I'm Sure Atlus Never Made Games With Real-World Subtext

[mdesaleah]

(looks over at practically all of their games, from Soul Hackers to Persona 5 to Catherine to SMT4 to even SMT 1/2)

Nope, theyve never made any real-world statements at all :D

(seriously, how many of you just apparently plugged your ears the entire time P5 kept talking about how rich and powerful 'adults' abuse their positions and how systems are kept in place to hold them up. It was never subtle lol)

[proctorsilex]

Personally I think it's nice to have more Japanese games coming out nowadays with less cringey fanservice. I don't need scantily clad anime chicks with watermelons on their chests bouncing around fighting monsters; I'd rather play games with more realistic proportions, costumes, actual armor, etc.

If games shifting away from the mindset that women are only good as sex objects counts as censorship, then please keep it coming

[mdesaleah]

Originally posted by proctorsilex:

Personally I think it's nice to have more Japanese games coming out nowadays with less cringey fanservice. I don't need scantily clad anime chicks with watermelons on their chests bouncing around fighting monsters; I'd rather play games with more realistic proportions, costumes, actual armor, etc.

If games shifting away from the mindset that women are only good as sex objects counts as censorship, then please keep it coming

Less pointless hotspring nonsense, and more development with the world/story/characters thank you.

[Splinter of Chaos]

Originally posted by proctorsilex:

If games shifting away from the mindset that women are only good as sex objects counts as censorship, then please keep it coming

I feel like the whole "sexualization = objectification" mindset is something that was historically very true of American and European cinema, and I think the "male gaze" theory really hit the nail on the head, but I feel like it's been oversimplified over the years. If you take out the beach scene from Persona 3, do Mitsuru, Yukari, and Fuuka suddenly become better written and deeper characters? If you leave it in do they become poorly written and shallow characters?

Adults are attracted to each other's bodies and I believe that fanservice which recognizes this without sacrificing the volition, agency, or depth of its female characters, nor the plot, is not necessarily a bad thing in moderation. (Though the fact that those characters are so young while the fanbase has grown significantly older is another issue...)

More in response to the general discussion:

The Persona series was about a bunch of highschoolers awaking strange and uncomfortable new powers and needing to take on adult responsibilities while working through their more immature tendencies and so it's really hard for me to not think of it as one big metaphor for puberty. On the flip side, Metaphor feels more like a gritty Game of Thrones-feeling story than typical anime fantasy, and with a cast of people who have already transitioned into adulthood and so the fanservicy high-school mentality I think would be a bit less appropriate. I don't think this is censorship or influence by activists because the way characters are portrayed in this game feels consistent with the themes being discussed and the mood of the story and art direction.

Also, there's still the Palipus (I'm guessing the spelling of パリパス) who looks like a scantily-clad amazonian warrior with unrealistic armor designed more for aesthetic than practicality.

EDIT: Steam censored the blue-haired girl's name that starts with F!?

[proctorsilex]

To clarify I have no problem with some games being more sexually themed and having some "fanservice" - I'm just tired of that being the standard expectation, and games that go a different direction are called censored etc. There are people who want to play games for reasons other than appeals to horniness, There's plenty of room in the market for everything spanning the hentai/ecchi/average/chaste spectrum.

[N/A]

Originally posted by Splinter of Chaos:

Originally posted by proctorsilex:

If games shifting away from the mindset that women are only good as sex objects counts as censorship, then please keep it coming

I feel like the whole "sexualization = objectification" mindset is something that was historically very true of American and European cinema, and I think the "male gaze" theory really hit the nail on the head, but I feel like it's been oversimplified over the years. If you take out the beach scene from Persona 3, do Mitsuru, Yukari, and Fuuka suddenly become better written and deeper characters? If you leave it in do they become poorly written and shallow characters?

Adults are attracted to each other's bodies and I believe that fanservice which recognizes this without sacrificing the volition, agency, or depth of its female characters, nor the plot, is not necessarily a bad thing in moderation. (Though the fact that those characters are so young while the fanbase has grown significantly older is another issue...)

More in response to the general discussion:

The Persona series was about a bunch of highschoolers awaking strange and uncomfortable new powers and needing to take on adult responsibilities while working through their more immature tendencies and so it's really hard for me to not think of it as one big metaphor for puberty. On the flip side, Metaphor feels more like a gritty Game of Thrones-feeling story than typical anime fantasy, and with a cast of people who have already transitioned into adulthood and so the fanservicy high-school mentality I think would be a bit less appropriate. I don't think this is censorship or influence by activists because the way characters are portrayed in this game feels consistent with the themes being discussed and the mood of the story and art direction.

Also, there's still the Palipus (I'm guessing the spelling of パリパス) who looks like a scantily-clad amazonian warrior with unrealistic armor designed more for aesthetic than practicality.

EDIT: Steam censored the blue-haired girl's name that starts with F!?

They sure do! Just call her Yamagishi or P3's navigator. As for the Paripat Paripus? Palipus? She is a brawler so it makes since that she would wear less clothes for easier movement. Name an mma fighter or fighter period who doesn't wear what's practically underwear or a bathrobe/pajamas. In her case i'd say it's a matter of form following function.

