Improve Trokka fight

[sgrey]

Whoever designed this fight is a mad genius. Just the idea of a ranged, constantly evading enemy in a melee combat game is mind-blowing. Obviously everyone will love to chase after an enemy who runs teleports away while shooting deadly projectiles at you.
The color scheme made to blend in with the environment and the whole character looks the same so that you aren't able to see the character and what she does clearly.
You constantly get your stamina reduced in a fight where you have to run around and dodge a lot.

So, taking all those awesome genius design decisions, I recommend to improve on them.
- Make her teleport at a larger distance. Preferably diagonally across the arena.
- Change her colors to make he blend in with the arena more, or better yet - make her completely invisible and only show something when you are about to get hit.
- Lock the stamina bar completely. What kind of berserker needs movement? No, we must stay in one place and parry everything until she teleports to us with the burst attack, so we can finally parry her and do some direct damage.
I bet everyone will love this fight so much more!

p.s. for those who are going to write about skill issue: I killed her already. The fight is not even hard, just damn annoying.

[sgrey]

Originally posted by Senki:

Originally posted by ZexxCrine:

That video footage was post skalpel. That’s only two main levels. Hardly coming back from endgame. Again it’s also leveled down to 86. The recommended level for the very next side mission stage is 88

point is you were still doing significantly more dmg than someone that followed the normal progression and fought her for the first time

I just killed her during main mission with a normal progress and a dual-wielding build. Although each individual attack dealt less damage, I killed her in roughly similar time, maybe extra 30-40 seconds, but definitely not more and I was not overleveled.
What he is showing is not that outside the norm and everyone is focusing on the damage output, but that's really besides the point. Look at the gameplay and the method, it's still gonna work even if you do a little less damage, just gonna take a few extra seconds.

[Senki]

Originally posted by sgrey:

Originally posted by Senki:

point is you were still doing significantly more dmg than someone that followed the normal progression and fought her for the first time

I just killed her during main mission with a normal progress and a dual-wielding build. Although each individual attack dealt less damage, I killed her in roughly similar time, maybe extra 30-40 seconds, but definitely not more and I was not overleveled.
What he is showing is not that outside the norm and everyone is focusing on the damage output, but that's really besides the point. Look at the gameplay and the method, it's still gonna work even if you do a little less damage, just gonna take a few extra seconds.

his point was literally that ''it doesn't matter, she dies in 3ish combos anyway''

so yes, the overleveled damage nullifies that point

As for dual wield, idk maybe there's some op build. I played with spear with the skills that I picked at the time and she was very tanky. I later found out about how strong the ''trance'' skill is and my dmg skyrocketed but I feel like the game should feel good for all builds not just the strongest ones.

[sgrey]

Originally posted by Senki:

Originally posted by sgrey:

I just killed her during main mission with a normal progress and a dual-wielding build. Although each individual attack dealt less damage, I killed her in roughly similar time, maybe extra 30-40 seconds, but definitely not more and I was not overleveled.
What he is showing is not that outside the norm and everyone is focusing on the damage output, but that's really besides the point. Look at the gameplay and the method, it's still gonna work even if you do a little less damage, just gonna take a few extra seconds.

his point was literally that ''it doesn't matter, she dies in 3ish combos anyway''

so yes, the overleveled damage nullifies that point

As for dual wield, idk maybe there's some op build. I played with spear with the skills that I picked at the time and she was very tanky. I later found out about how strong the ''trance'' skill is and my dmg skyrocketed but I feel like the game should feel good for all builds not just the strongest ones.

I played demo in January and completed it with all weapons and I found that every weapon is great, but require a different play style.
As for that video, he clearly didn't kill her in 3 combos. He is just being hyperbolic, no need to nitpick and count the combos. Anyone can pick the greatsword and have the same fight.

[Senki]

Originally posted by sgrey:

Originally posted by Senki:

his point was literally that ''it doesn't matter, she dies in 3ish combos anyway''

so yes, the overleveled damage nullifies that point

As for dual wield, idk maybe there's some op build. I played with spear with the skills that I picked at the time and she was very tanky. I later found out about how strong the ''trance'' skill is and my dmg skyrocketed but I feel like the game should feel good for all builds not just the strongest ones.

