Denuvo Seriously?

[arrogantic_deer]

It’s like having a nosy security guard constantly checking your game while you’re trying to play. It keeps running in the background, doing these little “are you legit?” checks over and over—sometimes every few minutes.

This constant checking eats up your CPU’s power, kinda like how too many apps running on your phone slow it down. For a game, that means stuff like longer load times (ugh, waiting forever to jump in), choppy frame rates (those annoying stutters when things should be smooth), and sometimes even bigger lag spikes that make it feel like the game’s drunk. If your PC isn’t some beastly high-end rig, you’ll notice it more—low-end setups get hit harder. It’s not always a total disaster, but it’s enough to make your experience less fun, especially if the devs didn’t set it up super carefully. So yeah, Denuvo’s there to protect the game, but it can end up harshing your vibe instead.

[Krumkai]

The Demo is running smoothly but it has no denuvo integration. I was planning to pre-order the game but now I know that demo is clean of Denuvo I do rather wait to see the feedback on performance when the game release with Denuvo.

Personally for me it is really shady business to release a demo w/o denuvo where performance is better than the full release with denuvo...

[bgray9054]

Ya will keep this on wishlist for now. If they ever remove Denuvo I'll give it another look.

[Speaty]

what is 'Denuvo' ?

[Mugiwara]

Originally posted by Speaty:

what is 'Denuvo' ?

Intrusive software designed to prevent piracy. There are many flaws with Denuvo including but not limited to: being forced to be online for a single player game. If Irdeto's servers go down you can't play the game. It's anti-consumer and punishes those who have legitimate copies of the game. There are also many who have complained about it creating performance issues when Denuvo is in a game.

[YOKAI]

i always felt like Denuvo is a necessary evil. most games that has no denuvo usually get pirated which hindered the sales of the games. personally i never had issues with games that integrates denuvo but thats just me.

[Cryonic]

Yeah Denuvo DRM is always a hard pass. Game looks interesting but if I have to download spyware that throttles my computers performance just because the publishers don't trust paying customers, then that's a lost sale from me.

[Captain Murphy The Villian]

5 games. We all know why you don't like Denuvo.

[BEOWULF]

Originally posted by Captain Murphy The Villian:

5 games. We all know why you don't like Denuvo.

Shame on you, OP

[Trilkin]

Denuvo is seamless when it's implemented by the developer correctly. When it isn't, you get RE7 and MHWorld situations. If you're having issues with Denuvo and find that nobody else is, you have something funky going on with your computer. That isn't just for Denuvo, that's for everything.

And no, games with questionable optimization like MHWilds and Rise of the Ronin aren't 'see, it's Denuvo?' They have bigger issues than Denuvo. I don't even know if RotR uses Denuvo. If the argument then becomes 'then why do they run fine on console,' the answer is:

1. RotR doesn't. It has issues even on its target platform (PS5)

2. In most other cases, the game's rendering settings are specifically set by the developer for the target platform since they can tailor them to the 100% consistent hardware of a console. There are things that are rendered at resolutions below even 'Very Low' on PCs (MHWilds very clearly uses this a lot with shaders and LOD if you know where to look) while also taking advantage of things like dynamic resolutions and upscaling. PC players, on the other hand, like trying to force the game to run at higher settings than their hardware allows or have other things going on in their PC including potential hardware issues.

It is rare that an underlying performance issue in a game is, in fact, Denuvo. When it is, again, it's usually due to another problem on the PC, or - as an unfortunate reality of online DRM in general - have connectivity problems entirely out of their control with the servers Denuvo is phoning home to. Usually this isn't an issue since games do their hash checks and ♥♥♥♥ at game start and not while playing (and why you can still do things like memory edits with Cheat Engine without triggering Denuvo nastygrams,) but not always.

Wouldn't doubt there are a lot of games you play and love and work great that use Denuvo and you probably didn't know. No one was talking about how Black Myth Wukong uses Denuvo, for example - or if they did, it wasn't many. It just ends up being another sin they can hold against a game they're set on not liking even if it's not related to the issues they have with it.

For what it's worth, I think DRM in general is a scam and locks people out of being able to preserve the thing they bought, but as more games make it clear in their TOS and license agreements (most of which aren't court-enforceable in Europe) that you don't own the game, but rather the license to use the game until they decide you aren't allowed to anymore, preservation is kind of a moot point and overshadowed by a much, much larger problem.