[Spoonardo]

A troll post by someone who doesn't even own the game.

[Griever]

Originally posted by mdesaleah:

There is a fix for this.
Go outside, touch the grass on the ground, then come back.

I'm sick and tired of people and responses like yours.
His comment was completely civil. Were you not educated to answer properly?
Are you a teenager with bad parenting?

Regardless of the sides in the argument, write properly on the internet.
Treat people how you would treat them face to face in a conversation.

[Griever]

It's too bad that games don't dare to be daring when they intend to go with a dark fantasy M rating. FF16 was the most daring game in that regard recently, although unfortunately it dropped the dark atmosphere for a "kill God" plot by mid game.

[DrKold]

Originally posted by mdesaleah:

Originally posted by Diabolical Taco:

It's almost like it's just a fictional story rooted in real world themes. Heaven forbid your world view ever be challenged. Sorry your precious safe space was pierced.

Agreed.

Going into a fantasy setting and going “where’s the fanservice” should be a sign that the problem isn’t the game, it’s with their own wants

I dont think its a problem that people want fanservice its neither good nor bad.

Or should i call you "problematic" for being prude ? Or scared of beauty ? Thats nonsense.
Fanservice is not hurting a game in fact i think its quite the opposite and most people dont have a problem with fanservice or event want it in their games.
There was a suvery from bandai not too long ago where the majority of people voted for more beautiful characters in game, thhat speaks for itself.

Personally, i have no problem with fanservice excisting or not, it doesnt make a game good or bad for me.

Originally posted by Griever:

Originally posted by mdesaleah:

There is a fix for this.
Go outside, touch the grass on the ground, then come back.

I'm sick and tired of people and responses like yours.
His comment was completely civil. Were you not educated to answer properly?
Are you a teenager with bad parenting?

Regardless of the sides in the argument, write properly on the internet.
Treat people how you would treat them face to face in a conversation.

Its one of the dumbest arguments of all time and as i said before might as well be just that person letting out a fart.

[Ka3sa]

Maybe they forgot that God, the Christian God is the ultimate bad guy in more than half of the games they released.

[JCKLNTRN]

Originally posted by DrKold:

Fanservice is not hurting a game in fact i think its quite the opposite and most people dont have a problem with fanservice or event want it in their games.

That really depends on how it's handled. I don't mind the way it's done in the more self-aware manner of Yoko Taro's games, for example, but Xenoblade 2 can feel off-puttingly skeevy, and that was a very common complaint about that game in particular.

[mdesaleah]

Originally posted by Ka3sa:

Maybe they forgot that God, the Christian God is the ultimate bad guy in more than half of the games they released.

That would involve actually playing SMT games.

And we only now got to a point where Persona fans are actually playing Persona games lol.

[Lucius]

Originally posted by mdesaleah:

Originally posted by Ka3sa:

Maybe they forgot that God, the Christian God is the ultimate bad guy in more than half of the games they released.

That would involve actually playing SMT games.

And we only now got to a point where Persona fans are actually playing Persona games lol.

ONE MORE GOD REJECTED

[mdesaleah]

Originally posted by JCKLNTRN:

Originally posted by DrKold:

Fanservice is not hurting a game in fact i think its quite the opposite and most people dont have a problem with fanservice or event want it in their games.

That really depends on how it's handled. I don't mind the way it's done in the more self-aware manner of Yoko Taro's games, for example, but Xenoblade 2 can feel off-puttingly skeevy, and that was a very common complaint about that game in particular.

Yoko Taro has good examples of that cause its usually done with a purpose.

Its a major aspect of both Zero in Drakengard 3, and Kaine in Nier that only gets more obvious the more you play those games and read outside material.

Xenoblade 2 is a really good example of how not to do it.

[DrKold]

Originally posted by JCKLNTRN:

Originally posted by DrKold:

Fanservice is not hurting a game in fact i think its quite the opposite and most people dont have a problem with fanservice or event want it in their games.

That really depends on how it's handled. I don't mind the way it's done in the more self-aware manner of Yoko Taro's games, for example, but Xenoblade 2 can feel off-puttingly skeevy, and that was a very common complaint about that game in particular.

Originally posted by mdesaleah:

Originally posted by JCKLNTRN:

That really depends on how it's handled. I don't mind the way it's done in the more self-aware manner of Yoko Taro's games, for example, but Xenoblade 2 can feel off-puttingly skeevy, and that was a very common complaint about that game in particular.

Yoko Taro has good examples of that cause its usually done with a purpose.

Its a major aspect of both Zero in Drakengard 3, and Kaine in Nier that only gets more obvious the more you play those games and read outside material.

Xenoblade 2 is a really good example of how not to do it.

I havent heard anyone complaining about it so it sounds like anecdotal evidence and personal preference to me.

My experience is that most people either dont care or are in favor of it.
I mean just look at those asian gacha games with millions of players and tons of fanservice in it.

Off-putting it may be, to you that is but most people are not so prudish.