"Leviathan" Being Used Generously

[Sage of Souls]

While I don't have a problem with what the developers choose to call their creatures, I find it very bothersome that the creatures with "Leviathan" in their name are considered Leviathans. In other mythos, Leviathans are like a mile or more long, not 55-110 meters long. Calling them monsters should definitely fit their role, but calling them Leviathans is being extremely generous. Leviathans (and Behemoths as the land counter-part) are supposed to be GIGANTIC. These creatures are large, yes, but if they're going to be classed as a "Leviathan", they should be no smaller than the Aurora, itself.

And before anyone starts countering by arguing that this "isn't other mythos, it's the dev's own game", I'm not trying to say that things need to be correct according to our physics or our beliefs. I'm just stating my opinion on the matter in case the developers DO decide to add in something that would truly be a Leviathan, in which case, I would think they'd have trouble classifying it, as I don't know of any creature larger than a Leviathan or a Behemoth to compare to in other mythos. Maybe a planet-eater or a celestial being, but that's outside the scope of what this game's trying to show.

It's just that calling these creatures "Leviathans" and then showing us them with what their size actually is sort of lessens the strength that the term "Leviathan" holds. To me, if these are what are considered Leviathans, then I don't really need to be too worried about being on this planet. Sure, they're not something I'd want to run into in person, but if I'm in a vehicle of some sort, I'm going to feel more safe than I would if I were looking at something whose eyeball is as big as my Cyclops. I understand that, while this isn't a horror game, there's supposed to be the feeling of anxiety since you're alone on an uncharted planet with creatures never heard of before. Honestly, I'm more afraid of a Crabsquid than I am a Reaper Leviathan simply because of its EMP ability.

And no, I'm don't think the game is bad because of those facts. I honestly adore this game and wish there was more for me to do at the end game because I really want to find motivation to keep playing. I'm already at the point where I'm waiting for the next stable branch update because I've pretty much done everything there is to do besides make multiple bases or a giant castle or whatever.

[Soup Time]

sea emporer will not eat anything because its behavior is set to passive/defensive

[Tim Timsen]

Originally posted by Sage of Souls:

or whatever

Next you'll say that the Seamoth looks nothing like a moth, and that moths don't exist underwater.
Oh, and that the PRAWN doesn't look like an actual prawn, because it'd need at least 4 more legs for an at least slight resemblance or something.

[Sage of Souls]

Originally posted by Tim Timsen:

Originally posted by Sage of Souls:

or whatever

Next you'll say that the Seamoth looks nothing like a moth, and that moths don't exist underwater.
Oh, and that the PRAWN doesn't look like an actual prawn, because it'd need at least 4 more legs for an at least slight resemblance or something.

You're not really that good of a troll. A name and a title/classification aren't the same thing. But since you don't really add to the conversation, I'm just going to let you make whatever commentary makes you feel good about yourself, just as you do with everyone else's threads. :P

[Sage of Souls]

Originally posted by OverwatchJunky:

Originally posted by Sage of Souls:

While I don't have a problem with what the developers choose to call their creatures, I find it very bothersome that the creatures with "Leviathan" in their name are considered Leviathans. In other mythos, Leviathans are like a mile or more long, not 55-110 meters long. Calling them monsters should definitely fit their role, but calling them Leviathans is being extremely generous. Leviathans (and Behemoths as the land counter-part) are supposed to be GIGANTIC. These creatures are large, yes, but if they're going to be classed as a "Leviathan", they should be no smaller than the Aurora, itself.

And before anyone starts countering by arguing that this "isn't other mythos, it's the dev's own game", I'm not trying to say that things need to be correct according to our physics or our beliefs. I'm just stating my opinion on the matter in case the developers DO decide to add in something that would truly be a Leviathan, in which case, I would think they'd have trouble classifying it, as I don't know of any creature larger than a Leviathan or a Behemoth to compare to in other mythos. Maybe a planet-eater or a celestial being, but that's outside the scope of what this game's trying to show.

It's just that calling these creatures "Leviathans" and then showing us them with what their size actually is sort of lessens the strength that the term "Leviathan" holds. To me, if these are what are considered Leviathans, then I don't really need to be too worried about being on this planet. Sure, they're not something I'd want to run into in person, but if I'm in a vehicle of some sort, I'm going to feel more safe than I would if I were looking at something whose eyeball is as big as my Cyclops. I understand that, while this isn't a horror game, there's supposed to be the feeling of anxiety since you're alone on an uncharted planet with creatures never heard of before. Honestly, I'm more afraid of a Crabsquid than I am a Reaper Leviathan simply because of its EMP ability.