So, yeah, tl;dr: Denuvo is a symptom, not the disease.

[ZexxCrine]

Originally posted by Trilkin:

Denuvo is seamless when it's implemented by the developer correctly. When it isn't, you get RE7 and MHWorld situations. If you're having issues with Denuvo and find that nobody else is, you have something funky going on with your computer. That isn't just for Denuvo, that's for everything.

And no, games with questionable optimization like MHWilds and Rise of the Ronin aren't 'see, it's Denuvo?' They have bigger issues than Denuvo. I don't even know if RotR uses Denuvo. If the argument then becomes 'then why do they run fine on console,' the answer is:

1. RotR doesn't. It has issues even on its target platform (PS5)

2. In most other cases, the game's rendering settings are specifically set by the developer for the target platform since they can tailor them to the 100% consistent hardware of a console. There are things that are rendered at resolutions below even 'Very Low' on PCs (MHWilds very clearly uses this a lot with shaders and LOD if you know where to look) while also taking advantage of things like dynamic resolutions and upscaling. PC players, on the other hand, like trying to force the game to run at higher settings than their hardware allows or have other things going on in their PC including potential hardware issues.

It is rare that an underlying performance issue in a game is, in fact, Denuvo. When it is, again, it's usually due to another problem on the PC, or - as an unfortunate reality of online DRM in general - have connectivity problems entirely out of their control with the servers Denuvo is phoning home to. Usually this isn't an issue since games do their hash checks and ♥♥♥♥ at game start and not while playing (and why you can still do things like memory edits with Cheat Engine without triggering Denuvo nastygrams,) but not always.

Wouldn't doubt there are a lot of games you play and love and work great that use Denuvo and you probably didn't know. No one was talking about how Black Myth Wukong uses Denuvo, for example - or if they did, it wasn't many. It just ends up being another sin they can hold against a game they're set on not liking even if it's not related to the issues they have with it.

For what it's worth, I think DRM in general is a scam and locks people out of being able to preserve the thing they bought, but as more games make it clear in their TOS and license agreements (most of which aren't court-enforceable in Europe) that you don't own the game, but rather the license to use the game until they decide you aren't allowed to anymore, preservation is kind of a moot point and overshadowed by a much, much larger problem.

So, yeah, tl;dr: Denuvo is a symptom, not the disease.

I agree with almost the entirety of your post. My conclusion changes though. Denuvo may or may not cause issues on a game by game basis. Those issues may or may not be a global issue everyone is experiencing or isolated issues that denuvo simply becomes the straw that broke the camels back. Regardless of all of that I see no value in a service that may or may not cause my game that I purchased with my money to be possible to be lesser quality than a version of that same thing that was stolen. Especially when a causality between piracy and purchases have never been conclusive. Every defender of denuvo tends to believe that piracy is a lost sale and I don’t subscribe to that idea. If I’m going to be punished, even if it’s only a minor barely traceable spike in my cpu, for doing what I’m supposed to do by buying the game legally then I’m not going to purchase the game or , like I said above, I’m going to go out of my way to cause a problem. I find it ironic that people who defend denuvo and condemn piracy blindly are doing so in high quantities on the steam forums given one of the core beliefs steam was founded on.

[Trilkin]

Originally posted by ZexxCrine:

I agree with almost the entirety of your post. My conclusion changes though. Denuvo may or may not cause issues on a game by game basis. Those issues may or may not be a global issue everyone is experiencing or isolated issues that denuvo simply becomes the straw that broke the camels back. Regardless of all of that I see no value in a service that may or may not cause my game that I purchased with my money to be possible to be lesser quality than a version of that same thing that was stolen. Especially when a causality between piracy and purchases have never been conclusive. Every defender of denuvo tends to believe that piracy is a lost sale and I don’t subscribe to that idea. If I’m going to be punished, even if it’s only a minor barely traceable spike in my cpu, for doing what I’m supposed to do by buying the game legally then I’m not going to purchase the game or , like I said above, I’m going to go out of my way to cause a problem.

See, I understand and fully support your mentality here because it's the simple fact of like, exercising your right as a consumer. It isn't making up ♥♥♥♥ about a game that just isn't true; it's just a principled 'I don't even like the idea of this being here in the first place.' I respect it, and largely agree with it.

