Gear acquisition is terrible

[niaerniopawrjnko]

PoE2 can never be considered a good game as long as trading is by far the best way to upgrade your character. Crafting (if we can even call it that) isnt worth it and finding an upgrade through just playing is impossible because the loot is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

The entire point of this genre is getting loot and progressing your character. GGG has failed in every single regard to create a satisfying gameplay loop here, that is the simple truth. PoE 2 is a terrible ARPG and as long as Jonathan keeps doubling down on these autistic game design decisions it will remain forever flawed.

So much wasted potential

[Critical]

Originally posted by moody:

Originally posted by Critical:

The majority of the reviews say it is a good game so not sure what you're talking about. They wouldn't have gotten that rating if there wasn't a satisfying game loop.

Crafting can definitely be improved but your post is quite an exaggeration.

How can it be an exaggeration? GGG told us they don't want people gravitating to one playstyle and that's what Rarity is doing. If you're not running Rarity your broke. So that means I have to do what everyone else.

Did you see the whole block where he effectively said the gameplay loop is a complete failure? If you can't see that as an exaggeration (by looking at the reviews) I really don't know what to tell you.

[Baron01]

Originally posted by Wutever:

Are you literally just grinding white maps with 0 Increased Item Rarity or something? Difficulty 4 bosses, Trials and pinnacle fight all usually drop higher quality gear. You do realize that gear you're buying is coming from somewhere, right?

Are you really just clueless or talking out of your ass?

I'm almost level 95, spent most of my time in Atlas running 80+ (now at 104) rarity. I have ONE gear piece on me that I have found myself everything else was bought from other players. The one piece of gear I found is Hand of Wisdom and Action, a lucky find from my 2nd kill of a breach boss. Lucky drop, actually good for my build.

It is not that you do not find rares, those rares are just badly rolled or "nearly" good. Problem is that "nearly" good items often does not even warrant spending Exalts on them, let alone some more expensive currency. If you are in trade league, you must consider very hard whether to spend any currency other than lower level ones on items. Nearly good items can be slammed by Exalt or two or maybe use Chaos orbs in hopes to hit jackpot. However, if you would spend few moments checking what you can get for that 2 Exalts on trade, you realize how much of a waste of currency such attempts are.

PoE and PoE2 economy is based on GGG's view that trading is crucial and core part of their game. This would be fine if they would spend some resources and effort to make trading reasonable experience but they only did the bare minimum. PoE2 at least introduced in-game currency trading, which is great tool as it reduces amount of scams and time needed to do any currency trading via website and player interaction. This would hopefully evolve into fully automated item trading in-game one day.

So yes, gear acquisition is absolutely atrocious in PoE2 but it was always atrocious even in PoE1, nothing has really changed.

[niaerniopawrjnko]

Originally posted by Baron01:

Originally posted by Wutever:

Are you literally just grinding white maps with 0 Increased Item Rarity or something? Difficulty 4 bosses, Trials and pinnacle fight all usually drop higher quality gear. You do realize that gear you're buying is coming from somewhere, right?

Are you really just clueless or talking out of your ass?

I'm almost level 95, spent most of my time in Atlas running 80+ (now at 104) rarity. I have ONE gear piece on me that I have found myself everything else was bought from other players. The one piece of gear I found is Hand of Wisdom and Action, a lucky find from my 2nd kill of a breach boss. Lucky drop, actually good for my build.

It is not that you do not find rares, those rares are just badly rolled or "nearly" good. Problem is that "nearly" good items often does not even warrant spending Exalts on them, let alone some more expensive currency. If you are in trade league, you must consider very hard whether to spend any currency other than lower level ones on items. Nearly good items can be slammed by Exalt or two or maybe use Chaos orbs in hopes to hit jackpot. However, if you would spend few moments checking what you can get for that 2 Exalts on trade, you realize how much of a waste of currency such attempts are.

PoE and PoE2 economy is based on GGG's view that trading is crucial and core part of their game. This would be fine if they would spend some resources and effort to make trading reasonable experience but they only did the bare minimum. PoE2 at least introduced in-game currency trading, which is great tool as it reduces amount of scams and time needed to do any currency trading via website and player interaction. This would hopefully evolve into fully automated item trading in-game one day.

