opinion: all the weapons on this game deal far too much damage

[egg]

TL;DR why are weapon dmg values so out of balance

INB4 "its EA, balance not important" - give me a couple evenings with a simple tool like Morgh's WB/WFAS text editor and i could fix this ♥♥♥♥ easily and the game would be way more enjoyable

one handed maces one-shot kill every troop, 2h weapons one-shot everything, polearms oneshot everything, the higher tier 1h swords/axes one-shot >almost< everything

and when i mean everything i mean it, legionnaries, elite cataphracts etc. the best troops with 55head/70body armour. even around an average 100-150 weapon skill you will see like 130dmg from a 1h mace, 150-250 from a 2h and like 400dmg from most polearms

1H cataphract mace has 79 blunt, core damage rivalling the best swords in the game. the whole point of maces was low core damage (to make not as effective as sword slices on skin / light armour), but it made up for that low damage by having the armour piercing blunt damage that is great at dealing with heavy armour. different weapons for different situations or strengths/weaknesses... 79B on a mace is ridiculous and un-necessary. if you are 1H char, why would you use anything other than the mace that can deal 150 dmg to both light and heavy units. the only reason i ever did was boredom
also skills and perks might increase your damage too much as i found i could hit 50-70's with blacksmith hammer.

also there is no reason to be dealing 400+ dmg to tier 6 cataphract just because you have a polearm. the main benefit of polearms is their range advantage, anti-cav ability, and they are not even particularly slow weapons either. giving voulge 188Cut dmg, AND the ability to crush through block is just completely un-necessary

even in the rare case of not one-shotting something, take a high tier 1h sword around 80C and being able to deal like 70 SLASH damage against the most HEAVY ARMOURED unit in the game is stupid. how you can slash 60+damage through the heaviest armour in the game is beyond me

[TeaCupCoupon]

simply dont use use weapons

[~ Fabulous ~]

I suspect it because they want combat engagement to be faster, hence not only the high damage output but also the morale system caused soldier to easily broke and run...it is within their game design philosophy for the game, which I do not agree but it is what they envision the game should be

[Wotannatow]

Why don't we make a little experiment, OP?
You stand there while someone hits you in the face with a sword or a mace, then we'll see if you complain about imbalance again, eh?

[blood_guts]

you don't need a text editor. you can just open the stuff in notepad and change it. then upload the mod for other people who agree with you to enjoy.

You're probably right about imbalance but it keeps the combat moving.

[the.lovewyrm]

Step 1.) Go to kitchen drawer.
Step 2.) Take out an average metal table spoon, not a tea spoon.
Step 3.) Grasp spoon firmly
Step 4.) Knock yourself on the thick armored part in front of your skull (aka forehead) with the convex part of the spoon
Step 5a.) If you pulled your strength even a little, congratulations, you actually respect weapons
Step 5b.) If you actually smashed your skull with a metal spoon at full strength because some ass on the internet told you to...then, bro..waswrongwithyou

Anyway, Bannerlord is low tech, armor wise. It's not the age of walking tanks.
Also, it's not massive damage that is the problem, its the fact that TINY damage staggers you and THEN you can get whacked by Cownan and his +5 mace of 'Let's just fall down instead of wiffle batting one another for 5 minutes'

[Hasbulat]

Opposite to the most games the weapons in the Bannerlord provide the most realistic damage.
I mean really damage like in the real life. One skillfull hit is mostly enough to kill an enemy.

[Buzzed L1ghtyear]

not sure who needs to know this, But cloth armor was the armor of choice. not all vikings could afford mail so the just put multiple layers of heavy cloth on

[Buzzed L1ghtyear]

Originally posted by Hasbulat:

Opposite to the most games the weapons in the Bannerlord provide the most realistic damage.
I mean really damage like in the real life. One skillfull hit is mostly enough to kill an enemy.

they're not realistic in the slightest lmao. if you take an arrow to the knee thats it you're ♥♥♥♥♥♥ gg try next time. bows are way way too slow. https://youtu.be/BEG-ly9tQGk

[egg]

Originally posted by Wotannatow:

Why don't we make a little experiment, OP?
You stand there while someone hits you in the face with a sword or a mace, then we'll see if you complain about imbalance again, eh?