I just have the personal issue where I want to see people supported for good work. Even if the vast majority of the money of my purchase ends up going to the publisher and other people who deserve it significantly less, I want my purchase to be support and interest for more of This Thing That They Made©. It's a massive conundrum, honestly, and I think your side of it is just as reasonable as I think my side of it is.

At any rate, I do hope you get to enjoy the game however you do. It looks like it's going to be great from the demo.

[UgaBuga Conq4]

Originally posted by Trilkin:

Denuvo is seamless when it's implemented by the developer correctly. When it isn't, you get RE7 and MHWorld situations. If you're having issues with Denuvo and find that nobody else is, you have something funky going on with your computer. That isn't just for Denuvo, that's for everything.

And no, games with questionable optimization like MHWilds and Rise of the Ronin aren't 'see, it's Denuvo?' They have bigger issues than Denuvo. I don't even know if RotR uses Denuvo. If the argument then becomes 'then why do they run fine on console,' the answer is:

1. RotR doesn't. It has issues even on its target platform (PS5)

2. In most other cases, the game's rendering settings are specifically set by the developer for the target platform since they can tailor them to the 100% consistent hardware of a console. There are things that are rendered at resolutions below even 'Very Low' on PCs (MHWilds very clearly uses this a lot with shaders and LOD if you know where to look) while also taking advantage of things like dynamic resolutions and upscaling. PC players, on the other hand, like trying to force the game to run at higher settings than their hardware allows or have other things going on in their PC including potential hardware issues.

It is rare that an underlying performance issue in a game is, in fact, Denuvo. When it is, again, it's usually due to another problem on the PC, or - as an unfortunate reality of online DRM in general - have connectivity problems entirely out of their control with the servers Denuvo is phoning home to. Usually this isn't an issue since games do their hash checks and ♥♥♥♥ at game start and not while playing (and why you can still do things like memory edits with Cheat Engine without triggering Denuvo nastygrams,) but not always.

Wouldn't doubt there are a lot of games you play and love and work great that use Denuvo and you probably didn't know. No one was talking about how Black Myth Wukong uses Denuvo, for example - or if they did, it wasn't many. It just ends up being another sin they can hold against a game they're set on not liking even if it's not related to the issues they have with it.

For what it's worth, I think DRM in general is a scam and locks people out of being able to preserve the thing they bought, but as more games make it clear in their TOS and license agreements (most of which aren't court-enforceable in Europe) that you don't own the game, but rather the license to use the game until they decide you aren't allowed to anymore, preservation is kind of a moot point and overshadowed by a much, much larger problem.

So, yeah, tl;dr: Denuvo is a symptom, not the disease.

Denuvo is not a symptom. its a weapon against the pirates. Which has nothing to do with the consumer that purchases the game. As they are not the problem. its a weapon that has collateral damage.

[UgaBuga Conq4]

I place often Denuvo games at category: "purchase from sale at 5-10e" or steam key from vendor at same price. Im not paying more because they feel like they have to wage war on some small group of pirates. There will be like 300 people downloading the game max. Its just not worth to fight them with Denuvo. While also losing sales because Denuvo has become a curse word for many people. This is morally wrong to make all customers pay for the sins of others.

[Dux Maximus]

Guys, you fundamentally misunderstand why Denuva is here, the inflated price is to make it look like a quality AAA game, and Denuva is so that you can't check if the game is good or not without spending money, and in most cases the first 2-3 hours of gameplay are good (they don't spend a lot of money on more) and then it's garbage and copy-paste. Sony games sell well and there are no Denuva , because everyone knows that the games are good.

p.s. The game may be good, we'll find out after the release =)

[Ohma]

Originally posted by Dux Maximus:

Guys, you fundamentally misunderstand why Denuva is here, the inflated price is to make it look like a quality AAA game, and Denuva is so that you can't check if the game is good or not without spending money, and in most cases the first 2-3 hours of gameplay are good (they don't spend a lot of money on more) and then it's garbage and copy-paste. Sony games sell well and there are no Denuva , because everyone knows that the games are good.

p.s. The game may be good, we'll find out after the release =)

You have a demo to check if the game runs well for you and if you like it.

We know pirates are having a crisis because they can’t steal something.

Shame.