I played demo in January and completed it with all weapons and I found that every weapon is great, but require a different play style.
As for that video, he clearly didn't kill her in 3 combos. He is just being hyperbolic, no need to nitpick and count the combos. Anyone can pick the greatsword and have the same fight.

the demo is hardly any metric to go by

not only did it have buffed weapons but it also had the easiest content in the entire game

But yes, all weapons are great. Not all builds with said weapons are great however. Not on spear at least, if you don't use the trance skill then your dmg will be much lower.

The bosses will feel like excessive sponges sometimes if you pick the wrong build

[sgrey]

Originally posted by Senki:

Originally posted by sgrey:

I played demo in January and completed it with all weapons and I found that every weapon is great, but require a different play style.
As for that video, he clearly didn't kill her in 3 combos. He is just being hyperbolic, no need to nitpick and count the combos. Anyone can pick the greatsword and have the same fight.

the demo is hardly any metric to go by

not only did it have buffed weapons but it also had the easiest content in the entire game

But yes, all weapons are great. Not all builds with said weapons are great however. Not on spear at least, if you don't use the trance skill then your dmg will be much lower.

The bosses will feel like excessive sponges sometimes if you pick the wrong build

Yea, sometimes the bosses feel a bit too healthy. Especially the tiger wolf. His health is absolutely insane. I guess they had to make it such because he is actually very easy. At least Trokka didn't have that much HP.

[Giganx]

She's pretty easy to chase while dual wielding. Not sure about the other weapons but DW khazan is very mobile.

I was able to chase her down and hit her consistently doing decent damage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNElFJw3vZ8

[count2ten]

I just beat this without any consumables and summon. the fight is actually easy.

[ZexxCrine]

Originally posted by Senki:

Originally posted by sgrey:

I just killed her during main mission with a normal progress and a dual-wielding build. Although each individual attack dealt less damage, I killed her in roughly similar time, maybe extra 30-40 seconds, but definitely not more and I was not overleveled.
What he is showing is not that outside the norm and everyone is focusing on the damage output, but that's really besides the point. Look at the gameplay and the method, it's still gonna work even if you do a little less damage, just gonna take a few extra seconds.

his point was literally that ''it doesn't matter, she dies in 3ish combos anyway''

so yes, the overleveled damage nullifies that point

As for dual wield, idk maybe there's some op build. I played with spear with the skills that I picked at the time and she was very tanky. I later found out about how strong the ''trance'' skill is and my dmg skyrocketed but I feel like the game should feel good for all builds not just the strongest ones.

Originally posted by Mugiwara:

Originally posted by ZexxCrine:

That video footage was post skalpel. That’s only two main levels. Hardly coming back from endgame. Again it’s also leveled down to 86. The recommended level for the very next side mission stage is 88

The level or you char wont do much like extra 3 dmg to your weapon from main stat is not big. But the level of your weapon, it is a lot, not just raw dmg, but all attributes aswel. Btw vengence points are good point, a lot of ppl dont know about it, i remembered about mine about at skalpel xD

https://youtu.be/ttdHKKzRTig?si=R6x-yDj34ys84bwu

Love to hear why this is invalid. attributes don't matter as much as you would like to believe due to the large variance between the minimum and maximum rolls of attributes. this is the exact same armor I wore to fight trokka with no rerolling on it since and a brand new sword I didn't spend too much time rerolling. because my attributes on my armor is not max rolls(you can check the minimum and max rolls in game) its very possible for someone to have this kind of attribute load-out.

also she dies in 3-ish combos. ish because of the tiny first "combo" she auto breaks out of. if we want to count that then it takes 4 combos to kill her with a level 85 weapon at level 86.

[Dregora]

Originally posted by ZexxCrine:

Originally posted by Senki:

his point was literally that ''it doesn't matter, she dies in 3ish combos anyway''

so yes, the overleveled damage nullifies that point

As for dual wield, idk maybe there's some op build. I played with spear with the skills that I picked at the time and she was very tanky. I later found out about how strong the ''trance'' skill is and my dmg skyrocketed but I feel like the game should feel good for all builds not just the strongest ones.

Originally posted by Mugiwara:

The level or you char wont do much like extra 3 dmg to your weapon from main stat is not big. But the level of your weapon, it is a lot, not just raw dmg, but all attributes aswel. Btw vengence points are good point, a lot of ppl dont know about it, i remembered about mine about at skalpel xD

https://youtu.be/ttdHKKzRTig?si=R6x-yDj34ys84bwu

Love to hear why this is invalid. attributes don't matter as much as you would like to believe due to the large variance between the minimum and maximum rolls of attributes. this is the exact same armor I wore to fight trokka with no rerolling on it since and a brand new sword I didn't spend too much time rerolling. because my attributes on my armor is not max rolls(you can check the minimum and max rolls in game) its very possible for someone to have this kind of attribute load-out.

also she dies in 3-ish combos. ish because of the tiny first "combo" she auto breaks out of. if we want to count that then it takes 4 combos to kill her with a level 85 weapon at level 86.

