Why Giving Players Full Control Over Difficulty Levels Could Be a Mistake

[Roumata]

With this patch, it is now possible to start in normal mode, move to easy when you're struggling, AND go back to normal whenever you want. Initially, if you decided to start in normal mode and later wanted to switch to easy, it was possible, BUT you couldn't go back to normal.

This "BUT" is a significant change. Why? Because this is what gives soul-like games their essence. The challenge of facing tough bosses, restarting multiple times, and feeling on the brink of defeat is what makes these games unique. By allowing players to switch their difficulty level to easy, the developers were already somewhat compromising the "soul" of the game. However, since players couldn't go back to normal mode, they had to think twice before making the switch. I believe many players refrained from doing so or at least continued to try hard before changing their difficulty level.

But now, with the ability to return to normal mode, the developers are further compromising the game. Many players might stop trying so hard to defeat bosses; I'm quite sure of it. After 5 or maybe 10 attempts, who will continue to persevere? I certainly will, but how many other players will do the same? Even I might be tempted to switch after 20, 30, or 40 tries. I didn't have that many attempts with Khazan, but I remember some Dark Souls bosses and other soul-like games where I tried for hours.

I just hope that other developers won't be inspired by this decision from Khazan's team and that most will not allow players to change their difficulty level at will. Otherwise, we might see soul-like games becoming ordinary games.

[Baron01]

No, just no.

[Oddless]

not a soulslike but being able to revert to normal is weird, since if you cant beat a boss on normal then you WON'T be able to beat the later ones on the same difficulty

[TCSyd]

I'm somewhat ambivalent about this, to be honest.

I do think there is merit to "protecting the player from themselves" and trying to maintain a purity of experience, but it necessarily comes at the cost of player agency and alienating a portion of the audience. In principle, I think that's fine, perhaps even necessary, but I can't fault developers for wanting to be accommodating.

Maybe there's some middle ground where there's a penalty/cost for changing difficulty, but that might feel like kicking the player when they're down.

I mostly think it's fine. If the developers really cared about purity of experience, then there shouldn't have been difficulty selection to begin with.

[Roumata]

it is mainly a question of game structure ! Isn't it one of the major point of a soul-like game ? difficulty and hard trying ? Remove that, and it becomes just an ordinary game.

[greed]

so what? you wanna try hard git gud, go for it. Someone else might just like it a tad bit less intense. you have made a rubbish point. i did the game 100% dying countless times because i play souls and know how rewarding it feels. someone else may not be into it. so you're saying people should make games to cater to a small portion of gamers? sounds pretty dumb. I don't care if someone completed the game on easy mode, just like most real souls players wouldn't. it shouldn't bother you that the sense of achievement you feel defeating a boss, someone else feels it too without having to put half the effort. it doesn't change anything for the individual player experience.

[The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition]

My gripe is the edge lords playing on easy mode coming on hear to brag how easy this or that boss was without revealing the fact that they just played tutorial mode the entire time. The devs should have stuck to their guns like the FROM SOFTWARE chaps. Weaklings shouldn't play games for tough minded people. Yes I said it, sue me if you can but then again that might be hard work and we all know you can't hack it even playing video games.

[The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition]

Originally posted by greed:

so what? you wanna try hard git gud, go for it. Someone else might just like it a tad bit less intense. you have made a rubbish point. i did the game 100% dying countless times because i play souls and know how rewarding it feels. someone else may not be into it. so you're saying people should make games to cater to a small portion of gamers? sounds pretty dumb. I don't care if someone completed the game on easy mode, just like most real souls players wouldn't. it shouldn't bother you that the sense of achievement you feel defeating a boss, someone else feels it too without having to put half the effort. it doesn't change anything for the individual player experience.

A try hard is better than weaklings asking for easy mode. Everything in life require skills, and some people get better at it more than others. I'd rather board a plane with a "try hard" pilot that has thousands of hours because I trust his ability and expert skill at flying the gad damn plane. What is it with people like you throwing shade at people good at anything? If you suck at games you just suck, get better or move on. But do not insult others better at the game than you. No one is holding you back, you have a YOU problem.