So yes, gear acquisition is absolutely atrocious in PoE2 but it was always atrocious even in PoE1, nothing has really changed.

Finally someone that gets it. Thank you.

Super annoying having to deal with fanboys who refuse to acknowledge any of the major problems

[Fluffy Newfoundland]

Originally posted by niaerniopawrjnko:

Originally posted by Baron01:

Are you really just clueless or talking out of your ass?

I'm almost level 95, spent most of my time in Atlas running 80+ (now at 104) rarity. I have ONE gear piece on me that I have found myself everything else was bought from other players. The one piece of gear I found is Hand of Wisdom and Action, a lucky find from my 2nd kill of a breach boss. Lucky drop, actually good for my build.

It is not that you do not find rares, those rares are just badly rolled or "nearly" good. Problem is that "nearly" good items often does not even warrant spending Exalts on them, let alone some more expensive currency. If you are in trade league, you must consider very hard whether to spend any currency other than lower level ones on items. Nearly good items can be slammed by Exalt or two or maybe use Chaos orbs in hopes to hit jackpot. However, if you would spend few moments checking what you can get for that 2 Exalts on trade, you realize how much of a waste of currency such attempts are.

PoE and PoE2 economy is based on GGG's view that trading is crucial and core part of their game. This would be fine if they would spend some resources and effort to make trading reasonable experience but they only did the bare minimum. PoE2 at least introduced in-game currency trading, which is great tool as it reduces amount of scams and time needed to do any currency trading via website and player interaction. This would hopefully evolve into fully automated item trading in-game one day.

So yes, gear acquisition is absolutely atrocious in PoE2 but it was always atrocious even in PoE1, nothing has really changed.

Finally someone that gets it. Thank you.

Super annoying having to deal with fanboys who refuse to acknowledge any of the major problems

"Fanboy" Aka anyone that disagree with me while i do straw man fallacy and don't even try to engage in a constructive exchange. Derp di derp OP.

[Fluffy Bunny of Despair]

Originally posted by niaerniopawrjnko:

Finally someone that gets it. Thank you.

Super annoying having to deal with fanboys who refuse to acknowledge any of the major problems

It's really funny how a different point of view is always being ridiculed by being a fanboy. Because its completly impossible that someone maybe just likes a different approach to a game. Or could have fun were you do not.

You are so close minded that you can't even have a normal conversation with anyone that is objecting your viewpoint besides "You are blocked" xD

[Baron01]

Originally posted by Fluffy Newfoundland:

Originally posted by niaerniopawrjnko:

Finally someone that gets it. Thank you.

Super annoying having to deal with fanboys who refuse to acknowledge any of the major problems

"Fanboy" Aka anyone that disagree with me while i do straw man fallacy and don't even try to engage in a constructive exchange. Derp di derp OP.

I'm pretty sure I would be called "fanboy" if hours spent in the game would be a factor. I have over 8000 hours in PoE1 and will add many more hundreds in PoE2 I'm sure. However, I have a love/hate relationship with the game--I love ARPGs and PoE1 and 2 are one of the best games of the genre, I hate the fact the game is forcing me to trade and at times feel like it does not value my time I spend playing it.

Now, explain how straw man fallacy argument is actually playing any role in what OP or my post stated.

[Fluffy Newfoundland]

Originally posted by Baron01:

Originally posted by Fluffy Newfoundland:

"Fanboy" Aka anyone that disagree with me while i do straw man fallacy and don't even try to engage in a constructive exchange. Derp di derp OP.

I'm pretty sure I would be called "fanboy" if hours spent in the game would be a factor. I have over 8000 hours in PoE1 and will add many more hundreds in PoE2 I'm sure. However, I have a love/hate relationship with the game--I love ARPGs and PoE1 and 2 are one of the best games of the genre, I hate the fact the game is forcing me to trade and at times feel like it does not value my time I spend playing it.

Now, explain how straw man fallacy argument is actually playing any role in what OP or my post stated.

Not you ? On the previous 3 pages of OP answering to anything disagreeing with his opinion and trying to have a constructive exchange.

