no switching archetypes on the fly

[Peter_Paradox]

this ♥♥♥♥ really pisses me off.. thankfully the games really forgiving with its restarts/retrys but every single ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ time ive ever needed to not have a "specific" weakness for some boss enemy I ALWAYS HAPPEN TO HAVE IT.. and this snowballs the boss into otherwise impossible.. of course i can just swap that ♥♥♥♥ out upon taking the L and reloading... But the fact our main hero at least cant swap ♥♥♥♥ out on the fly... really irks the ♥♥♥♥ out of me. Its just stupid luck at the end of the day.. your so ham stringed into whatever strategy youve selected for the time... its just a huge waste of my time and kind of "gamey" to just restart the fights over and over till you find the SINGLE weakness an enemy has. And thats another issue all together, you can barely exploit anything meaningfully unless you meta knowledge the fights using the L's you take.. Its a great game, but coming from persona and shin megami this single difference in the game really puts it beneath the former titles. Your grinding for 2 sets of levels as opposed to 1, and your hardly ever going to get meaningful abilities unless you run 2 of the same type of archetype.

[Johnathon Fortnite]

Not being able to swap, and archetypes being the way they are is my major gripe with this game. I love it but I'm never replaying it to say the least. There's a lot of design flaws that drive me nuts lol.

[Star Sage]

This, I think, is designed to justify having more than 3 party members join 'The Traveler' since it means you can equip THEM with different classes later, to encourage you to keep everyone leveled, and to spread out the party mechanic as they add more and more archetypes to it.

[Dagný]

So you guys just want persona?

[Peter_Paradox]

Originally posted by Star Sage:

This, I think, is designed to justify having more than 3 party members join 'The Traveler' since it means you can equip THEM with different classes later, to encourage you to keep everyone leveled, and to spread out the party mechanic as they add more and more archetypes to it.

every single archetype is underwhelming though.. you only get all of 5 abilities with any one, specialization, or advanced... and at most you can claim 3 other traits from other archetypes to go along with it.. But whats more important is matching the archetypes defenses vs what your fighting, not what abilities the archetype actually gives you as some of them are atrociously bad.. like the brawler... why would i ever want to trade HP for lackluster DPS thats dependent on being low HP..

[Peter_Paradox]

Originally posted by Dagný:

So you guys just want persona?

theres a lack of meaningful equipment/mechanics in this game to make the game stand out well enough on its own without drawing parallels to its counter-parts. Its exactly persona in all aspects except that it does all those things WORSE then the other games.. Combat should be the funnest part of this game, but its to restrictive to be. I appreciate not having the annoying slice of life high school mechanics to deal with. But they should have allowed for equipment swapping mid battle or something to make it better.. All you do is slap on whatever gets the most defense and etc and call it a day.. when there are some weapons and gear that actually have natural abilities.. LIKE IGNITERS! WHY CANT WE SWAP THEM ON THE FLY

[Klinestife]

Originally posted by Peter_Paradox:

Originally posted by Star Sage:

This, I think, is designed to justify having more than 3 party members join 'The Traveler' since it means you can equip THEM with different classes later, to encourage you to keep everyone leveled, and to spread out the party mechanic as they add more and more archetypes to it.

every single archetype is underwhelming though.. you only get all of 5 abilities with any one, specialization, or advanced... and at most you can claim 3 other traits from other archetypes to go along with it.. But whats more important is matching the archetypes defenses vs what your fighting, not what abilities the archetype actually gives you as some of them are atrociously bad.. like the brawler... why would i ever want to trade HP for lackluster DPS thats dependent on being low HP..

erm…it absolutely matters what archetypes you run and what skills they inherit. the entire endgame is based around it.

example: heismay in his ult class is the fastest character in the game, but doesn’t do much damage. you want to give him debuff abilities from the faker line so he can set the field appropriately. you can’t just swap him off of the archetype, because it has multiple abilities that are crucial to completely screwing the enemy on their turn.

the whole game is balanced around restrictions. i do wish there was a way to restart and change your archetypes without dying or restarting the game but swapping mid battle would absolutely break the system.

as for brawler, you want to run it because HP is a much more easily accessible resource than MP. if the enemy’s weak to strike, they pretty much guarantee a resourceless win.

Originally posted by Peter_Paradox:

why would i ever want to trade HP for lackluster DPS thats dependent on being low HP..

it’s also not dependent on being low hp…it gets stronger the more health you have.