Originally posted by the.lovewyrm:

Anyway, Bannerlord is low tech, armor wise. It's not the age of walking tanks.
Also, it's not massive damage that is the problem, its the fact that TINY damage staggers you and THEN you can get whacked by Cownan and his +5 mace of 'Let's just fall down instead of wiffle batting one another for 5 minutes'

Originally posted by Hasbulat:

Opposite to the most games the weapons in the Bannerlord provide the most realistic damage.
I mean really damage like in the real life. One skillfull hit is mostly enough to kill an enemy.

all of you almost fully missed my point. i dont give a ♥♥♥♥ about realism, neither on warband or bannerlord. i gave an opinion on why the game should reward picking different weapon choices, giving them different strengths and weaknesses for different situations would enhance gameplay, far, FAR more than a bland:
"it doesnt matter what armour they are wearing, or what weapon you are using, because they will die in one hit, despite the fact that you landed a slow moving GLANCING blow on the shoulder of a cataphract and still somehow pulled off 150 damage because some pile of cartilage on the dev team decided to give nearly 200 core damage to polearms"

also i dont think it's as realistic as you all think it is anyways. menavlion polearms are just short spears. literally a small sword on the end of a stick. it shouldn't have 150 damage... hit a long sharp spear blade into someones heavy helmet, assuming they have some sort of coif padding underneath... would it hurt? yes, would they be dazed a bit? i dont know, probably... would they instantly die from the hit, that according to the game would still kill them EVEN if you halved the intensity of the blow? not even close.

you can't just >>slash<< through plate armour, no matter how "low tech" you think it is

"gO hIt YoUrSeLf WiTh A mAce iN rEaL lIfE" pfffff come on guys you are better than this

[Ritter]

Originally posted by Wotannatow:

Why don't we make a little experiment, OP?
You stand there while someone hits you in the face with a sword or a mace, then we'll see if you complain about imbalance again, eh?

And yet fights between heavily armored men-at-arms could last for hours. See: the Combat of the Thirty. Good armor is very good at keeping people alive.

[Ritter]

Originally posted by the.lovewyrm:

Anyway, Bannerlord is low tech, armor wise. It's not the age of walking tanks.

Please. The best armor in Bannerlord is essentially equivalent to that in use in Europe in the late 13th century. Coats-of-plates and enclosed helmets were excellent armor, just not quite to the level of full plate. If we're going by historical standards, mail alone should be sufficient to protect from everything except for strong bows and crossbows, polearms, maces, and couched lances. See "the Knight and the Blast Furnace" for tests using actual armor.

[the.lovewyrm]

Originally posted by Ritter:

Originally posted by the.lovewyrm:

Anyway, Bannerlord is low tech, armor wise. It's not the age of walking tanks.

Please. The best armor in Bannerlord is essentially equivalent to that in use in Europe in the late 13th century. Coats-of-plates and enclosed helmets were excellent armor, just not quite to the level of full plate. If we're going by historical standards, mail alone should be sufficient to protect from everything except for strong bows and crossbows, polearms, maces, and couched lances. See "the Knight and the Blast Furnace" for tests using actual armor.

This is also a reply to OP (don't wanna quote cause I don't enjoy quoting)

You really want prolonged fights with Bannerlords system?
Bannerlord (and the other M&B) games are fun because it's quite binary, you die fast, you kill fast, and you evade death by arcade style 100% damage reduction blocks.
A tiny dagger can block a voulge. A looter can hold up his cracked müllnir (müll = trash in German) he found in a dead horses prison wallet and nullify Lord Byrons 88mph vorpal lance charge on Kokuou from Fist of the North Star without even flinching.

THATS the damage reduction of note the game designers have put in.
Heavy armor is for arrows and dying after 2 or 3 hits instead of one (and with perks and stuff, and endgame armor you WILL be passively tanky)

Otherwise armor just looks cool, and does little else, other than arrow protection and a tiny sliver of potential living after getting smashed with the weapons.
Do they do too much damage? Maybe, but not for Bannerlord.

IRL even a damn hefty branch does damage. Certainly more than "club" from Diablo 2, which cites 1-2 damage or something (been a while)

Hence me going with a spoon. THAT is low damage, but still not very pleasant, you might even give yourself a lump if you're good at spoony forehead, but otherwise it's just a bit of pain.

But a damn thick branch? In the nose? The orbital? The jaw? The teeth?
It won't be 1-2 damage. You won't DIE (probably) but chances are that you'll be removed from the fight anyway after you hear sine waves bleeping up and down the octaves in your ear while pain throbs behind your eyes. It's quite likely that you'll do various protected hand gestures so that the branch swinger doesn't give you another helping of arboreal high fiber treats delivered at blazing speeds.

You won't be dead. But your fighting mood might just tank a little.
This is not modeled in the game. There are routs, etc, but man you really, REALLY want to not only have stupid back and forth woodchopping on shields, but also on armor?
Can you imagine smashing down the AIs shield, then they still block with the weapon, and then finally a hit goes through and it only does a quarter damage... that ain't fun.
Running ahead of looters to wind up a two handed axes swing and then spinning around ilke a derwish, cutting down three in one blow is fun.

Bannerlord combat isn't interesting, it's high risk high reward fun.

