Can we admit the level design is 0/10 terrible?

[Doctor Gitgud]

Might be the worst I've ever seen in a souls game. Complex, intricate areas with multiple paths and lots of secrets are out. Simplistic, uninspired corridors are in. The environment poses no threat whatsoever.

A perfect early example is Sen's Fortress vs. Forgotten Temple. The Temple is basically a direct knockoff in fact -- another fortress full of lizard people and traps. Except unlike the ingenious design of Sen's Fortress, the "traps" in Forgotten Temple consist of an easily visible arrow-firing pressure plate in the middle of a large room in front of a chest, that only a complete ♥♥♥♥♥♥ would step on. And there are a couple of clearly broken floors that will drop you onto spikes. There is only one way through the level. Zero exploration. Complete amateur hour, like a student project.

Sen's Fortress on the other hand, was like an onion where you just keep peeling back the layers and discovering more and more. And as you climb, it only gets more intense, with traps like swinging blades as you walk on narrow catwalks. There is no comparison whatsoever.

I am getting far into the game, and while several of the bosses have been fun, I have not seen a single "good" level yet. And this doesn't even touch on the visual aspect, which is also mediocre and uninspired.

[SlobbyWiz]

all im say is towards the end of game yeah they start to feel like a slog

[badger vortex]

i see a lot of complaints about level design but it just seems to amount to it not being an open-world game. what are the actual problems with the levels in a mission based format? to me they aren't really missing anything, they have a few secret areas, reasonable spacing on save spots, some clever traps/ambushes scattered about. is this mostly an aesthetic complaint then? i'm just not understanding what other non-open world games are doing better

[Leo K [Rogue]]

I'm pretty happy with the level design overall. It's a pretty straightforward action-game vibe with the occasional side paths or rare hidden rooms to explore or look around in, but the overall game is quite focused.

I also rarely feel like a trap or ambush is unfair. As long as you maintain an adventurer's mindset, you should almost never die to something like that in this game, and even then no more than once. Taking stock of escape-routes, chokepoints, retreating to cleared space if you need to, using your items or LoSing different enemies if they're ranged etc, all very satisfying IMO.

Khazan is on a mission of vengeance and the entire world is being consumed by Chaos. There's no time to mess about. There's also some smart reuse/remixing of "main" mission areas for a few of the sidequests which I thought was clever. It's not the most mindblowing thing in the world, but it's firmly Good. No issues here. I also enjoy how varied the areas seem to feel, we're not just in snowy fields or dark caves for the entire game, we do visit quite a few places. Apocalyptic and rundown, certainly, but that's the genre.

[电动天使]

Publicado originalmente por Leo K Rogue:

I'm pretty happy with the level design overall. It's a pretty straightforward action-game vibe with the occasional side paths or rare hidden rooms to explore or look around in, but the overall game is quite focused. Khazan is on a mission of vengeance and the entire world is being consumed by Chaos. There's no time to mess about. There's also some smart reuse/remixing of "main" mission areas for a few of the sidequests which I thought was clever. It's not the most mindblowing thing in the world, but it's firmly Good. No issues here. I also enjoy how varied the areas seem to feel, we're not just in snowy fields or dark caves for the entire game, we do visit quite a few places. Apocalyptic and rundown, certainly, but that's the genre.

I do wish the genre stopped aping the apocalyptic stuff. The main story design has broken free and we have games with normal stories (Lies of P and Khazan), but the levels are still conveniently abandoned/destroyed.

[badger vortex]

Publicado originalmente por 电动天使:

I do wish the genre stopped aping the apocalyptic stuff. The main story design has broken free and we have games with normal stories (Lies of P and Khazan), but the levels are still conveniently abandoned/destroyed.

it would be nice to see a "brightsouls" for once i agree. i don't mind the aesthetic but for so many games in the genre it always goes back to the same thing

[Hibuki]

Publicado originalmente por badger vortex:

Publicado originalmente por 电动天使:

I do wish the genre stopped aping the apocalyptic stuff. The main story design has broken free and we have games with normal stories (Lies of P and Khazan), but the levels are still conveniently abandoned/destroyed.

it would be nice to see a "brightsouls" for once i agree. i don't mind the aesthetic but for so many games in the genre it always goes back to the same thing

They're still have a somewhat abandoned aesthetic but I'd recommend checking out Asterigos: Curse of the Stars or Wo Long: Fallen Dynasty