[Peter_Paradox]

Originally posted by Klinestife:

Originally posted by Peter_Paradox:

every single archetype is underwhelming though.. you only get all of 5 abilities with any one, specialization, or advanced... and at most you can claim 3 other traits from other archetypes to go along with it.. But whats more important is matching the archetypes defenses vs what your fighting, not what abilities the archetype actually gives you as some of them are atrociously bad.. like the brawler... why would i ever want to trade HP for lackluster DPS thats dependent on being low HP..

erm…it absolutely matters what archetypes you run and what skills they inherit. the entire endgame is based around it.

example: heismay in his ult class is the fastest character in the game, but doesn’t do much damage. you want to give him debuff abilities from the faker line so he can set the field appropriately. you can’t just swap him off of the archetype, because it has multiple abilities that are crucial to completely screwing the enemy on their turn.

as for brawler, you want to run it because HP is a much more easily accessible resource than MP. if the enemy’s weak to strike, they pretty much guarantee a resourceless win.

Originally posted by Peter_Paradox:

why would i ever want to trade HP for lackluster DPS thats dependent on being low HP..

it’s also not dependent on being low hp…it gets stronger the more health you have.

half of brawlers move set says "better with low health on user" so idk what your talking about. And yeah, i understand the mix and match of archetypes and clearly the players are set up to use a "preferred" one based solely off the stats they get. But that in of itself is just more restrictive then i believe they intended the game to be. If anyone can be anything, then everything should be "OK" However most often you find yourself punished for trying to experiment with something or you dont get to experiment because you have to spend 10k a piece on GOOD passives and abilities to use somewhere else "PER PERSON" Its way more grindey than shin-megami for no good reason.

[Tabe]

4 characters in party each with inherit slots makes it so you can build a very flexible team. In Persona you can only swap on MC, so being able to setup all your teammates with inherited skills etc counteracts missing that imo.. And Atlus probably thought about it and therefore added the informant npcs that sell info about almost every quests boss, so you know beforehand how to setup your team

I haven't had any issues at least, I'm really loving this new way of doing things, it is refreshing. I do love Persona as well though and I bet they'll keep the way of how things work in that series

[Klinestife]

Originally posted by Peter_Paradox:

Originally posted by Klinestife:

erm…it absolutely matters what archetypes you run and what skills they inherit. the entire endgame is based around it.

example: heismay in his ult class is the fastest character in the game, but doesn’t do much damage. you want to give him debuff abilities from the faker line so he can set the field appropriately. you can’t just swap him off of the archetype, because it has multiple abilities that are crucial to completely screwing the enemy on their turn.

as for brawler, you want to run it because HP is a much more easily accessible resource than MP. if the enemy’s weak to strike, they pretty much guarantee a resourceless win.



it’s also not dependent on being low hp…it gets stronger the more health you have.

half of brawlers move set says "better with low health on user" so idk what your talking about. And yeah, i understand the mix and match of archetypes and clearly the players are set up to use a "preferred" one based solely off the stats they get. But that in of itself is just more restrictive then i believe they intended the game to be. If anyone can be anything, then everything should be "OK" However most often you find yourself punished for trying to experiment with something or you dont get to experiment because you have to spend 10k a piece on GOOD passives and abilities to use somewhere else "PER PERSON" Its way more grindey than shin-megami for no good reason.

no, it doesn’t. it says “Power proportional to caster's remaining HP.” you are misinterpreting.

there is an actual class later on that gets stronger at low hp and it’s very clearly stated. “While in the front row, increases damage of all skill proportional to HP lost.”

as for anyone can be anything being ok, that’s only true on an individual level. strohl is “okay” at being a magic user. but that doesn’t mean every single party composition is “okay”. if you go in with the wrong one, you should absolutely get spanked. changing archetypes would give you access to so much more broken ♥♥♥♥ than the devs intended, which would be a problem because you can already crit for 70k almighty damage in the late game.

i can agree with the game being grindy if you want to experiment, but i feel you’re absolutely off-point with swapping archetypes mid battle, ehich is what the whole topic title is about.

[MeldinX2]

No i like the restrictions on having classes be set. I don't want another Persona game that works the same way where you can switch around archetypes mid battle. I want to be able to strategize with what i have.

[zero]

Originally posted by Star Sage:

This, I think, is designed to justify having more than 3 party members join 'The Traveler' since it means you can equip THEM with different classes later, to encourage you to keep everyone leveled, and to spread out the party mechanic as they add more and more archetypes to it.

pretty much, you get characters to swap out to, which is like smt and its demon party tech, so you use them for if you got countered some how

[Zaph]

You can swap em out in your inventory without going to Akademia. Whatchu mean? If you're choosing the wrong one from a boss fight, just either let the boss kill you by skipping your turn, or restart the game and then switch as Autosave will save it right before you enter the boss room. Or do you mean in battle, just swapping your whole class and gear? If that's the case, most class based RPG's, at least 95% of them, do not have that feature.

[Hippopothomas]

Sounds like someone needs to use the info guy more often.

[AngelDormante]

archetypes are more like bravely default's job system than persona system. i like it and looking at it from that mentality i don't mind not having the function to swap mid-battle, but i do wish switching archetypes was a bit faster in the overworld.

[Diabolical Taco]

Shhhh, nobody tell the OP or the others who can't figure it out about things you can do with synthesis abilities if you're paying attention.