How did D4 fall off so badly...

[Critical]

Looking at Diablo 4 it's actually insane that the game turned out the way it did. Blizzard has many years of experience with arpgs and have mountains of cash to throw at the game and yet it launched with an absolutely abysmal end game along with many other game design problems...

How is it possible that POE 2 is gonna have far more content and a better progression system in EARLY ACCESS than D4 and the expansion combined? Not to mention POE 2 will be free to play on release.

If this doesn't show corporate greed and a lack of passion for their game development I don't know what will...

[Xaelon]

The thing is that Blizzard is not really Blizzard anymore. The people who created D2 have not been at the company for years.

PoE meanwhile is pretty much a spiritual successor to D2. So if you're looking for a game like D2, you're naturally going to like PoE more than D4.

I enjoyed D4. The story and open world aspects were fun but the itemization at launch was just SO shallow. I lost interest after hitting 80+ on one character because there was literally a single build that worked with the uniques I had access to.

I don't think D4 is a bad game, but they were definately afraid of making the game too complicated because that would have scared off the more casual players.

GGG on the other hand is the polar opposite. I have no interest in playing PoE again because the game is just feature creep incarnate. It just has too many systems at this point even if a lot of them are very cool.

I am really hoping POE2 will hit the sweet spot between the two. PLEASE give me PoE's depth without the need to constantly reference build guides and other external resources.

[Chiryuu]

It didnt fall off?

[wulfster42]

D3 was so bad at launch, but worse, it was my biggest game dissapointment in my life (yes even over FFX-2). There was no game I was more hyped for than D3, I loved D2 so much and finally, finally after so much time, a New Diablo game!!

The first Diablo game was great, but the second was a masterpiece that transcended previous games like it by huge amounts. D3 made my cry and I doubt I can ever be as dissapointed in a game as I was by it. That being said, I played through every class into endgame in D3, I got the expansion packs and played Pally and Necro. I still got hundreds of hours of fun out of D3.

D4 I finished the main game with Necromancer only, I went back multiple times and tried to play as druid (my favorite class usually) and just was bored to tears. I tried the free expansion trial and still couldn't enjoy myself at all, and gave up. I went back and played Path of Diablo 2 for awhile and then PoE. D4 was just NOT FUn to me at all.

So as to how it fell off so quick, what I want to know is how anyone even enjoyed it at all initially. I would rather play D3 again than D4, and D2 over either of them.

PoE 2 has the distinction of being the first game I am hyped enough about to make it compete with D3 for most dissapointing game ever. I can already see from videos etc though that I won't be dissapointed and I can't wait to play it.

PoE 1 which I spent somewhere around 50-60$ total over the years on, is one of the most, if not the most cost effective games I have played and enjoyed, with thousands of hours of fun. I just spent $30 on PoE 2 and I have absolutely no doubt that it'll be worth it and more.

I wish I could have returned D4.

D3..........I eventually def got my money out of, even including the expansions. I stopped playing initially because of auction house etc, but when I cam eback later alot had been fixed and the game was fun if taken by itself. It wasn't a sequel to D2, it never compared to D2, but I could enjoy it.

D4 was a straight up waste of my money. Wish I had put it into PoE instead.

[Critical]

Originally posted by Xaelon:

The thing is that Blizzard is not really Blizzard anymore. The people who created D2 have not been at the company for years.

PoE meanwhile is pretty much a spiritual successor to D2. So if you're looking for a game like D2, you're naturally going to like PoE more than D4.

I enjoyed D4. The story and open world aspects were fun but the itemization at launch was just SO shallow. I lost interest after hitting 80+ on one character because there was literally a single build that worked with the uniques I had access to.

I don't think D4 is a bad game, but they were definately afraid of making the game too complicated because that would have scared off the more casual players.

GGG on the other hand is the polar opposite. I have no interest in playing PoE again because the game is just feature creep incarnate. It just has too many systems at this point even if a lot of them are very cool.

I am really hoping POE2 will hit the sweet spot between the two. PLEASE give me PoE's depth without the need to constantly reference build guides and other external resources.

I agree with all of this. I actually liked D4 up until about level 80 when I found out there was really nothing to do at end game. I enjoyed my time but it really couldn't hold my attention, especially when I saw how trash the "seasons" were - it's a joke.

[Dester]

Diablo 3 was the beginning of bad design... with the narrow linear paths.
Diablo -Immortal and Diablo 4 were purely designed for taking as much money as possible from the fans. And it worked... many millions blindly gave away 3 digits or more on these games simply because millions were mindless fan boys.

Path of Exile 2... will result with many people who spent money on Diablo 4 and Diablo - Immortal ... will realize they were tricked out of money and feel embarrassed or ashamed. Some will be in denial and do mental gymnastics to justify the loss of their money on Diablo 4 and Diablo - Immortal .

[Critical]

Originally posted by wulfster42:

D3 was so bad at launch, but worse, it was my biggest game dissapointment in my life (yes even over FFX-2). There was no game I was more hyped for than D3, I loved D2 so much and finally, finally after so much time, a New Diablo game!!

The first Diablo game was great, but the second was a masterpiece that transcended previous games like it by huge amounts. D3 made my cry and I doubt I can ever be as dissapointed in a game as I was by it. That being said, I played through every class into endgame in D3, I got the expansion packs and played Pally and Necro. I still got hundreds of hours of fun out of D3.

