it.

Originally posted by Unster:

Was it some performance issue

Nah, it was fine. In fact I was using it fully maxed out.

Originally posted by Unster:

...or you're just not that much into flying anymore?

Certainly not the case.

[Unster]

Thanks. Too much like XP11 seems to be the consensus from what I saw in YT comments, and it was my first impression too. I was expecting bigger changes. There was no awe for me like when I first saw MSFS 2020, even though that game has plenty of flaws. I think Laminar needs to step it up to stay competitive.

[Kimuriel]

or just accept that they will always have a place with the hardcore fans. Sim market is pretty small when it comes down to it, I doubt x-plane will disappear. Each has their own tastes and preferences, I am sure there will be plenty who prefer x-plane over msf2020. And that is ok. Graphics in the end aren't everything tbh. I mean MSF2020 is nice looking and with 2rd party addons moving in the right direction. But I personally will still get x-plane 12 when it comes to steam and play both sims I expect.

[MagusLucidus]

Originally posted by grandafam1:

There has never been a special upgrade price going from one major version to the next, and there shouldn't be here. To get the software-only version of an FAA approved for real life flight training simulator for the cost of 5 Starbucks ... it's a steal.

No one had a problem coughing up $79 to pay for MSFS, which cannot be used for actual flight training regardless of the hardware attached.

What do I think? I think the VR implementation needs polish (using an Index outside of the Steam environment) but everything else I have tried impressed me greatly. I have the full version of XP12.

MSFS was a huge improvement. What comes FAA approving very few have equipments for that and usually they buy XP Pro version. Additionally I think they don't use beta or early access versions.

XP11 with addons is very good simulator. What XP12 offer more than it? ATM XP11 have better planes and graphically difference is not big. Maybe situation is different when stable comes but now best options are XP11 or MSFS.

[Unster]

Originally posted by Kimuriel:

or just accept that they will always have a place with the hardcore fans. Sim market is pretty small when it comes down to it, I doubt x-plane will disappear.

It's not about that, and I don't want X-Plane to disappear, especially since I prefer XP11 over MSFS. Maybe that wasn't clear enough in my previous posts. I was just expecting bigger improvements in XP12, considering it's a full price game. Having said that, there are some nice improvements, like I said they're modest, but they're there. Last night I noticed the Baron model got a nice makeover. It looks a lot better than the one in XP11. Maybe because it was a carryover from XP10? But again, for $60 I expect more. Will I get the full game? Not sure yet, especially since I have some nice mods in XP11.

[grandafam1]

Originally posted by MagusLucidus:

Originally posted by grandafam1:

There has never been a special upgrade price going from one major version to the next, and there shouldn't be here. To get the software-only version of an FAA approved for real life flight training simulator for the cost of 5 Starbucks ... it's a steal.

No one had a problem coughing up $79 to pay for MSFS, which cannot be used for actual flight training regardless of the hardware attached.

What do I think? I think the VR implementation needs polish (using an Index outside of the Steam environment) but everything else I have tried impressed me greatly. I have the full version of XP12.

MSFS was a huge improvement. What comes FAA approving very few have equipments for that and usually they buy XP Pro version. Additionally I think they don't use beta or early access versions.

XP11 with addons is very good simulator. What XP12 offer more than it? ATM XP11 have better planes and graphically difference is not big. Maybe situation is different when stable comes but now best options are XP11 or MSFS.

The only difference between the FAA approved version and the consumer version is ... the FAA approved version has bigger higher resolution panels for integration with approved hardware and the non-pilot training aircraft (Heavy Metal, military birds, and experimental planes) have been removed. The base code, including the Blade Element Theory flight dynamics are exactly the same.

One major benefit of XP12 over XP11 will be the ability to take advantage of all the future upgrades (from 12.current to 12.6x) expected over the next few years. XP11 will receive no further updates.

[Kimuriel]

Originally posted by Unster:

Originally posted by Kimuriel:

or just accept that they will always have a place with the hardcore fans. Sim market is pretty small when it comes down to it, I doubt x-plane will disappear.

It's not about that, and I don't want X-Plane to disappear, especially since I prefer XP11 over MSFS. Maybe that wasn't clear enough in my previous posts. I was just expecting bigger improvements in XP12, considering it's a full price game. Having said that, there are some nice improvements, like I said they're modest, but they're there. Last night I noticed the Baron model got a nice makeover. It looks a lot better than the one in XP11. Maybe because it was a carryover from XP10? But again, for $60 I expect more. Will I get the full game? Not sure yet, especially since I have some nice mods in XP11.

Ah gotcha. we will see how far it improves to be honest :)

[grandafam1]

Originally posted by Kimuriel:

Originally posted by Unster:

It's not about that, and I don't want X-Plane to disappear, especially since I prefer XP11 over MSFS. Maybe that wasn't clear enough in my previous posts. I was just expecting bigger improvements in XP12, considering it's a full price game. Having said that, there are some nice improvements, like I said they're modest, but they're there. Last night I noticed the Baron model got a nice makeover. It looks a lot better than the one in XP11. Maybe because it was a carryover from XP10? But again, for $60 I expect more. Will I get the full game? Not sure yet, especially since I have some nice mods in XP11.

Ah gotcha. we will see how far it improves to be honest :)

X-Plane and MSFS2020 are not direct competitors. Laminar's product in the Mac world is a big monopoly. There are no competitors to it the the Maciverse. X-Plane will live on despite what Microsoft has planned for their simulator. Not to mention Laminar's "pro" customers powering their real world flight training with their software backbone.

[Unster]

Originally posted by grandafam1:

X-Plane and MSFS2020 are not direct competitors.

They are direct competitors in the gaming market. Virtually everyone is comparing the 2 games. Sure XPlane may have the pro version, but that's something else.