I mean while yes.. Whoever made this video clearly went back to her and isn't his first time fighting her. Either i've missed them or you don't have 8 healing items at that point you meet her for the first time. Or i've missed some, which is possible and in that case, that is on me.

[ZexxCrine]

Originally posted by Dregora:

Originally posted by ZexxCrine:

https://youtu.be/ttdHKKzRTig?si=R6x-yDj34ys84bwu

Love to hear why this is invalid. attributes don't matter as much as you would like to believe due to the large variance between the minimum and maximum rolls of attributes. this is the exact same armor I wore to fight trokka with no rerolling on it since and a brand new sword I didn't spend too much time rerolling. because my attributes on my armor is not max rolls(you can check the minimum and max rolls in game) its very possible for someone to have this kind of attribute load-out.

also she dies in 3-ish combos. ish because of the tiny first "combo" she auto breaks out of. if we want to count that then it takes 4 combos to kill her with a level 85 weapon at level 86.

I mean while yes.. Whoever made this video clearly went back to her and isn't his first time fighting her. Either i've missed them or you don't have 8 healing items at that point you meet her for the first time. Or i've missed some, which is possible and in that case, that is on me.

you mean the healing items I didnt use? you can see my weapon level and attribute points in video. lower/about recomended level. the assertion is that she has far too much health and it takes to long to kill her AND greatsword has a hard time. by the time I got to trokka I had both damage up and damage multiplier up maxed out with vengence points so thats not an issue either.

[Dregora]

Originally posted by ZexxCrine:

Originally posted by Dregora:

I mean while yes.. Whoever made this video clearly went back to her and isn't his first time fighting her. Either i've missed them or you don't have 8 healing items at that point you meet her for the first time. Or i've missed some, which is possible and in that case, that is on me.

you mean the healing items I didnt use? you can see my weapon level and attribute points in video. lower/about recomended level. the assertion is that she has far too much health and it takes to long to kill her AND greatsword has a hard time. by the time I got to trokka I had both damage up and damage multiplier up maxed out with vengence points so thats not an issue either.

Gotcha, nah bosses don't have too much health. Maybe the only case one could argue is Viper for how fast he's in the game and so far is the only boss with two proper phases with full HP.

But you're right, she's very manageable no matter what, you just gotta know what to do.

[Fairy f]

Originally posted by sgrey:

The color scheme made to blend in with the environment and the whole character looks the same so that you aren't able to see the character and what she does clearly.

THIS!

[电动天使]

Originally posted by sgrey:

Whoever designed this fight is a mad genius. Just the idea of a ranged, constantly evading enemy in a melee combat game is mind-blowing. Obviously everyone will love to chase after an enemy who runs teleports away while shooting deadly projectiles at you.
The color scheme made to blend in with the environment and the whole character looks the same so that you aren't able to see the character and what she does clearly.
You constantly get your stamina reduced in a fight where you have to run around and dodge a lot.

So, taking all those awesome genius design decisions, I recommend to improve on them.
- Make her teleport at a larger distance. Preferably diagonally across the arena.
- Change her colors to make he blend in with the arena more, or better yet - make her completely invisible and only show something when you are about to get hit.
- Lock the stamina bar completely. What kind of berserker needs movement? No, we must stay in one place and parry everything until she teleports to us with the burst attack, so we can finally parry her and do some direct damage.
I bet everyone will love this fight so much more!

p.s. for those who are going to write about skill issue: I killed her already. The fight is not even hard, just damn annoying.

Wow I did not expect such a salt post from you.

[Giganx]

Farming and overleveling do SIGNIFICANTLY increase your damage, so if you're someone who grinds in these games you will trivialize a lot of the content.

People are going to have wildly different takes on how spongy bosses are based on how much they grind.

[电动天使]

In all seriousness, though, this fight is great. You have to be aggressive, that's literally it. It probably sounds like troll advice, but it's true. You can interrupt a large majority of her attacks and her umbrella melee attack is easily reflectable. This is all aside from the fact that she's weak to earth and will constantly spam that easily counterattackable move.