Does dodging have iframes during the dodge?

[Crescent Dusk]

I can’t find a detailed explanation in the game encyclopedia, only a mention of iframes AFTER a brink dodge.

This is mostly so I can decide on what to invest in first in the skill tree and stats based on reliability, guard or dodge skill nodes.

[sgrey]

There are some. You can be sure because there is a skill that increases the iframes. But you should aim for the brink dodge

[Crescent Dusk]

Yeah I mostly want to know how the dodge works, if you take damage for dodge rolling in the wrong direction, if the dodge only works if you roll out of an attack hitbox, or if you can roll into an enemy attack and with proper timing the immunity frame protects you.

I'm not a soulslike players and it took like 15+ attempts to kill the first boss on the demo before I could change the difficulty to easy and still died on easy to the blighted bear and Phantom Blade before killing them on the second go, since they still do like 1/3-1/2 your health in damage at Easy difficulty.

So I'm trying to come up with a build and stat investment that allows me to complete the game and see the story instead of uninstalling in annoyance.

[Dregora]

I don't have statistics, but I believe it does. I dodge a lot and it feels like it has iframes. I often dodge towards the boss and it works fine.

[Hormesis]

perfect dodge has about as many iframes as a normal dodge in dark souls, it's very easy to get. problem with "brink" dodge vs "brink" guard is that the dodge doesn't affect his stamina bar. if you brink guard however it does affect it. both by decreasing it and also by preventing it from going down for a second or two, which buys you more time to wittle it down further. if it weren't for throw attacks and elemental attacks i'd never dodge if i'm being honest.

[Kauan_tls7]

paia.

[Crescent Dusk]

Originally posted by Hormesis:

perfect dodge has about as many iframes as a normal dodge in dark souls, it's very easy to get. problem with "brink" dodge vs "brink" guard is that the dodge doesn't affect his stamina bar. if you brink guard however it does affect it. both by decreasing it and also by preventing it from going down for a second or two, which buys you more time to wittle it down further. if it weren't for throw attacks and elemental attacks i'd never dodge if i'm being honest.

This is an impression I got with perfect guards, I would imagine the upside to perfect dodge is allowing your iframes to pull off a combo without worrying about getting hit, but I don't know if the iframes are long enough after a perfect dodge.

It just felt like guarding was much more reliable to avoid damage whereas the perfect dodge was there for avoiding the grab attacks.

On the Yeti boss it felt a lot easier to brink guard than perfect dodge, I felt like I was getting hit most of the time on a dodge unless it was the boulder throw or jump slam.

If you fail a dodge you eat the whole damage, if you fail a guard you lose some stamina instead. The benefit of the dodge needs to outweigh the guard, or at least the dodge needs to be much more generous.

[sgrey]

Originally posted by Crescent Dusk:

Yeah I mostly want to know how the dodge works, if you take damage for dodge rolling in the wrong direction, if the dodge only works if you roll out of an attack hitbox, or if you can roll into an enemy attack and with proper timing the immunity frame protects you.

I'm not a soulslike players and it took like 15+ attempts to kill the first boss on the demo before I could change the difficulty to easy and still died on easy to the blighted bear and Phantom Blade before killing them on the second go, since they still do like 1/3-1/2 your health in damage at Easy difficulty.

So I'm trying to come up with a build and stat investment that allows me to complete the game and see the story instead of uninstalling in annoyance.

It's all about the timing. Even if there are some iframes, you are not going to get seconds of it. When you dodge at a time when the attack is right about to hit, that's a brink dodge and it has a teleportation animation. The timing is similar to the brink guard. Both the first and second bosses are better defeated with the brink guard than a dodge. Specifically the first boss has the same moveset as a normal Yeti, so you can just go and massacre normal Yetis for practice and get used to their moveset. As a rule of thumb, I would say you should brink guard everything and use dodge if you cannot or you get damaged by elemental attacks

[Hormesis]

Originally posted by Crescent Dusk:

Originally posted by Hormesis:

perfect dodge has about as many iframes as a normal dodge in dark souls, it's very easy to get. problem with "brink" dodge vs "brink" guard is that the dodge doesn't affect his stamina bar. if you brink guard however it does affect it. both by decreasing it and also by preventing it from going down for a second or two, which buys you more time to wittle it down further. if it weren't for throw attacks and elemental attacks i'd never dodge if i'm being honest.

This is an impression I got with perfect guards, I would imagine the upside to perfect dodge is allowing your iframes to pull off a combo without worrying about getting hit, but I don't know if the iframes are long enough after a perfect dodge.

It just felt like guarding was much more reliable to avoid damage whereas the perfect dodge was there for avoiding the grab attacks.

