Should the Atlanteans in Myth Retold be a variant civ of Greeks

[iamborsar]

I know that many of you may say no.

For me, AoM is a nostalgia, but I think that some settings of Atlanteans in AoM Gold & EE is not reasonable.

The greatest unreasonable is the pantheon:
1) According to Plato's writing and the Fall of Trident, the Atlanteans' Patron God was Poseidon, whom cannot be worshipped in the game
2) the "titan gods" probably had the "native" Greek origins while some Olympians might actually not (some archaeologists suggested that Poseidon might have Berbers origin, Athena might have Egyptian origin, and the Twin Apollo and Artemis were from Asia-Minor). Shouldn't the Olympians be more suitable for the Atlanteans who supposed to have colonies in N. Africa and Egypt?
3) More importantly, there are now 2 civs worksipping "Greek gods".

The distinct "Atlantean" setting with the Greeks created the argument of the Atlantean military units (using Roman units) . There are already many discussion posts on the topic.

Last is the myth units. Some Atlantean myth units comes from the Native American myths (like Stymphalian Birds, it actually comes from eudocimus) Should it be better to leave some "American" civ in the future?

I would like to suggest the following remake of Atlanteans civ:
1) Mainly Greek Patheon, but replace Zeus with Atlas
2) Building is okay. Not need to use Greek one.
3) Hero is okay. Not need to have Greek Heros
4) Military use Greek one, because it is very odd to see more advanced "Roman army" in the game
5) Myth unit mainly use Greek one (actually Manticore of Apollo is from Persian myth)
6) Favor gathering is okay. Not need to follow the Greeks
7) God power mainly use the Greek one

[ShadowFox]

That wouldn't make sense they are different in a ton of ways. Why reduce content for a remake?

[Gesus]

In story of the Titan expansion the Greek gods have abandoned the Atlanteans. In response the Atlanteans started worshipping the Titans. Fall of the Trident Campaign loosely follows the myths/lore from the real world, the New Atlantis diverges further from real lore/myths. This doesn't bother me as the orginal AoM was pretty far from real world lore anyway,

I always found it odd that the Atlanteans developed a bunch of new Architecture and Technology between campaigns while they were refugees and abandoned by the gods to be a bit weird. I am currently working on a Mod to make an Old Atlantis sub faction for the The Fall of Trident campaign. Atlantean buildings, Atlantean units (but they can't transform in Heroes), Greek Gods, Greek Heroes, Greek Myth units & Myth Techs. Build Greek villagers but can transform them into Atlantean Citizens. The Economic build and Citizens are a drop site for all resources. For the first few missions you play Atlantean/Poseidon. For the last 2 missions you Atlantean/Zeus.

[Ghost]

More options is good, but splitting into variants and/or removing things just seems like trying to fix things that don't need fixing.

You'll find a lot of cultural, mythological and religious etc. mixing and evolving wherever different groups would mix, and the Mediterranean and surrounds are a pretty big, constant mixing pot. E.g. Aphrodite: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIUq0pfAskU

See also every group that settled near a river having a 'great flood' story.

Originally posted by iamborsar:

Last is the myth units. Some Atlantean myth units comes from the Native American myths (like Stymphalian Birds, it actually comes from eudocimus) Should it be better to leave some "American" civ in the future?

No? The Stymphalian Birds unit are based on the mythical Stymphalian birds. Of the labours of Heracles and the Argonauts fame. All the Atlantean myth units are based on their Greek myth counterparts.

I'm all for a Native American based civ, but that's a lot of different groups and they don't exactly have one big unifying pantheon like the others. So the questions there become which, and how to do them right.

Originally posted by Gesus:

I always found it odd that the Atlanteans developed a bunch of new Architecture and Technology between campaigns while they were refugees and abandoned by the gods to be a bit weird.

It is a bit weird, but that's largely handwaved away in the campaign by the time-gap and everyone being 'influenced' by the titans, and more functionally to differentiate them from the greeks.

Personally I always found it odd that Atlantis is almost always depicted as Greek, when Plato described them as Egyptian.