Fantastic! (My thoughts after 20 hours in the demo)

[Ronin Krieg]

First of all, I genuinely don't understand the people who are saying the combat feels sluggish.

Despite the soulslike trappings of stamina and bonfires, this feels far faster and more like an action game, and in fact the devs have been saying as much. In fact, as fast as the combat was in the demo I recall hearing the devs saying that it gets MUCH MUCH faster as the game progresses.

I'm not some diehard souls player...in fact I have never played any of the Dark Souls games, nor Elden Ring, nor Bloodborne, nor any of the offshoot games like Lords of the Fallen, Thymesia, etc. I still haven't even played the original Demon's Souls though the PS5 remake is in my backlog.

My experience with this genre really just started with Lies of P, and then a less hardcore example with Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order. I share this because I'm not the type of person to just say "Git Gud" or be elitist/hipster about the genre in any way.

Regarding the stamina system, I ended with a 20 in Endurance and rarely ran out of stamina. It also recovers so fast, that taking a second or two to reposition or heal added to the enjoyable pace and flow of combat.

I maxed out with 15 skill points before the demo locks progression and spent a good amount of time experimenting with different builds for each of the three weapons:

Forgive me for not remembering the exact names for each of the skills.

All 3 weapons have skill trees that let you favor parries/perfect parries ("brink guard") or dodges/perfect dodges ("brink dodge").

I experimented with both but favor guarding as the 1. the feeling of hitting that perfect parry is so satisfying and I also took the skill that damages enemies when brink guarding.

However dodging is also very satisfying with the afterimage effect, but because the dodge includes movement it can make positioning tricky sometimes so I went back to primarily focusing on guarding most of the time.

Because you start the dual-wield that's the one I ended up favoring. I have no idea why people think the combat is sluggish. The dual wield is So fast. There's a skill that makes your charged heavy into a thrust that injures the target and starts stacking more damage against them and it makes the charged heavy come out VERY fast.

The other skill I spec'ed into was the whirlwind skill where you follow a swift r1 with potent r2 and then a second r2 buzz saws you back down. It's already very fast but then the upgrade for it makes it even faster.

I also took the skills that let you dodge-attack, and perform an extra sprint attack or a charged sprint attack.

For the Greatsword again, this was way faster than most soulslike heavy weapons. Specifically there's a skill that lets you charge your light attack, a skill that lets you follow up a light attack with a swift heavy, dodge attacks that make it come out faster, and skills that let you attack very fast from a brink guard.

Overall it's meant to be more reactive compared to the naked aggression of the dual wield. I definitely enjoyed it, but as I was putting so much time into grinding I ended up favoring the aggressive dual wield just to get through farming loops faster.

Lastly there's the spear. This was my least favorite because of the lower damage, again because I was farming at the end, and it's much more technical. It's also the last weapon you find, and so have the least time with. The main skill tree requires a 3 hit combo to land in order to enter a 15 second stance with some cool abilities, but because I was killing enemies so quickly I didn't get to enjoy them much. It also seems to favor a perfect dodge style of play.

I didn't mess with the spirit gauge powers much, or rather I tried all of them, but didn't stick with them, because of the limited skill point cap of the demo. In the common skill tress there's 5 skills that let you build up your spirit gauge much faster which in the full game will let you spam the spirit powers constantly but I was having more fun with the non gauged skills.

All in all, and because the game will apparently have multiple endings and NG+ I will enjoy a playthrough with each of the weapons in turn.

I ended up grinding my way to Level 56 mostly on the last farming loop before the Blade Phantom. I leveled all attributes to 20, except for strength which I put at 25 in order to equip the Ashen Wolf top and arms and still keep A weight.

I actually somewhat regret over-leveling as when I finally faced the Blade Phantom I beat him in only 5 attempts because I was able to take and dish out enough damage (I was low on health and out of nether-healing though).