Both side here have valuable opinion, is just OP want to ignore anyone that disagree with his and just answer "Lying, blocked"

[Dregora]

Originally posted by niaerniopawrjnko:

Originally posted by Dwane Dibbley:

PoE1: "crafting is too hard/complex, im too lazy to learn it"

Same folks in PoE2: "i cant craft anything"


Just play SSF. Or learn to craft-gamble, crafting is much eadier than PoE1 crafting, but also more RNG.

PoE 2 does not have crafting. SSF is a huge waste of time since the entire game is balanced around trade. Youre basically just handicapping yourself for no good reason, this mode is meant for people living on welfare

I'm not sure what you mean with it's balanced around trade? It's obvious trade makes things easier since you can target find what you're looking for and get it, which is easier than to play the game and wait for it to drop or for you to get lucky through the crafting or whatever systems.

That being said, a lot of this just feels like you're too impatient to grind for it yourself since you know of a faster route to get what you want, thus feeling the reward of grinding isn't enough to satisfy your instant gratification feeling.

I don't disagree that trading is an annoying feature, but I also disagree it's balanced around it.

[Baron01]

Originally posted by Dregora:

I'm not sure what you mean with it's balanced around trade? It's obvious trade makes things easier since you can target find what you're looking for and get it, which is easier than to play the game and wait for it to drop or for you to get lucky through the crafting or whatever systems.

That being said, a lot of this just feels like you're too impatient to grind for it yourself since you know of a faster route to get what you want, thus feeling the reward of grinding isn't enough to satisfy your instant gratification feeling.

I don't disagree that trading is an annoying feature, but I also disagree it's balanced around it.

GGG has stated multiple times that trading is a core mechanic in their games. This means drop rates, stat weighting and how items can be rolled are all tuned in a way to account for a fact that people with currency can buy their items and assuming thousands and thousands of people are playing their game, finding items and posting them up for sale. This means your chance to find item that is useful to you and it is also better than what you already have is rather small.

You might literally spend hundreds of hours grinding the game and never find upgrade for you. You might find many Exalts, Divines or gear to sell to other players but not for you. This is caused by the fact the game has no restrictions on what can drop for whom and very few limits what stats can appear on an item. Do you not love the fact you can get massive increased physical damage % roll on a Cultist bow that deals zero physical damage? Reality of PoE1 and PoE2 in a nutshell.

[niaerniopawrjnko]

Originally posted by Dregora:

Originally posted by niaerniopawrjnko:

PoE 2 does not have crafting. SSF is a huge waste of time since the entire game is balanced around trade. Youre basically just handicapping yourself for no good reason, this mode is meant for people living on welfare

I'm not sure what you mean with it's balanced around trade? It's obvious trade makes things easier since you can target find what you're looking for and get it, which is easier than to play the game and wait for it to drop or for you to get lucky through the crafting or whatever systems.

That being said, a lot of this just feels like you're too impatient to grind for it yourself since you know of a faster route to get what you want, thus feeling the reward of grinding isn't enough to satisfy your instant gratification feeling.

I don't disagree that trading is an annoying feature, but I also disagree it's balanced around it.

Lets put it this way, GGG ruined harvest, one of the most loved mechanics just because it finally gave players a way to progress without completely relying on RNG or trade

[Fluffy Bunny of Despair]

Originally posted by Dregora:

Originally posted by niaerniopawrjnko:

PoE 2 does not have crafting. SSF is a huge waste of time since the entire game is balanced around trade. Youre basically just handicapping yourself for no good reason, this mode is meant for people living on welfare

I'm not sure what you mean with it's balanced around trade? It's obvious trade makes things easier since you can target find what you're looking for and get it, which is easier than to play the game and wait for it to drop or for you to get lucky through the crafting or whatever systems.

That being said, a lot of this just feels like you're too impatient to grind for it yourself since you know of a faster route to get what you want, thus feeling the reward of grinding isn't enough to satisfy your instant gratification feeling.

I don't disagree that trading is an annoying feature, but I also disagree it's balanced around it.

But the game is balanced around that. They have said so multiple times.
Trading is always a factor.

Now that doesn't mean SSF is impossible tho.