And no, I'm don't think the game is bad because of those facts. I honestly adore this game and wish there was more for me to do at the end game because I really want to find motivation to keep playing. I'm already at the point where I'm waiting for the next stable branch update because I've pretty much done everything there is to do besides make multiple bases or a giant castle or whatever.

A giant squid would be categorized as a Leviathan class. It is at the top of the food chain in its ecosystem, or very close to it.

If you can fit in ITS mouth, thats more than "gigantic" enough.

What myths/mythos depict mile long leviathan class monsters?? Please, site your source. Even the Titans of Greek Mythology were not THAT big. Titans on the land were maybe 30-40 feet tall or 50 feet long for a seamonster. Even the newer Clash of the Titans movie, the Kraken (which is a leviathan) was not a mile tall/long. Maybe he'd top off at 500-600 feet if you counted the tentacles.


Anything off immense size and power as compared to a human or humanoid lifeform can and should be considered a leviathan class animal. But a leviathan is not just about size. It is about where they fall in the ecosystem. Leviathans are apex predators. That means that they are at the TOP of the food chain.

The only thing that eats the Reaper is the Sea Dragon. We know this from the Reaper Skeletons found near the lava castle. Nothing is big enough to eat a Sea Dragon, except the Sea Emperor. but we do not even know if he even eats them. But the Sea Dragon probably doesn't eat the Sea Emperor because he is smaller than him. It is a constant rule of nature, that animals eat other animals smaller than itself.

The Sea Emperor is going to be even BIGGER than the Sea Dragon. We havent even seen that yet. Only concept and scaled pictures.

First, let me say that my "mile long" statement is an exaggeration. It was supposed to be as a comparison to the fact that what Subnautica calls "Leviathans" is being generous, in my opinion. Typically, we use the term "Leviathan" to refer to something's size when we're just talking about something in an informal fashion. When I, *PERSONALLY* think of a Leviathan, I don't think about something that's 55 meters long... I think of something that, if I were face-to-face with it, would have an iris as big as my body. Again, I'm not trying to throw out the definition of a "Leviathan"; I'm trying to say what typically the term "Leviathan" is supposed to mean when used by a general mass. How often to you hear someone refer to something as a "Leviathan" simply because it's an apex predator? I have never heard anyone call a lion a Leviathan.

[MadHighlander]

Originally posted by Sage of Souls:

How often to you hear someone refer to something as a "Leviathan" simply because it's an apex predator?

A) Every time, in this game; B) 'apex predator' is not the only classification. It needs to be a HUGE apex predator.

[OverwatchJunky]

Originally posted by Sage of Souls:

Originally posted by OverwatchJunky:

A giant squid would be categorized as a Leviathan class. It is at the top of the food chain in its ecosystem, or very close to it.

If you can fit in ITS mouth, thats more than "gigantic" enough.

What myths/mythos depict mile long leviathan class monsters?? Please, site your source. Even the Titans of Greek Mythology were not THAT big. Titans on the land were maybe 30-40 feet tall or 50 feet long for a seamonster. Even the newer Clash of the Titans movie, the Kraken (which is a leviathan) was not a mile tall/long. Maybe he'd top off at 500-600 feet if you counted the tentacles.


Anything off immense size and power as compared to a human or humanoid lifeform can and should be considered a leviathan class animal. But a leviathan is not just about size. It is about where they fall in the ecosystem. Leviathans are apex predators. That means that they are at the TOP of the food chain.

The only thing that eats the Reaper is the Sea Dragon. We know this from the Reaper Skeletons found near the lava castle. Nothing is big enough to eat a Sea Dragon, except the Sea Emperor. but we do not even know if he even eats them. But the Sea Dragon probably doesn't eat the Sea Emperor because he is smaller than him. It is a constant rule of nature, that animals eat other animals smaller than itself.

The Sea Emperor is going to be even BIGGER than the Sea Dragon. We havent even seen that yet. Only concept and scaled pictures.

