How does Ignite work?

[Space Cowboy]

Let's say I want to blow up a poison cloud (from Gas arrow) with my poisonburst arrow instead of detonating arrow (reason doesn't matter right now). I put Ignition in it which gives me 100% more chance to ignite. For me that sounds like a 100% chance to ignite, so every time. However it does not ignite enemies every time
Why?

[Anarch]

Ignition isn't going to do anything on a power that can't already ignite. It's not a 100% chance to ignite. It's 100% MORE chance to ignite.

EDIT: IF you have a 5% chance to ignite, Ignition will make it 10%. If you have 0%, Ignition will make it 0%.

[Space Cowboy]

Originally posted by Anarch:

Ignition isn't going to do anything on a power that can't already ignite. It's not a 100% chance to ignite. It's 100% MORE chance to ignite.

EDIT: IF you have a 5% chance to ignite, Ignition will make it 10%. If you have 0%, Ignition will make it 0%.

Okay, does ignition have to be on a weapon? Or can it be in the passive skill tree as well? I do have a weapon that has added fire damage.

Edit: Or in other words - how do I get the base chance to ignite something? Wouldn't that be any sort of fire damage?

[Anarch]

Originally posted by Space Cowboy:

Okay, does ignition have to be on a weapon? Or can it be in the passive skill tree as well? I do have a weapon that has added fire damage.

The best way to perhaps tell is to inspect the skill gem in question to see if fire damage will occur when using it, whether from a weapon or not. The base chance to ignite is 1% (I think) and you still have to do enough damage on the attack to beat the enemy's ailment threshold. So, harder hitting attacks are more likely to ignite than smaller hitting attacks.

If you have a chance to ignite from a passive, it probably says something like "x% chance to ignite," which will not result in an ignite on its own unless the skill in question can ignite at all, and whether it is hitting hard enough to overcome the target threshold.

[Space Cowboy]

Originally posted by Anarch:

Originally posted by Space Cowboy:

Okay, does ignition have to be on a weapon? Or can it be in the passive skill tree as well? I do have a weapon that has added fire damage.

The best way to perhaps tell is to inspect the skill gem in question to see if fire damage will occur when using it, whether from a weapon or not. The base chance to ignite is 1% (I think) and you still have to do enough damage on the attack to beat the enemy's ailment threshold. So, harder hitting attacks are more likely to ignite than smaller hitting attacks.

If you have a chance to ignite from a passive, it probably says something like "x% chance to ignite," which will not result in an ignite on its own unless the skill in question can ignite at all, and whether it is hitting hard enough to overcome the target threshold.

It only says that "Fire hits have a chance to ignite based on how much fire damage is dealt". Doesn't say how much of a chance. Seeing how often I ignite even with ignition I think it's less than 1% base - cause I have an overall 130% increased chance to ignite with that skill.

[Space Cowboy]

So, now I put Ignition (+100 chance to ignite) and Fire Infusion (attacks gain +25% damage as fire damage) on Toxic Growth. It works reasonable well with most but not all pustle explosions proccing ignite which I can then blow up with a Gas Arrow. I would say I got an at least above 50% chance to ignite, now. Maybe 60 or 70? It is pretty ridiculous overall and very effective but I'd still prefer to understand what's going on exactly.
I'd love to see proccing chances ingame.

[Anarch]

Originally posted by Space Cowboy:

I'd love to see proccing chances ingame.

I had to go look to be sure, but ignite reads:

>Fire damage from Hits contributes to both the chance to ignite and the magnitude of Ignite, so hits dealing more Fire damage Ignite more often, and inflict stronger ignites. By default, a Hit has 1% chance to Ignite for every 4% of the target's Ailment Threshold dealt.

Because mobs have varied elemental ailment thresholds, it's probably not possible to show proc chances, or at least better than a generalized estimate. Maybe there's a way to calculate it from the estimated ignite damage listed for a skill.

[Space Cowboy]

Originally posted by Anarch:

Originally posted by Space Cowboy:

I'd love to see proccing chances ingame.

I had to go look to be sure, but ignite reads:

>Fire damage from Hits contributes to both the chance to ignite and the magnitude of Ignite, so hits dealing more Fire damage Ignite more often, and inflict stronger ignites. By default, a Hit has 1% chance to Ignite for every 4% of the target's Ailment Threshold dealt.

Because mobs have varied elemental ailment thresholds, it's probably not possible to show proc chances, or at least better than a generalized estimate. Maybe there's a way to calculate it from the estimated ignite damage listed for a skill.

Hmm, yeah, at least an average would be kinda nice to finetune the thing.

Right now I've added +30% Chance to ignite from my passive skill tree and currently the only way of knowing if I even need this or if I could put the points somewhere else, would be trial and error.

[Anarch]

Originally posted by Space Cowboy:

Right now I've added +30% Chance to ignite from my passive skill tree and currently the only way of knowing if I even need this or if I could put the points somewhere else, would be trial and error.

Well, that probably makes it easier to ignite rares and bosses who might otherwise be difficult to inflict, while possibly not making much difference for the regular and magic mobs you encounter. So, probably worth it still for those occasions if you're depending on those ignites.