I wish I would have intentionally died more on the first phase because he has a very interesting delay on his attacks and I would have enjoyed mastering the feeling of the timing on the for brink guarding (I am someone who likes to feel the rhythm of parries) but from the Devs AMA it sounds like we'll be able to replay levels and there will be a boss rush mode at some point.

Overall, I LOVED the aesthetic. The combat felt VERY good, and in fact I'd say it's MUCH easier than Lies of P which was my favorite game of 2023. LoP had an insanely tight parry window, imho too tight, as it surpassed the reaction time of most people and with the delayed attacks could *feel* off... whereas Khazan feels a bit more forgiving in a good way that still requires skill but not insanely so. There are still enemies with timing delays like Blade Phantom or the Yetis but once you get the feel they become very intuitive and satisfying.

The game is also VERY well optmized. I ran in with my 2080ti in 4k V-synched at 60 fps and had next to no stutters. I tried with DLSS on and off but didn't notice a difference (2080ti doesn't have frame gen though so YMMV).

The story is basic anime revenge, but the art design, the enemy and world design, and the feeling of combat are phenomenal. That and the fact that the devs were confident enough to put out a demo of this size and polish 2 MONTHS prior to release is similar to Lies of P, and my experience was enough to convince me to preorder which I almost never do.

I can already tell this is going to be my personal GotY.

I hope my detailed account is informative and useful for someone. I'd love to hear your thoughts, either agree or disagree in the comments below, but heads up, I don't have the energy to argue online these days so I hope that even if you disagree with my experience, you will do so in a respectful and productive manner. After all, games are supposed to be fun. :)

[Chacheya1G]

Lies of P puts this to shame, easily.

[Snow]

Originally posted by Ronin Krieg:

First of all, I genuinely don't understand the people who are saying the combat feels sluggish.

Despite the soulslike trappings of stamina and bonfires, this feels far faster and more like an action game, and in fact the devs have been saying as much. In fact, as fast as the combat was in the demo I recall hearing the devs saying that it gets MUCH MUCH faster as the game progresses.

I'm not some diehard souls player...in fact I have never played any of the Dark Souls games, nor Elden Ring, nor Bloodborne, nor any of the offshoot games like Lords of the Fallen, Thymesia, etc. I still haven't even played the original Demon's Souls though the PS5 remake is in my backlog.

My experience with this genre really just started with Lies of P, and then a less hardcore example with Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order. I share this because I'm not the type of person to just say "Git Gud" or be elitist/hipster about the genre in any way.

Regarding the stamina system, I ended with a 20 in Endurance and rarely ran out of stamina. It also recovers so fast, that taking a second or two to reposition or heal added to the enjoyable pace and flow of combat.

I maxed out with 15 skill points before the demo locks progression and spent a good amount of time experimenting with different builds for each of the three weapons:

Forgive me for not remembering the exact names for each of the skills.

All 3 weapons have skill trees that let you favor parries/perfect parries ("brink guard") or dodges/perfect dodges ("brink dodge").

I experimented with both but favor guarding as the 1. the feeling of hitting that perfect parry is so satisfying and I also took the skill that damages enemies when brink guarding.

However dodging is also very satisfying with the afterimage effect, but because the dodge includes movement it can make positioning tricky sometimes so I went back to primarily focusing on guarding most of the time.

Because you start the dual-wield that's the one I ended up favoring. I have no idea why people think the combat is sluggish. The dual wield is So fast. There's a skill that makes your charged heavy into a thrust that injures the target and starts stacking more damage against them and it makes the charged heavy come out VERY fast.

The other skill I spec'ed into was the whirlwind skill where you follow a swift r1 with potent r2 and then a second r2 buzz saws you back down. It's already very fast but then the upgrade for it makes it even faster.

I also took the skills that let you dodge-attack, and perform an extra sprint attack or a charged sprint attack.

For the Greatsword again, this was way faster than most soulslike heavy weapons. Specifically there's a skill that lets you charge your light attack, a skill that lets you follow up a light attack with a swift heavy, dodge attacks that make it come out faster, and skills that let you attack very fast from a brink guard.