First, let me say that my "mile long" statement is an exaggeration. It was supposed to be as a comparison to the fact that what Subnautica calls "Leviathans" is being generous, in my opinion. Typically, we use the term "Leviathan" to refer to something's size when we're just talking about something in an informal fashion. When I, *PERSONALLY* think of a Leviathan, I don't think about something that's 55 meters long... I think of something that, if I were face-to-face with it, would have an iris as big as my body. Again, I'm not trying to throw out the definition of a "Leviathan"; I'm trying to say what typically the term "Leviathan" is supposed to mean when used by a general mass. How often to you hear someone refer to something as a "Leviathan" simply because it's an apex predator? I have never heard anyone call a lion a Leviathan.

A lion is not an apex predator. He has a predator too. Man. Lions also have other enemies as well.

Honestly...It really doesn't matter how you "personally" feel about it. The laws of nature and biology cannot be negated by your opinion.

Basic and irrefutable LAW of nature. A creature can only grow as big as its environment and nutrition requirements allows. At some point there is a plateau and an animal cant grow any larger either based on the size of its environment or the limits of its food source..

The monsters are already big enough, scary enough and nearly unkillable. Some people have boasted they have killed a Reaper but nobody wants to post a video. There is really no need to debate this any longer. They eat you, you dont eat them. Its that simple.

So, if you want to make an opinion post, then give people your opinion on the updates and provide the devs with some relevant feedback. Beyond that, this post does nothing to help improve the game.

[Ac3s]

Its best to simply ignore trolls like Overcrutch, they won't contribute to the conversation at all and only contradict or even attack the opinion you have.

[OverwatchJunky]

Originally posted by Ac3s:

Its best to simply ignore trolls like Overcrutch, they won't contribute to the conversation at all and only contradict or even attack the opinion you have.

There has been no attack. Contradiction is part of having a discussion. You use fact to refute someones opinion. And that is what I have done.

I HAVE contributed to the discussion. You however, have not contributed any relevant information to support the OP other than "I agree with the OP". You have only provided a vague support for an opinion which makes absolutely no sense at all to most intelligent people.

Animals can only grow as large as their environment and food source allows them to. That is BIOLOGICAL FACT!!! No matter what planet an animal is on, that is still a fact.

Originally posted by Sage of Souls:

Originally posted by thenukeluis:

THIS IS THEIR GAME JUST THINK ABOUT WHO OWNS IT

Originally posted by Sage of Souls:

And before anyone starts countering by arguing that this "isn't other mythos, it's the dev's own game", I'm not trying to say that things need to be correct according to our physics or our beliefs.

Could you please read the whole thing before you yell about something?

Why did you make a post and say "I'm not trying to say that things need to be correct according to our physics or our beliefs" when that CLEARLY is your belief that they should be bigger?? Why even make a thread??? You basiclaly sabotaged yourself by trying to tell people they cant use a certain point of view or statements you dont want to see.

You can't prevent someone from using a perfectly valid point of view. It is the devs game, and they will call it what ever they want in the end no matter what your opinion is. And if they choose to stick to raw facts and not opinions, that is their choice. Just like no weapons, no multiplayer and a host of other things that players "opinions" would make the game better.

The devs are always right. If they agree with you, they are right. If they disagree with you, they are right. It IS their game, so it is their choice.

[Ac3s]

You see, nothing but Drama.
God I really dislike dumb kids like you that turn nice forum threads into a toxic cesspool, every thread you come into stinks now.

[Tim Timsen]

Originally posted by Sage of Souls:

Originally posted by Tim Timsen:

Next you'll say that the Seamoth looks nothing like a moth, and that moths don't exist underwater.
Oh, and that the PRAWN doesn't look like an actual prawn, because it'd need at least 4 more legs for an at least slight resemblance or something.

You're not really that good of a troll.

"People don't agree with me or don't accept my logic or they make fun of my drama, they must be little kids or trolls! Probably trolls!"

[Great Whale Pee Funnel]

ALL THAT HE IS SAYING is that normally the term Leviathan is used to describe bigger creatures like king kong or godzilla, and that its interesting that they use it in a different meaning here to describe any larger predator. The emperor i think deserves this title since it is HUGE and its eye is about the size of the player, but the reaper normally wouldnt be put in this class.

[omegaz314]

The term leviathan is not an actual designation of size other than, "Holy crap that thing in the water is way bigger than I want it to be." This is a subjective topic outside of the original use of the word, which was simply used to describe whales. Now the word has a much larger conotation since whales are big but not truly terrifying. So is the OP wrong? Of course not, the OP is merely displaying his opinion of what conotation the word leviathan should carry. So large that you instantly die of fright, or at least void your bowels. Does this mean the devs are wrong? No, the fact that they chose such a word seems to show how far off this futuristic society is from our own. It is used as a classification rather than a description. Which really begs the question, if leviathan becomes a classification of where in the food chain a creature is, then why is that classification used also as their names. We don't call lions, apex lions or anything like that do we? (And yes by the way, from what someone said earlier, lions are apex predetors, humans don't count in that food chain because we don't eat their meat and live within the ecosystem they inhabit.)