D4 I finished the main game with Necromancer only, I went back multiple times and tried to play as druid (my favorite class usually) and just was bored to tears. I tried the free expansion trial and still couldn't enjoy myself at all, and gave up. I went back and played Path of Diablo 2 for awhile and then PoE. D4 was just NOT FUn to me at all.

So as to how it fell off so quick, what I want to know is how anyone even enjoyed it at all initially. I would rather play D3 again than D4, and D2 over either of them.

PoE 2 has the distinction of being the first game I am hyped enough about to make it compete with D3 for most dissapointing game ever. I can already see from videos etc though that I won't be dissapointed and I can't wait to play it.

PoE 1 which I spent somewhere around 50-60$ total over the years on, is one of the most, if not the most cost effective games I have played and enjoyed, with thousands of hours of fun. I just spent $30 on PoE 2 and I have absolutely no doubt that it'll be worth it and more.

I wish I could have returned D4.

D3..........I eventually def got my money out of, even including the expansions. I stopped playing initially because of auction house etc, but when I cam eback later alot had been fixed and the game was fun if taken by itself. It wasn't a sequel to D2, it never compared to D2, but I could enjoy it.

D4 was a straight up waste of my money. Wish I had put it into PoE instead.

It just seems like blizzard is taking a step back with each new release of Diablo at this point. You almost wouldn't believe they were the guys responsible for D2 judging from how D3 & D4 ran.

[Sparzy]

Fair enough people wanted D4 to be bigger but blizzard just made it too insanely big, most of the dungeons are the same and it just became boring to play. Let alone finding someone else to play with.

I have to admit i enjoy playing Diablo Immortal more than any of the others now.

[FireShark]

Let’s be real, there’s more Diablo 2 fans working at GGG than Blizzard these days.

[Chiryuu]

Originally posted by FireShark:

Let’s be real, there’s more Diablo 2 fans working at GGG than Blizzard these days.

Are there? How do you know?

[XENOZ]

I played every season of Diablo 4 and I like the game. I had a blast playing Vessel of Hatred for about 2 weeks, then I realised the game still need some deepness.. improvement. I managed to get paragon 300 on my spiritborn, but the lack of activities, end-game loots, and what not is still on the table. Also, Blizzard is not working on the server lag issues, server crash, game client crash.. it's been worse this season. Even people can't play the actual PTR because of that.

[Gesäßhusten]

There difference is , if the designers play the own game or not.
And Blizzard only care about the ingame shop is running and not about the bugs.

[Steel]

The Diablo 4 team had no experience developing ARPGs at all, they released a mess with no clear vision and then let the community develop the game for them by literally doing a 180 on everything and eventually turning the game into D3.5. They embraced power creep to the point only their latest expansion class is even playable in high end content, their seasons are also nothing else except power creep and borrowed power.

D2 devs are gone, the D3 devs who saved the game with Reaper of Souls are gone, what's left of the skeleton crew that kept D3 alive is probably helping with seasonal content on D4 now but that's not enough for a game, they need proper direction from visionary leadership and Rod Fergusson is not it.

[LegacyXI]

Originally posted by Critical:

If this doesn't show corporate greed and a lack of passion for their game development I don't know what will...

Are you serious? You can't be serious. Corporate greed? Have you seen the MTX shop for Path of Exile or the supporter packs they sell? And you seriously think it is Diablo 4 that is the problem.

Path of exile literally sells storage space for up to $15, armor packs for $84 (at a $24 discount) and supporter packs for up to $480. They even had gacha boxes that you could buy that would roll duplicates that you could do literally nothing with.

But go ahead and tell everyone Diablo 4 is the problem.

[Critical]

Originally posted by LegacyXI:

Originally posted by Critical:

If this doesn't show corporate greed and a lack of passion for their game development I don't know what will...

Are you serious? You can't be serious. Corporate greed? Have you seen the MTX shop for Path of Exile or the supporter packs they sell? And you seriously think it is Diablo 4 that is the problem.

Path of exile literally sells storage space for up to $15, armor packs for $84 (at a $24 discount) and supporter packs for up to $480. They even had gacha boxes that you could buy that would roll duplicates that you could do literally nothing with.

But go ahead and tell everyone Diablo 4 is the problem. :winter2019joyfultearsyul:

brother the game is literally free on release and they do huge content updates for free. To even complain about MTX being at a higher price and having to buy stash tabs is ridiculous. Atleast the actual armour you drop in the game also looks good unlike in D4 where they make anything you don't pay money for look like trash.

[CharanKo]

GGG is a game developer. Blizzard on the other hand became a game product manufacturer like any other AAA game studio recently that only cares about profit and how to keep investors statisfied. Also, every time Blizzard comes up with something it's like they didn't have 20-30 years of experience in the same game genre, same thing with WoW. They reintroduce the same mechanics and don't add smth from previous games from the start just to implement it the same way from the ground up to keep the $$$ coming. IMO that's all because good developers don't like to waste time in companies like this and that's why every game\addon releease is completly different experience that doesn't take in any consideration previous titles. Also Blizzard doesn't innovate at all.