Also, there is a huge market for different kinds of games, if you can't hack souls like games go play fortnite or balatro (or whatever the fuq that pos is). A game for everyone is a game for no one. Deal with it.

[greed]

Originally posted by The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition:

Originally posted by greed:

so what? you wanna try hard git gud, go for it. Someone else might just like it a tad bit less intense. you have made a rubbish point. i did the game 100% dying countless times because i play souls and know how rewarding it feels. someone else may not be into it. so you're saying people should make games to cater to a small portion of gamers? sounds pretty dumb. I don't care if someone completed the game on easy mode, just like most real souls players wouldn't. it shouldn't bother you that the sense of achievement you feel defeating a boss, someone else feels it too without having to put half the effort. it doesn't change anything for the individual player experience.

A try hard is better than weaklings asking for easy mode. Everything in life require skills, and some people get better at it more than others. I'd rather board a plane with a "try hard" pilot that has thousands of hours because I trust his ability and expert skill at flying the gad damn plane. What is it with people like you throwing shade at people good at anything? If you suck at games you just suck, get better or move on. But do not insult others better at the game than you. No one is holding you back, you have a YOU problem.

STFU ♥♥♥♥♥♥ and look at my profile first. I have aced all souls games and if you think you have achieved a great deal finishing a game you just creating your own happiness. I am not throwing shade, I am saying a game is for all to enjoy. Knowing how to play souls games isn't a like skill, nut. I can already tell how smart you must be IRL to not be able to even accept someone else's opinion.

[greed]

Originally posted by The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition:

Originally posted by greed:

so what? you wanna try hard git gud, go for it. Someone else might just like it a tad bit less intense. you have made a rubbish point. i did the game 100% dying countless times because i play souls and know how rewarding it feels. someone else may not be into it. so you're saying people should make games to cater to a small portion of gamers? sounds pretty dumb. I don't care if someone completed the game on easy mode, just like most real souls players wouldn't. it shouldn't bother you that the sense of achievement you feel defeating a boss, someone else feels it too without having to put half the effort. it doesn't change anything for the individual player experience.

A try hard is better than weaklings asking for easy mode. Everything in life require skills, and some people get better at it more than others. I'd rather board a plane with a "try hard" pilot that has thousands of hours because I trust his ability and expert skill at flying the gad damn plane. What is it with people like you throwing shade at people good at anything? If you suck at games you just suck, get better or move on. But do not insult others better at the game than you. No one is holding you back, you have a YOU problem.

Also, there is a huge market for different kinds of games, if you can't hack souls like games go play fortnite or balatro (or whatever the fuq that pos is). A game for everyone is a game for no one. Deal with it.

Whatchu goin on about hacking a souls like game niga? stop being a ♥♥♥♥♥♥. The only one who cares if you play souls is you. Just because I like ripping my hair off beating a game boss doesnt mean everybody should have to. AND fyi, I do play souls games so you're not making any sense when you keep telling I can't play it.

[Oddless]

Originally posted by Roumata:

it is mainly a question of game structure ! Isn't it one of the major point of a soul-like game ? difficulty and hard trying ? Remove that, and it becomes just an ordinary game.

difficulty can be important to many games, not just soulslikes, but idrc about difficulty options, and I mean it, if someone is complaining that there isnt a difficulty option i just say git gud and move on, if there are then so what, I'm not gonna choose it, but I will value the opinions of someone who played a game on easy much less than someone who played on normal

[The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition]

Originally posted by greed:

Originally posted by The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition:

A try hard is better than weaklings asking for easy mode. Everything in life require skills, and some people get better at it more than others. I'd rather board a plane with a "try hard" pilot that has thousands of hours because I trust his ability and expert skill at flying the gad damn plane. What is it with people like you throwing shade at people good at anything? If you suck at games you just suck, get better or move on. But do not insult others better at the game than you. No one is holding you back, you have a YOU problem.

