A team of 30 people just made a better Atlus game than Atlus did with Metaphor

[Lvl 10]

Clair Obscur just came out and it surpasses Metaphor on so many levels it's not even funny.
And the funny thing about it was made by a studio of 30 people....

It has:
Better story
Better written characters
Better combat system
Better environment design and visuals
More variety both in terms of enemy and environment
More attention to details

Atlus: B-b-but we have brand recognition, and our loyal fans who will glaze over everything.

[Hutetu]

Is it not possible to enjoy both games without having to pit them towards each other?

[some gay lion]

it sounds like you didn't like metaphor and you're looking for people to validate your reasons for buying the game and spending your time on it instead of going to a clair community and thriving with the people already there

[Zopheir]

Originally posted by Hutetu:

Is it not possible to enjoy both games without having to pit them towards each other?

Originally posted by some gay lion:

it sounds like you didn't like metaphor and you're looking for people to validate your reasons for buying the game and spending your time on it instead of going to a clair community and thriving with the people already there

OP expressed many times why they don't like this game months ago but it seems they are still obsessed with this game.


OP, your dedication to hating something is honestly more impressive than anything you've ever accomplished in your own life, I bet. Did Sandfall Interactive reject your application to be a dev or something?

[Nibbie]

Haven't played it, but it looks different enough that I don't think its a direct comparison. I couldn't find much information on how the game plays out of battle, but it seems like more of just a dungeon crawler, while Metaphor has the calendar system. Even in battle, other than being turn based there seems very little comparison. Metaphor is mainly about hitting weaknesses and manipulating turn icons, while Clair uses an active system with hit timing and reactions, closer to a Paper Mario than it is to Metaphor. Looks neat though, added it to my wishlist to maybe play at some point, because it turns out you can play and enjoy more than one game, even in the same genre.

[Dex]

I agree that Atlas could do a LOT better, but Expedition 33 isn't the 2nd coming of RPG Jesus.

[BahamutXero]

Originally posted by Nibbie:

Haven't played it, but it looks different enough that I don't think its a direct comparison. I couldn't find much information on how the game plays out of battle, but it seems like more of just a dungeon crawler, while Metaphor has the calendar system. Even in battle, other than being turn based there seems very little comparison. Metaphor is mainly about hitting weaknesses and manipulating turn icons, while Clair uses an active system with hit timing and reactions, closer to a Paper Mario than it is to Metaphor. Looks neat though, added it to my wishlist to maybe play at some point, because it turns out you can play and enjoy more than one game, even in the same genre.

Thanks for the summary Nibbie! I have put it on my wishlist as well, but I have a huge backlog at the moment, so I'll be holding off. Looking forward to seeing more reviews/footage of it before I buy.

[Noir]

There isn't really a need for comparison. Atlus has not improved (or changed really) their formula for the last 20 years. The gameplay is really stale. The characters / bond events aren't really great either. I expected Metaphor to be this new type Persona / SMT game that pushes the franchises forward. Instead, it was just the same thing with tons of enemy reskins (even bosses) and a more limited Persona style combat system. Even the archetypes were infinitely less interesting and had much less variation than the Persona have. I can't think of another game as massively overrated for no apparent reason than Metaphor.

[BahamutXero]

Originally posted by Noir:

There isn't really a need for comparison. Atlus has not improved (or changed really) their formula for the last 20 years. The gameplay is really stale. The characters / bond events aren't really great either. I expected Metaphor to be this new type Persona / SMT game that pushes the franchises forward. Instead, it was just the same thing with tons of enemy reskins (even bosses) and a more limited Persona style combat system. Even the archetypes were infinitely less interesting and had much less variation than the Persona have. I can't think of another game as massively overrated for no apparent reason than Metaphor.

While I can understand most of this, at least the setting wasn't a high school, and it had an a young adult cast, which hasn't been seen since P2EP. Also, Moore didn't have a long nose, or wear blue, and Plateau is a best cat boi.

[Drakeeper]

Lolno. And this is coming from someone who's extensively played both. You're going to have to try a bit harder for that jester award I'm afraid.

[Exarch_Alpha]

Undertale is better AND cheaper.

Delete your post, honestly

[SKINLESSHEAD]

Not with that game's presentation. It ripped off the ui big time though.

[Glory of the Snow]

Bro doesn't even own the game and straight up rage baiting for award point

[Gannibal Kujoe]

Straight up lie. Clair obscur made Unreal slop and you eat it up because the characters look realistically European. Sandfall literally didn't do ANYTHING original. They stole everything Japan made, from game system to environments to even the story line of a dying world.

All that was added were European models and actors and now people are calling Atlus and other Japanese houses what? Stale? Not but ten seconds ago everybody was trying to lay down their lives to defend Japan against Yasuke. Now everybody wants to spit on Japan while Sandfall rips off a plethora of JRPGS, to make their little cinematic QTE Dodge and parry system. That is innovation?

Japan's mistake is being NICE. It's mistake was carrying their European/Japan aesthetic too far. Because now certain gamers are half stepping.