Overall it's meant to be more reactive compared to the naked aggression of the dual wield. I definitely enjoyed it, but as I was putting so much time into grinding I ended up favoring the aggressive dual wield just to get through farming loops faster.

Lastly there's the spear. This was my least favorite because of the lower damage, again because I was farming at the end, and it's much more technical. It's also the last weapon you find, and so have the least time with. The main skill tree requires a 3 hit combo to land in order to enter a 15 second stance with some cool abilities, but because I was killing enemies so quickly I didn't get to enjoy them much. It also seems to favor a perfect dodge style of play.

I didn't mess with the spirit gauge powers much, or rather I tried all of them, but didn't stick with them, because of the limited skill point cap of the demo. In the common skill tress there's 5 skills that let you build up your spirit gauge much faster which in the full game will let you spam the spirit powers constantly but I was having more fun with the non gauged skills.

All in all, and because the game will apparently have multiple endings and NG+ I will enjoy a playthrough with each of the weapons in turn.

I ended up grinding my way to Level 56 mostly on the last farming loop before the Blade Phantom. I leveled all attributes to 20, except for strength which I put at 25 in order to equip the Ashen Wolf top and arms and still keep A weight.

I actually somewhat regret over-leveling as when I finally faced the Blade Phantom I beat him in only 5 attempts because I was able to take and dish out enough damage (I was low on health and out of nether-healing though).

I wish I would have intentionally died more on the first phase because he has a very interesting delay on his attacks and I would have enjoyed mastering the feeling of the timing on the for brink guarding (I am someone who likes to feel the rhythm of parries) but from the Devs AMA it sounds like we'll be able to replay levels and there will be a boss rush mode at some point.

Overall, I LOVED the aesthetic. The combat felt VERY good, and in fact I'd say it's MUCH easier than Lies of P which was my favorite game of 2023. LoP had an insanely tight parry window, imho too tight, as it surpassed the reaction time of most people and with the delayed attacks could *feel* off... whereas Khazan feels a bit more forgiving in a good way that still requires skill but not insanely so. There are still enemies with timing delays like Blade Phantom or the Yetis but once you get the feel they become very intuitive and satisfying.

The game is also VERY well optmized. I ran in with my 2080ti in 4k V-synched at 60 fps and had next to no stutters. I tried with DLSS on and off but didn't notice a difference (2080ti doesn't have frame gen though so YMMV).

The story is basic anime revenge, but the art design, the enemy and world design, and the feeling of combat are phenomenal. That and the fact that the devs were confident enough to put out a demo of this size and polish 2 MONTHS prior to release is similar to Lies of P, and my experience was enough to convince me to preorder which I almost never do.

I can already tell this is going to be my personal GotY.

I hope my detailed account is informative and useful for someone. I'd love to hear your thoughts, either agree or disagree in the comments below, but heads up, I don't have the energy to argue online these days so I hope that even if you disagree with my experience, you will do so in a respectful and productive manner. After all, games are supposed to be fun. :)

if you havent played any of the souls games including sekiro your missing out this game is trash compared to them and does indeed feel sluggish not so much in speed but feeling, for good example why does the greatswords charging light attack go into a shoulder bash for a massive cleave weapon instead of a swing? why do enemies have perfect tracking so even if i dodge out of the way of an attack the immediate followup turns them 360 degrees to smack me perfectly over the head?
whatever the Chinese think is good gameplay is the opposite hell black myth wukong sucked ass in my opinon it was super pretty but very very boring.

[Frid]

Originally posted by Ronin Krieg:

First of all, I genuinely don't understand the people who are saying the combat feels sluggish.

Despite the soulslike trappings of stamina and bonfires, this feels far faster and more like an action game, and in fact the devs have been saying as much. In fact, as fast as the combat was in the demo I recall hearing the devs saying that it gets MUCH MUCH faster as the game progresses.