[Space Cowboy]

Originally posted by Anarch:

Originally posted by Space Cowboy:

Right now I've added +30% Chance to ignite from my passive skill tree and currently the only way of knowing if I even need this or if I could put the points somewhere else, would be trial and error.

Well, that probably makes it easier to ignite rares and bosses who might otherwise be difficult to inflict, while possibly not making much difference for the regular and magic mobs you encounter. So, probably worth it still for those occasions if you're depending on those ignites.

True! I'll leave it like that for now.
It turned out to be a really nice combo, btw, especially considering that I just scrounged up enough passive skill points and gear to make it work at LVL 34.

I first shoot a Gas Arrow followed by Toxic Growth, the poison cloud then triggers the toxic pustules, which makes them explode which proccs ignite, which explodes the Toxic cloud.

Survivability and damage all great, significantly better than on my first playthough with my lightning sorceress which was no slouch either. I just have to work on mana regen a little bit but it's gonna be fine eventually. I think this one might have potential.

Edit: Oh, and it's really nice on mobs as well as single rares and bosses. On mobs you basically double explode them mostly in one or two rounds of that combo and on bosses/rares, you can trigger an explosion multiple times with gas arrows for massive damage once you got them ignited which has been pretty easy so far.

[qsnoopyjr]

Originally posted by Space Cowboy:

Let's say I want to blow up a poison cloud (from Gas arrow) with my poisonburst arrow instead of detonating arrow (reason doesn't matter right now). I put Ignition in it which gives me 100% more chance to ignite. For me that sounds like a 100% chance to ignite, so every time. However it does not ignite enemies every time
Why?

My take on ignite?

Worthless

You gotta do two attacks? Thats not optimal.
Especially when mobs die 1 or 2 hits by using a good build, why would you want something to be ignited? Just switch to 1 or 2 hit good build.

I really don't see a point, I squash T13 nameds in like 6 hits, under 10 seconds. Big bosses in like 20 seconds or less. No point in ignite.

If mobs had more health, didn't get deleted in 1 or 2 hits, and it would be like 10 hits, I can see ignite being useful. But why make a build where you gotta do a combo, when you can just use a build where you delete things in 1 or 2 hits?

Game got a balance issue I think.

It's like armor break, why break armor? mobs can die in 1 or 2 hits, why stress breaking armor. Boss mobs under 10 seconds I dont even need to consider breaking armor or anything else.

I don't really recommend making mobs beefier either. Because you got people who use good build vs not good build.
You look at the feedback, "mobs are sponges", if they increase the health so good build players don't delete mobs in 1 or 2 hits, and now like 6 hits. Those bad build players, these mobs feeling more spongy, its not enjoyable, like 12 hits or so for them. Trash mobs.

What I would suggest is mobs are capped at how much hp loss they can take every 3 seconds so, say 40% cap of hp loss for every 3 seconds, means everyone got to deal with mechanics and those other special ways of fighting can be considered as well. Maybe armor break makes it 75% hp loss possible every 3 seconds.

See when mobs are sponges, it means they get to do mechanics on you. Now skill issue arises
When mobs die instantly, they don't do any mechanic on you. No skill issue needed

Balance issue.

[Space Cowboy]

Originally posted by qsnoopyjr:

Originally posted by Space Cowboy:

Let's say I want to blow up a poison cloud (from Gas arrow) with my poisonburst arrow instead of detonating arrow (reason doesn't matter right now). I put Ignition in it which gives me 100% more chance to ignite. For me that sounds like a 100% chance to ignite, so every time. However it does not ignite enemies every time
Why?

My take on ignite?

Worthless

You gotta do two attacks? Thats not optimal.
Especially when mobs die 1 or 2 hits by using a good build, why would you want something to be ignited? Just switch to 1 or 2 hit good build.

I really don't see a point, I squash T13 nameds in like 6 hits, under 10 seconds. Big bosses in like 20 seconds or less. No point in ignite.

If mobs had more health, didn't get deleted in 1 or 2 hits, and it would be like 10 hits, I can see ignite being useful. But why make a build where you gotta do a combo, when you can just use a build where you delete things in 1 or 2 hits?

Game got a balance issue I think.

It's like armor break, why break armor? mobs can die in 1 or 2 hits, why stress breaking armor. Boss mobs under 10 seconds I dont even need to consider breaking armor or anything else.

I don't really recommend making mobs beefier either. Because you got people who use good build vs not good build.
You look at the feedback, "mobs are sponges", if they increase the health so good build players don't delete mobs in 1 or 2 hits, and now like 6 hits. Those bad build players, these mobs feeling more spongy, its not enjoyable, like 12 hits or so for them. Trash mobs.

What I would suggest is mobs are capped at how much hp loss they can take every 3 seconds so, say 40% cap of hp loss for every 3 seconds, means everyone got to deal with mechanics and those other special ways of fighting can be considered as well. Maybe armor break makes it 75% hp loss possible every 3 seconds.

See when mobs are sponges, it means they get to do mechanics on you. Now skill issue arises
When mobs die instantly, they don't do any mechanic on you. No skill issue needed

Balance issue.

Well, the current version of my build is a 2 hit combo.