[pixet]

Originally posted by Gannibal Kujoe:

Straight up lie. Clair obscur made Unreal slop and you eat it up because the characters look realistically European. Sandfall literally didn't do ANYTHING original. They stole everything Japan made, from game system to environments to even the story line of a dying world.

All that was added were European models and actors and now people are calling Atlus and other Japanese houses what? Stale? Not but ten seconds ago everybody was trying to lay down their lives to defend Japan against Yasuke. Now everybody wants to spit on Japan while Sandfall rips off a plethora of JRPGS, to make their little cinematic QTE Dodge and parry system. That is innovation?

Japan's mistake is being NICE. It's mistake was carrying their European/Japan aesthetic too far. Because now certain gamers are half stepping.

What are you talking about?

By the way the thing I like about Expedition 33's system so far are the character-exclusive mechanics and how the skills are designed around them, in addition to the level of detail those same skill contain. I only really got the hang of Maelle's skill tree (Half of Gustave's is locked) but from that alone I can tell there was thought put into the game design and identity of each character.

Back to the comparison between that and Atlus, but I also like how Atlus games treat their skill pool as a simple language to tell a complex story about their builds through how they're arranged and combined. That comes at a price since it means you need as few active skills as possible while passives are highly recommended. Usually a 5-3 balance in number of skills works in the Persona series, but I like going for 3-5 with an overwhelming amount of passives--the jazz club in P5R can teach your party members passive skills during the third semester. That actually adds some replay value for me lol, P3R could really benefit from that level of personalization.

[Gannibal Kujoe]

Originally posted by pixet:

Originally posted by Gannibal Kujoe:

Straight up lie. Clair obscur made Unreal slop and you eat it up because the characters look realistically European. Sandfall literally didn't do ANYTHING original. They stole everything Japan made, from game system to environments to even the story line of a dying world.

All that was added were European models and actors and now people are calling Atlus and other Japanese houses what? Stale? Not but ten seconds ago everybody was trying to lay down their lives to defend Japan against Yasuke. Now everybody wants to spit on Japan while Sandfall rips off a plethora of JRPGS, to make their little cinematic QTE Dodge and parry system. That is innovation?

Japan's mistake is being NICE. It's mistake was carrying their European/Japan aesthetic too far. Because now certain gamers are half stepping.

What are you talking about?

By the way the thing I like about Expedition 33's system so far are the character-exclusive mechanics and how the skills are designed around them, in addition to the level of detail those same skill contain. I only really got the hang of Maelle's skill tree (Half of Gustave's is locked) but from that alone I can tell there was thought put into the game design and identity of each character.

All games have thought and design put into them. Other things I hear about this game, I would like to address.

"The Acting is really GOOD"

Yup they hired professional actors and popular voices. To bad that doesn't translate into actual animation.

"The world is really GOOD"

Yup the setting is ONE large biome with various colors. It's set in high contrast to make it look as if there is variation. The games setting is in a ruin of rocks and wood based complexes.

"The combat design is Peak"

No, no it is not, the combat design is built around dodging and parrying in place and QTE.

Those "character-exclusive mechanics" Have little to no variation beyond different color VFX and stat boost. If you ignore dodge and parry in the game and the timing element of the QTE, your will most definitely have a bad time. That is just adding Action RPG elements into turn-base game-play without the freedom of movement action RPGs are designed around.

How many Archtypes are in Metaphor? Then there are spells. Your environment Drastically changes in top tier JRPGs. Meanwhile in Clair not even Gustave's winning pose in the tournament is different. It is the exact same thing he does as a skill to buff his party. Driving his sword into the ground and pointing his gun.

The amount of refused animation with only subtle changes is astounding in Clair. When the Japanese do this, they are attacked. When Sandfall does this, it is PEAK? That dog just don't hunt.

The Gestral Village you find in the game is the same exact set from where you start the game. Sandfall just changed the set piece from surreal urban, to surreal rural. Streamers and publications can't up sell me on this game.

It has a nice presentation, beautiful models in an UNREAL slop world. The game offers far less summons, magic, and skills than the average JRPG. Enemy variety is interesting but by no means can we call them a myriad. So where is this Glaze of Peak gaming coming from?

Dodging, Parrying, QTE, and European Aesthetic. Plain and simple. This game's battle system isn't even as innovative as Legend of Heroes Daybreak. In that game you free attack, move and actually position your character to do their abilities. You don't just stand in a row, and press dodge block in place with QTE actions.

But Nihon Falcom does not have graphics or presentation of Sandfall. That is fair, but to say Clair is some sort of deep blah blah blah. With Peak yada yada yada is bs. The only thing peak about the game is the price, brilliant move. We can debate that this game's setting isn't in high-school nor are we following minors, that is a welcomed change. But nah, this game isn't teaching Atlus anything young, fresh, and new.

The visual progressions of attacks and defense in this game is legit stagnant. You get PIctos, they are basically stat changes like one more AP, to spam the same move. Your Lumina small in number, you just get more points.

If this game came from Atlus or Square it would not be getting praised. I am not telling you what you should and shouldn't like. Nor am I saying the game isn't visually imaginative. But there just isn't anyway this game is deep or some how compelling beyond presentation. I come to play games, not watch them. Cut scenes are great they just aren't paramount.