[Buzzed L1ghtyear]

Originally posted by the.lovewyrm:

Originally posted by Ritter:

Please. The best armor in Bannerlord is essentially equivalent to that in use in Europe in the late 13th century. Coats-of-plates and enclosed helmets were excellent armor, just not quite to the level of full plate. If we're going by historical standards, mail alone should be sufficient to protect from everything except for strong bows and crossbows, polearms, maces, and couched lances. See "the Knight and the Blast Furnace" for tests using actual armor.

This is also a reply to OP (don't wanna quote cause I don't enjoy quoting)

You really want prolonged fights with Bannerlords system?
Bannerlord (and the other M&B) games are fun because it's quite binary, you die fast, you kill fast, and you evade death by arcade style 100% damage reduction blocks.
A tiny dagger can block a voulge. A looter can hold up his cracked müllnir (müll = trash in German) he found in a dead horses prison wallet and nullify Lord Byrons 88mph vorpal lance charge on Kokuou from Fist of the North Star without even flinching.

THATS the damage reduction of note the game designers have put in.
Heavy armor is for arrows and dying after 2 or 3 hits instead of one (and with perks and stuff, and endgame armor you WILL be passively tanky)

Otherwise armor just looks cool, and does little else, other than arrow protection and a tiny sliver of potential living after getting smashed with the weapons.
Do they do too much damage? Maybe, but not for Bannerlord.

IRL even a damn hefty branch does damage. Certainly more than "club" from Diablo 2, which cites 1-2 damage or something (been a while)

Hence me going with a spoon. THAT is low damage, but still not very pleasant, you might even give yourself a lump if you're good at spoony forehead, but otherwise it's just a bit of pain.

But a damn thick branch? In the nose? The orbital? The jaw? The teeth?
It won't be 1-2 damage. You won't DIE (probably) but chances are that you'll be removed from the fight anyway after you hear sine waves bleeping up and down the octaves in your ear while pain throbs behind your eyes. It's quite likely that you'll do various protected hand gestures so that the branch swinger doesn't give you another helping of arboreal high fiber treats delivered at blazing speeds.

You won't be dead. But your fighting mood might just tank a little.
This is not modeled in the game. There are routs, etc, but man you really, REALLY want to not only have stupid back and forth woodchopping on shields, but also on armor?
Can you imagine smashing down the AIs shield, then they still block with the weapon, and then finally a hit goes through and it only does a quarter damage... that ain't fun.
Running ahead of looters to wind up a two handed axes swing and then spinning around ilke a derwish, cutting down three in one blow is fun.

Bannerlord combat isn't interesting, it's high risk high reward fun.

its because of thinking like this the Pilum will never get the love it deserves...

[ULTRA]

Originally posted by Buzzed Lightyear:

Originally posted by Hasbulat:

Opposite to the most games the weapons in the Bannerlord provide the most realistic damage.
I mean really damage like in the real life. One skillfull hit is mostly enough to kill an enemy.

they're not realistic in the slightest lmao. if you take an arrow to the knee thats it you're ♥♥♥♥♥♥ gg try next time. bows are way way too slow. https://youtu.be/BEG-ly9tQGk

You have not shot any living being remotely human-sized with a bow before, lmao, and it should have been fairly evident in 2014 that Lars hadn't either. Take a bow with twice the draw weight of his (I'd guess 40# up from 20#ish), pull it to full draw (i.e. to your jaw at least, probably 28" or more up from about 12") and shoot any medium-sized game animal in the leg at the distance he shoots (about quarter-court, 20-25ish feet) and you'll find out pretty soon just how worthwhile his shooting would be against a pissed off grown man who's being paid to kill you.

Not to say that Mount & Blade weapons are particularly realistic let alone the bows, but in reality, enemies would be far quicker, more reactive and have much more protective armor than is depicted in this game.

[Buzzed L1ghtyear]

Originally posted by Anarchist Jurisdictor:

Originally posted by Buzzed Lightyear:

they're not realistic in the slightest lmao. if you take an arrow to the knee thats it you're ♥♥♥♥♥♥ gg try next time. bows are way way too slow. https://youtu.be/BEG-ly9tQGk

You have not shot any living being remotely human-sized with a bow before, lmao, and it should have been fairly evident in 2014 that Lars hadn't either. Take a bow with twice the draw weight of his (I'd guess 40# up from 20#ish), pull it to full draw (i.e. to your jaw at least, probably 28" or more up from about 12") and shoot any medium-sized game animal in the leg at the distance he shoots (about quarter-court, 20-25ish feet) and you'll find out pretty soon just how worthwhile his shooting would be against a pissed off grown man who's being paid to kill you.

Not to say that Mount & Blade weapons are particularly realistic let alone the bows, but in reality, enemies would be far quicker, more reactive and have much more protective armor than is depicted in this game.

https://youtu.be/oPWt6cCEZVU clown