I'm not some diehard souls player...in fact I have never played any of the Dark Souls games, nor Elden Ring, nor Bloodborne, nor any of the offshoot games like Lords of the Fallen, Thymesia, etc. I still haven't even played the original Demon's Souls though the PS5 remake is in my backlog.

My experience with this genre really just started with Lies of P, and then a less hardcore example with Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order. I share this because I'm not the type of person to just say "Git Gud" or be elitist/hipster about the genre in any way.

Regarding the stamina system, I ended with a 20 in Endurance and rarely ran out of stamina. It also recovers so fast, that taking a second or two to reposition or heal added to the enjoyable pace and flow of combat.

I maxed out with 15 skill points before the demo locks progression and spent a good amount of time experimenting with different builds for each of the three weapons:

Forgive me for not remembering the exact names for each of the skills.

All 3 weapons have skill trees that let you favor parries/perfect parries ("brink guard") or dodges/perfect dodges ("brink dodge").

I experimented with both but favor guarding as the 1. the feeling of hitting that perfect parry is so satisfying and I also took the skill that damages enemies when brink guarding.

However dodging is also very satisfying with the afterimage effect, but because the dodge includes movement it can make positioning tricky sometimes so I went back to primarily focusing on guarding most of the time.

Because you start the dual-wield that's the one I ended up favoring. I have no idea why people think the combat is sluggish. The dual wield is So fast. There's a skill that makes your charged heavy into a thrust that injures the target and starts stacking more damage against them and it makes the charged heavy come out VERY fast.

The other skill I spec'ed into was the whirlwind skill where you follow a swift r1 with potent r2 and then a second r2 buzz saws you back down. It's already very fast but then the upgrade for it makes it even faster.

I also took the skills that let you dodge-attack, and perform an extra sprint attack or a charged sprint attack.

For the Greatsword again, this was way faster than most soulslike heavy weapons. Specifically there's a skill that lets you charge your light attack, a skill that lets you follow up a light attack with a swift heavy, dodge attacks that make it come out faster, and skills that let you attack very fast from a brink guard.

Overall it's meant to be more reactive compared to the naked aggression of the dual wield. I definitely enjoyed it, but as I was putting so much time into grinding I ended up favoring the aggressive dual wield just to get through farming loops faster.

Lastly there's the spear. This was my least favorite because of the lower damage, again because I was farming at the end, and it's much more technical. It's also the last weapon you find, and so have the least time with. The main skill tree requires a 3 hit combo to land in order to enter a 15 second stance with some cool abilities, but because I was killing enemies so quickly I didn't get to enjoy them much. It also seems to favor a perfect dodge style of play.

I didn't mess with the spirit gauge powers much, or rather I tried all of them, but didn't stick with them, because of the limited skill point cap of the demo. In the common skill tress there's 5 skills that let you build up your spirit gauge much faster which in the full game will let you spam the spirit powers constantly but I was having more fun with the non gauged skills.

All in all, and because the game will apparently have multiple endings and NG+ I will enjoy a playthrough with each of the weapons in turn.

I ended up grinding my way to Level 56 mostly on the last farming loop before the Blade Phantom. I leveled all attributes to 20, except for strength which I put at 25 in order to equip the Ashen Wolf top and arms and still keep A weight.

I actually somewhat regret over-leveling as when I finally faced the Blade Phantom I beat him in only 5 attempts because I was able to take and dish out enough damage (I was low on health and out of nether-healing though).

I wish I would have intentionally died more on the first phase because he has a very interesting delay on his attacks and I would have enjoyed mastering the feeling of the timing on the for brink guarding (I am someone who likes to feel the rhythm of parries) but from the Devs AMA it sounds like we'll be able to replay levels and there will be a boss rush mode at some point.

Overall, I LOVED the aesthetic. The combat felt VERY good, and in fact I'd say it's MUCH easier than Lies of P which was my favorite game of 2023. LoP had an insanely tight parry window, imho too tight, as it surpassed the reaction time of most people and with the delayed attacks could *feel* off... whereas Khazan feels a bit more forgiving in a good way that still requires skill but not insanely so. There are still enemies with timing delays like Blade Phantom or the Yetis but once you get the feel they become very intuitive and satisfying.

