Mad Wolf fight is Silly. Edit: is Fine

[TKaal]

The mob rush part was a bad design choice.

Work can be fun, but when you suck the fun out all we're left with is work.

This would not be an issue if some flexibility was available for my setup. Most might not need much change, however, I'm in the boat with the people that would have to make many.

Having to adapt is one thing, but killing the fun by forcing people to spend so much time and gold on chore-like activities just to have to go back and undo them is Silly.
If someone gets to the boss with a build, they should not have to change most of their build just for one section of one fight. But, here we are... looking at an hour or more of figuring out something I didn't want to play so I can get past this.

You've created a situation where someone is not really looking forward to the next game session because of the design.

Shouldn't the design take this kind of scenario into account?

Edit: Turns out I had a misunderstanding of what will or will not damage us. And, so, we learn...

[Snark]

the mobs rush you so you can kill them and recharge your flasks

[Elgareth]

I believe any build can do the Mad Wolf fight, so what are you talking about specifically?
I done him with Merc, Sorc, Witch, Monk by now, and the minion phase is the least of the problems usually for me.

[Tha_T1p]

I dont think its bad design tbh. The first time I got wrecked I kind of felt like that, but over time Ive come to love the fight. This fight was kind of difficult the first time I did it, mostly because I had like 6% cold res, I went back with 35% or so and beat it the next try. I got there on my Sorc and it was a chore, but I got through it with only 2 attempts. I just beat it on my Ranger and it was the easiest yet, first try, first build I haven't followed any info or guide on too. Sure some builds will struggle, but based on how drastically different all 3 of my builds have been so far I dont see THAT much change being needed to complete it. I could see a Titan struggling pretty hard, especially if they aren't very good at dodge roll timing and direction.

[simon]

Just incase you don't know he stops talking when he is going to charge you. Being aware of that makes this stage of the fight much easier

[Lucent]

Originally posted by Elgareth:

I believe any build can do the Mad Wolf fight, so what are you talking about specifically?
I done him with Merc, Sorc, Witch, Monk by now, and the minion phase is the least of the problems usually for me.

I agree, I also think Geonor can be done on pretty much ANY build. Some fights might be slower since early game gear varies on rng and then the chosen skills playing heavily into how fast/slow the fight is.

Merc was my first time dealing with him and thus was the 'hardest' round of combat since I had to learn his move set and the dodge mechanics of the game, Warrior I just face tanked him, Monk I bing bong'ed him to death, Sorceress was interesting as I feel my chosen skills weren't well suited to the fight. (Ember Fusilade + Flame wall + SRS)

Witch I didn't want to run through the manor ramparts, got bored and hopped in a pub lobby and let my army of minions eat him alive while being the ONLY one who could apparently dodge any of the extremely telegraphed attacks.

[Xylion]

Originally posted by TKaal:

Shouldn't the design take this kind of scenario into account?

Of course. But did you take into account that your personal preference might not reflect the
preferences of others?
Honestly, not only is that part pretty easy to deal with, regardless of the build you're going for (if you were able to get to that point, dealing with that amount of mobs shouldn't be a problem at all), but it offers an opportunity to recharge your flasks too.

[ToxiiTea]

the ragdoll jank is so unfun

[Kexin]

Originally posted by TKaal:

The mob rush part was a bad design choice.

Work can be fun, but when you suck the fun out all we're left with is work.

This would not be an issue if some flexibility was available for my setup. Most might not need much change, however, I'm in the boat with the people that would have to make many.

Having to adapt is one thing, but killing the fun by forcing people to spend so much time and gold on chore-like activities just to have to go back and undo them is Silly.
If someone gets to the boss with a build, they should not have to change most of their build just for one section of one fight. But, here we are... looking at an hour or more of figuring out something I didn't want to play so I can get past this.

You've created a situation where someone is not really looking forward to the next game session because of the design.

Shouldn't the design take this kind of scenario into account?

Quit now if you think this boss is bad game design. He's the first boss, because he's easy for all build setups. Having some Dark Souls or Elden Ring experience is invaluable here.

[Ezekiel Rage]

You díd the mistake of trying to have fun.
This game don't allow fun, you can't go and make your own build.
No, no, no you need to online and pick a build and then follow those instruction exactly or you will be borked.
This game has massive amounts of different loot and a skill tree larger than the tree outside your home.
But you can only pick one specific set of gear and you have to follow the exact same path on the skilltree as everyone else.
It's called freedom of choice by GGG.
So go start a new character and do exactly as the build-guide says.

[Lucent]

Originally posted by Ezekiel Rage:

You díd the mistake of trying to have fun.
This game don't allow fun, you can't go and make your own build.
No, no, no you need to online and pick a build and then follow those instruction exactly or you will be borked.
This game has massive amounts of different loot and a skill tree larger than the tree outside your home.
But you can only pick one specific set of gear and you have to follow the exact same path on the skilltree as everyone else.
It's called freedom of choice by GGG.
So go start a new character and do exactly as the build-guide says.

Just because you can't make a build that works, does not mean everyone else can't.

Most people in this game can't or don't want to think hard enough to make their own build. That's fine.
But the campaign is the easiest part and if you can't get past that, you're suffering serious skill issues.

[TKaal]

Originally posted by Snark:

the mobs rush you so you can kill them and recharge your flasks

I use zero flask charges before this point of the fight.

[TKaal]

Originally posted by Elgareth:

I believe any build can do the Mad Wolf fight, so what are you talking about specifically?
I done him with Merc, Sorc, Witch, Monk by now, and the minion phase is the least of the problems usually for me.

I am going for a poison hex monk. Poison bow with chaos spells.

[TKaal]

Originally posted by Xylion:

Of course. But did you take into account that your personal preference might not reflect the
preferences of others?

Of course I know this. I made sure to mention others' paths compared to cover this.
And I use zero flasks until this point of the fight.

[TKaal]

Originally posted by Kexin:

Quit now if you think this boss is bad game design. He's the first boss, because he's easy for all build setups. Having some Dark Souls or Elden Ring experience is invaluable here.

Nope.
I'll be the one deciding when this "quit" thing happens.
To assume I haven't played or beaten both Dark Souls and Elden Ring is a mistake.
You misunderstood my point.

[TKaal]

Originally posted by Ezekiel Rage:

You díd the mistake of trying to have fun.
This game don't allow fun, you can't go and make your own build.
No, no, no you need to online and pick a build and then follow those instruction exactly or you will be borked.
This game has massive amounts of different loot and a skill tree larger than the tree outside your home.
But you can only pick one specific set of gear and you have to follow the exact same path on the skilltree as everyone else.
It's called freedom of choice by GGG.
So go start a new character and do exactly as the build-guide says.

Pardon, but I disagree with this in general.