[Fluffy Bunny of Despair]

Originally posted by niaerniopawrjnko:

Lets put it this way, GGG ruined harvest, one of the most loved mechanics just because it finally gave players a way to progress without completely relying on RNG or trade

Lets put it this way, GGG ruined harvest, one of the most loved mechanics just because it finally gave players a way to progress without completely relying on RNG or trade [/quote]

Yeah right ... because harvest league was fun <.< everyone ran arround with mirror tier items for a few divines. Only thing worse than that was Graveyard league. You could literally create items that were impossible before.

Most beloved my ass.

[Baron01]

I actually enjoyed Harvest once GGG fixed the gardening part. Sure, power creep was massive but it only lasted for one league. I even liked the later iteration where Harvest crafting potential was massively reduced as it was still good tool to finish your item with some stats you needed rather than completely rely on RNG.

Main issue with Harvest was really its power creep and impact on game balance rather than its impact on economy as the equilibrium just moves with the available gear. GGG just could not properly balance the increase in player power against the game.

[Demolition]

Originally posted by Wutever:

Originally posted by niaerniopawrjnko:

Seems like you failed to understand the post, try again buddy

I understood it just fine. You want exponential upgrades for your exact build to drop from the sky constantly and a fast-track to the late endgame build you read about in a guide, but don't want to put in the hours necessary to get there. So you just grind currency and trade it for scraps instead of trying to figure out how to progress in the game. You're in a hell of your own making.

I'll ask again - if the loot is so bad, where does all the loot you buy come from? Sure, there is exploited gear, but the majority stuff going for less than a Divine is not it.

If you play SSF you roll on everything that looks half-decent. If you play Trade you sell good gear that drops if it doesn't work for you and buy what you need. Those are the intended gameplay loops as you progress into more difficult content that enables you to get more valuable gear.

Now you are exaggerating for the sake of it man. :) He has a point. And i don't think he asks for exponentially better drops for his build all the time.

The thing with drops is this: only half of the classes and weapons are released, and we barely find upgrades after a point. Got 2 characters to 90+ and one is close, and i very very rarely find stuff that i actually want to use. I found plenty for others, so i sell the gear, but the fact remains. The odds of you getting good loot are fairly low, and that's a bit worrying, especially because of the above statement. Only half of the game is out. Imagine when everything is released, the odds will go down drastically.

We'll see. I enjoy the game a lot anyway, but the man has a valid point, and you guys try to invalidate what he's saying for no reason..

[Dwane Dibbley]

Originally posted by Demolition:

Originally posted by Wutever:

I understood it just fine. You want exponential upgrades for your exact build to drop from the sky constantly and a fast-track to the late endgame build you read about in a guide, but don't want to put in the hours necessary to get there. So you just grind currency and trade it for scraps instead of trying to figure out how to progress in the game. You're in a hell of your own making.

I'll ask again - if the loot is so bad, where does all the loot you buy come from? Sure, there is exploited gear, but the majority stuff going for less than a Divine is not it.

If you play SSF you roll on everything that looks half-decent. If you play Trade you sell good gear that drops if it doesn't work for you and buy what you need. Those are the intended gameplay loops as you progress into more difficult content that enables you to get more valuable gear.

Now you are exaggerating for the sake of it man. :) He has a point. And i don't think he asks for exponentially better drops for his build all the time.

The thing with drops is this: only half of the classes and weapons are released, and we barely find upgrades after a point. Got 2 characters to 90+ and one is close, and i very very rarely find stuff that i actually want to use. I found plenty for others, so i sell the gear, but the fact remains. The odds of you getting good loot are fairly low, and that's a bit worrying, especially because of the above statement. Only half of the game is out. Imagine when everything is released, the odds will go down drastically.

We'll see. I enjoy the game a lot anyway, but the man has a valid point, and you guys try to invalidate what he's saying for no reason..

Thats great if you find upgrades. I dont find upgrades since campaign. Its all about finding bases, ID them, throw away 95% of crappy one, slamming reg/ex on the rest, throw 99,9% away. And use or sell the lucky crafts.

So if you just find upgrades, you should be happy. And if you rely purely on drops, you might think again if your pov is valid.