The game is also VERY well optmized. I ran in with my 2080ti in 4k V-synched at 60 fps and had next to no stutters. I tried with DLSS on and off but didn't notice a difference (2080ti doesn't have frame gen though so YMMV).

The story is basic anime revenge, but the art design, the enemy and world design, and the feeling of combat are phenomenal. That and the fact that the devs were confident enough to put out a demo of this size and polish 2 MONTHS prior to release is similar to Lies of P, and my experience was enough to convince me to preorder which I almost never do.

I can already tell this is going to be my personal GotY.

I hope my detailed account is informative and useful for someone. I'd love to hear your thoughts, either agree or disagree in the comments below, but heads up, I don't have the energy to argue online these days so I hope that even if you disagree with my experience, you will do so in a respectful and productive manner. After all, games are supposed to be fun. :)

if you like this should play Sekiro.
surprisingly it says u own it.

[Arc]

How and why would you spend 20 hours in a demo with maybe 5 enemies outside of bosses, barely any weapon or attack variety and nothing to see or do beyond fight

[sgrey]

Originally posted by Arc:

How and why would you spend 20 hours in a demo with maybe 5 enemies outside of bosses, barely any weapon or attack variety and nothing to see or do beyond fight

By playing it multiple times with different builds and skills, checking what works better and such.

[Ronin Krieg]

Originally posted by Arc:

How and why would you spend 20 hours in a demo with maybe 5 enemies outside of bosses, barely any weapon or attack variety and nothing to see or do beyond fight

I explained this in my post. Grinding up my level/attributes and experimenting with different combat options and styles.

[Ronin Krieg]

Originally posted by Frid:

surprisingly it says u own it.

Yes I own Sekiro in my backlog. Tbh I sort of lost the inclination to play it because I'm particular about aesthetics and enemy art design and it just wasn't to my taste.

Also I watched all the Vaati lore videos and it didn't grab me.

Maybe I'll get to it someday but I have at least 20-30 games I want to play next and I have a young kid so...

[Ronin Krieg]

Originally posted by Chacheya1G:

Lies of P puts this to shame, easily.

I played through LoP 3 times, well over 100 hours and maxed out every attribute.

Very excited for the DLC and sequel to that game, but I rather love the speed and power fantasy here with Khazan.

It's not *really* a soulslike at all. MUCH faster like a character action game, with the added tactical element of stamina and animation locking.

[Ronin Krieg]

Originally posted by Loli God:

if you havent played any of the souls games including sekiro your missing out this game is trash compared to them and does indeed feel sluggish not so much in speed but feeling, for good example why does the greatswords charging light attack go into a shoulder bash for a massive cleave weapon instead of a swing? why do enemies have perfect tracking so even if i dodge out of the way of an attack the immediate followup turns them 360 degrees to smack me perfectly over the head?
whatever the Chinese think is good gameplay is the opposite hell black myth wukong sucked ass in my opinon it was super pretty but very very boring.

You are entitled to your opinion of course. I'm not comparing this game to any other game really. I'm sharing my personal experience and feeling of the game. It wasn't sluggish at all on my rig. VERY fast paced and responsive combat. Perfect dodges (brink) worked perfectly for me.

One thing I've noticed is that people who compare games expecting them to feel the same often hinder themselves because they need to unlearn their muscle memory and adapt to new systems and timing.

[Arc]

I just stood in one spot parry mash attack for the most part
Same way you play Wo Long
Same way you play Sekiro, presumably
Not a fan of parry-to-win

[Ronin Krieg]

Originally posted by Arc:

I just stood in one spot parry mash attack for the most part
Same way you play Wo Long
Same way you play Sekiro, presumably
Not a fan of parry-to-win

...then don't. Spec into dodge, or aggro. Game let's YOU choose your preferred playstyle. It's not like Sekiro which (I'm told) is designed to FORCE you into a parry style...