[margalus]

Originally posted by omegaz314:

The term leviathan is not an actual designation of size other than, "Holy crap that thing in the water is way bigger than I want it to be." This is a subjective topic outside of the original use of the word, which was simply used to describe whales. Now the word has a much larger conotation since whales are big but not truly terrifying. So is the OP wrong? Of course not, the OP is merely displaying his opinion of what conotation the word leviathan should carry. So large that you instantly die of fright, or at least void your bowels. Does this mean the devs are wrong? No, the fact that they chose such a word seems to show how far off this futuristic society is from our own. It is used as a classification rather than a description. Which really begs the question, if leviathan becomes a classification of where in the food chain a creature is, then why is that classification used also as their names. We don't call lions, apex lions or anything like that do we? (And yes by the way, from what someone said earlier, lions are apex predetors, humans don't count in that food chain because we don't eat their meat and live within the ecosystem they inhabit.)

The devs and the op cannot both be correct. The op is wrong, he is saying that Leviathans have to be a mile or more in size. That is blatantly wrong.

[MadHighlander]

Originally posted by `¯¯'-=Wing=-'¯¯´:

Well, if the leviathan is or not the correct name, I don't know.
Fact, the behavior was changed... this game isn't anymore dangerous like before.
If was a bug or not...i don't care.
To me...the new Reaper Leviathan is a docile and fool creature.
Before was a great predator...now...not funny, not dangerous, not agressive and worst...he can bite you and you can escape!!!
Yes...the Reaper Leviathan... bites you and you not die.
Come on?! Seriously? Really?!

The reaper leviathan...we are missing you!!! Come BACK!!! and to the safe shallows too...or where is my base... but, please?! Come BACK!!!?!?!?!!?!?!?!!?!

lol...

Pepper Leviathan for void patrol.

What the heck are you even talking about, Wince MKII?

Do you even know, yourself?

[Zemecon]

Originally posted by OverwatchJunky:

A lion is not an apex predator. He has a predator too. Man. Lions also have other enemies as well.

Small nitpick (because I am still subscribed to this):

Lions are apex predators. Being an "Apex Predator" just means you aren't preyed upon by any creature that you yourself cannot prey upon. Hyaenas will prey on lion cubs and sick or injured adult lions, and lions will do the same to them. That is competition amongst apex predators. Most other ecosystems only have one or two apex predators but because African savannas can support so many herbivores - and such a large variety of herbivores - you will get lots of predators to hunt them. The more predators you have, the more likely you will have multiple apex predators.

Originally posted by margalus:

Originally posted by omegaz314:

The term leviathan is not an actual designation of size other than, "Holy crap that thing in the water is way bigger than I want it to be." This is a subjective topic outside of the original use of the word, which was simply used to describe whales. Now the word has a much larger conotation since whales are big but not truly terrifying. So is the OP wrong? Of course not, the OP is merely displaying his opinion of what conotation the word leviathan should carry. So large that you instantly die of fright, or at least void your bowels. Does this mean the devs are wrong? No, the fact that they chose such a word seems to show how far off this futuristic society is from our own. It is used as a classification rather than a description. Which really begs the question, if leviathan becomes a classification of where in the food chain a creature is, then why is that classification used also as their names. We don't call lions, apex lions or anything like that do we? (And yes by the way, from what someone said earlier, lions are apex predetors, humans don't count in that food chain because we don't eat their meat and live within the ecosystem they inhabit.)

The devs and the op cannot both be correct. The op is wrong, he is saying that Leviathans have to be a mile or more in size. That is blatantly wrong.

I am pretty much in agreement with this. The term "Leviathan" is very much relative to whoever is using it; a peeper can be considered a "Leviathan" by all of the zooplankton it probably eats. How big you can get is dependent on how much food you can get so - realistically - I think the Sea Emperor Leviathan is probably pushing it in terms of size potential on this planet. The developers are already fudging how it is able tofeed itself in order to get that big.

That said, there is no reason a creature can't get much larger if you can find a way for it to get a lot more calories to fuel that gigantic body.