STFU ♥♥♥♥♥♥ and look at my profile first. I have aced all souls games and if you think you have achieved a great deal finishing a game you just creating your own happiness. I am not throwing shade, I am saying a game is for all to enjoy. Knowing how to play souls games isn't a like skill, nut. I can already tell how smart you must be IRL to not be able to even accept someone else's opinion.

Nah you STFU! you came on here insulting others and defending people that shouldn't be playing the game. There is no point in equalising every single game to the same level because people can't hack different games. There IS a market for souls like games, people value the challenges therein, it is not for everyone, Therefore; players will always disagree with the dilution of the experience to people who have no business playing such games.

As casual as Helldivers 2 is, there are players complaining that the game is too difficult even when it has 10 difficulty levels with the top 3 offering anything close to a challenge. Catering to such weak players drags the game down to boring levels. The solution therefore is simple; either these players adapt and get better or move on to something they can actually handle. You coming on here insulting good players as "try hards" is part of the problem. I could give zero fawks about whatever your profile says.

[Oddless]

manners, gentleman
there are real people behind every profile pic

[The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition]

Originally posted by greed:

Originally posted by The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition:

A try hard is better than weaklings asking for easy mode. Everything in life require skills, and some people get better at it more than others. I'd rather board a plane with a "try hard" pilot that has thousands of hours because I trust his ability and expert skill at flying the gad damn plane. What is it with people like you throwing shade at people good at anything? If you suck at games you just suck, get better or move on. But do not insult others better at the game than you. No one is holding you back, you have a YOU problem.

Also, there is a huge market for different kinds of games, if you can't hack souls like games go play fortnite or balatro (or whatever the fuq that pos is). A game for everyone is a game for no one. Deal with it.

Whatchu goin on about hacking a souls like game niga? stop being a ♥♥♥♥♥♥. The only one who cares if you play souls is you. Just because I like ripping my hair off beating a game boss doesnt mean everybody should have to. AND fyi, I do play souls games so you're not making any sense when you keep telling I can't play it.

It's like you don't understand what you type, if people cannot hack (i.e. "play" since you seem to not understand context) souls like games, then they should NOT be playing souls like games at all. They also have no business demanding such games to be watered down for them. It's a huge market, I hear overwatch 2 is still in business, they can go play that.

[greed]

Originally posted by The Dess 2023 GOTY Edition:

Originally posted by greed:

STFU ♥♥♥♥♥♥ and look at my profile first. I have aced all souls games and if you think you have achieved a great deal finishing a game you just creating your own happiness. I am not throwing shade, I am saying a game is for all to enjoy. Knowing how to play souls games isn't a like skill, nut. I can already tell how smart you must be IRL to not be able to even accept someone else's opinion.

Nah you STFU! you came on here insulting others and defending people that shouldn't be playing the game. There is no point in equalising every single game to the same level because people can't hack different games. There IS a market for souls like games, people value the challenges therein, it is not for everyone, Therefore; players will always disagree with the dilution of the experience to people who have no business playing such games.

As casual as Helldivers 2 is, there are players complaining that the game is too difficult even when it has 10 difficulty levels with the top 3 offering anything close to a challenge. Catering to such weak players drags the game down to boring levels. The solution therefore is simple; either these players adapt and get better or move on to something they can actually handle. You coming on here insulting good players as "try hards" is part of the problem. I could give zero fawks about whatever your profile says.

I am not insulting anyone. You are the one who chose to act like the average trash that you are. I simply meant to say that games are for everyone and PURISTs wouldn't complain. Why TF do you have a problem with someone playing on easy?

[greed]

Originally posted by Oddless:

Originally posted by Roumata:

it is mainly a question of game structure ! Isn't it one of the major point of a soul-like game ? difficulty and hard trying ? Remove that, and it becomes just an ordinary game.

difficulty can be important to many games, not just soulslikes, but idrc about difficulty options, and I mean it, if someone is complaining that there isnt a difficulty option i just say git gud and move on, if there are then so what, I'm not gonna choose it, but I will value the opinions of someone who played a game on easy much less than someone who played on normal

That's all I have been trying to explain to this dude who apparently cannot read.