On the Yeti boss it felt a lot easier to brink guard than perfect dodge, I felt like I was getting hit most of the time on a dodge unless it was the boulder throw or jump slam.

there are some enemies, bosses are notoriously this way, that almost all your damage will occur during their exhausted state. those fights will be very hard if you're not brink guarding. also some enemies enter a "semi stunned" state if you're able to brink block them. the yeti for example has a 5 hit combo, if you brink block his first three attacks he won't attack again and he'll be opened up for a punish. finally the most important benefit, aside from stopping their stun threshold from rejuvinating, is that dodge takes stamina. less stamina means less attacking equals less damage during openings. you will lose a lot of stamina however if you're just normal blocking.

[sgrey]

Originally posted by Hormesis:

perfect dodge has about as many iframes as a normal dodge in dark souls, it's very easy to get. problem with "brink" dodge vs "brink" guard is that the dodge doesn't affect his stamina bar. if you brink guard however it does affect it. both by decreasing it and also by preventing it from going down for a second or two, which buys you more time to wittle it down further. if it weren't for throw attacks and elemental attacks i'd never dodge if i'm being honest.

when you brink guard, it activates stamina regen immediatly. At the same time you reduce enemy's stamina and if you get the damage skill, also reduces HP

[Hormesis]

Originally posted by sgrey:

Originally posted by Hormesis:

perfect dodge has about as many iframes as a normal dodge in dark souls, it's very easy to get. problem with "brink" dodge vs "brink" guard is that the dodge doesn't affect his stamina bar. if you brink guard however it does affect it. both by decreasing it and also by preventing it from going down for a second or two, which buys you more time to wittle it down further. if it weren't for throw attacks and elemental attacks i'd never dodge if i'm being honest.

when you brink guard, it activates stamina regen immediatly. At the same time you reduce enemy's stamina and if you get the damage skill, also reduces HP

yeah forgot about the damage and your stamina regen. this game really is built around brink guarding. i think that's why a lot of souls players struggle at first

[sgrey]

Originally posted by Hormesis:

Originally posted by sgrey:

when you brink guard, it activates stamina regen immediatly. At the same time you reduce enemy's stamina and if you get the damage skill, also reduces HP

yeah forgot about the damage and your stamina regen. this game really is built around brink guarding. i think that's why a lot of souls players struggle at first

Dodges also have a good playstyle, but you need to get the skill for reducing stamina and also get some good items later on for dodges. Also some bosses are much easier if you combine guarding and dodging when appropriate. The village goat is an example of that.

[Kyota]

It is an iframe.

Dodging is mostly just an escape mechanic.

Some boss patterns are way too quick to successively Brink Guard, so dodges give you that distance to both reset the boss' attack combo as well as your own.

There are also some moves that can't be guarded against. So dodge is your go-to there.

I would always focus on building brink guard before ever considering brink dodge.

As many have said. The guard function actually gives you back resources when successful. Dodges just expends them, giving you nothing in return if successfully pulled off.

All of this obviously doesn't account for end-game builds.

Dodge becomes very much a force of its own later on.

[J9ma6]

only a couple hours in but hit tracking doesn't seem to very harsh (certainly not sekiro level) so dodging has positioning value that guard doesn't, and that could mean potentially big window payoffs (per strafing in core souls, for people who really know a bosskit)

but yeah seems to me p.guards are the way to go as a default (with dodge being superior on certain exceptions, which is exactly how i see sekiro)

[Limetime]

Originally posted by Crescent Dusk:

Originally posted by Hormesis:

perfect dodge has about as many iframes as a normal dodge in dark souls, it's very easy to get. problem with "brink" dodge vs "brink" guard is that the dodge doesn't affect his stamina bar. if you brink guard however it does affect it. both by decreasing it and also by preventing it from going down for a second or two, which buys you more time to wittle it down further. if it weren't for throw attacks and elemental attacks i'd never dodge if i'm being honest.

This is an impression I got with perfect guards, I would imagine the upside to perfect dodge is allowing your iframes to pull off a combo without worrying about getting hit, but I don't know if the iframes are long enough after a perfect dodge.

It just felt like guarding was much more reliable to avoid damage whereas the perfect dodge was there for avoiding the grab attacks.

On the Yeti boss it felt a lot easier to brink guard than perfect dodge, I felt like I was getting hit most of the time on a dodge unless it was the boulder throw or jump slam.

If you fail a dodge you eat the whole damage, if you fail a guard you lose some stamina instead. The benefit of the dodge needs to outweigh the guard, or at least the dodge needs to be much more generous.

I feel there's a good balance when it comes to mastering the game deciding to go for chip damage in between their attacks with the dodge attacks or trying to stun them to go ham.

[strike478]

It has iframes even on non-brink version. I'm 99% sure of it.


Regarding discussion of superiority of one versus another I would say that both have their advantages.

Brink bock can eat lots of enemies stamina and even do some damage with right skill. Dodge lets you to take right position for your attacks while also letting you to do various good out of dodge moves. Also is deals with grabs.

I feel like depending on which boss you fight you will be using more of one or another. It all depends. I feel like this makes bosses great. No holding to one gameplan but forcing you to make some adaptations or being very precise if you want to use wrong tool against something. Overally those bosses feel like unique awesomeness and nice way to test your skill.