Why am I so terrible at Polearm?

[Gibletstein]

I have been playing Bannerlord for over 1700 hours and I still can't get to grips with why Polearms are so underwhelming. First is the fact that at low levels polearms are so slow approximately 1/3 the speed of a sword at the same level but they are about 1/5 of the damage. So I try to grind but since you can only level up polearms by inflicting damage on opponents the speed is negated by being blocked. I have tried polearms against looters while on horseback and have been thrashed by about 5 of them (I died). I've smithed a swinging polearm but even though it says 85dmg the most I landed was about 10. Has anyone got a solution as I've seen guides saying that polearms are the best weapons in the game? My two handed axe took three swings to dispatch the 5 looters after I reloaded.

[druzilsupreme]

I feel like they're great from horseback at speed (in large battles particularly) but underwhelming in any other context

[Karna5]

My two favorite weapons to use mounted are a two handed axe and a slashing craftable polearm. I'll link photos of each for reference then will explain.

This is the Axe which I always craft as soon as I can each play through:
https://i.imgur.com/TKAVuiL.jpg

And this is the pole arm I craft each play through as well:
https://i.imgur.com/whcN1tP.jpg

The damage display on that pole arm is bugged. It actually hits super hard. If you compare it to another pole arm the display corrects itself so you can see the real base damage:
https://i.imgur.com/3PvKAgh.jpg

I like that two handed axe when on foot or against tightly packed groups of enemies when on horse because it can slash through multiple opponents in one hit. And it's the hardest hitting weapon I know, and its range isn't too bad.

However, that pole arm hits almost as hard as the axe and has a much farther reach. When I' chasing spread out cavalry, I like to use that pole arm in slashing attacks. Yes, it's slower than the axe, but I can time the swings and don't need to get as close as with the axe.

The axe can be crafted to Master quality, and the pole arm can be crafted to legendary quality (if you have the smithing skill).

Once you get to 250 or 300 skill in two hander (axe) or pole arm (the above lance) they have pretty decent handling and can be swung much more quickly. If you can manage to hit 320 or 330 skill (requires 10 in the attribute and many battles), they swing and handle even better.

Both the axe and the lance can kill nearly everything in one hit. The axe can kill both horse and rider in the same swing, but the lance doesn't have that same penetration, so with the lance you'll only kill one of them per swing.

I still prefer the axe if I could only have one weapon, but fortunately I don't have to make that choice. So I usually carry both.

Edit: In summary, the two handed axe I listed there has 172 cut and 137 length. The pole arm has 197 cut and 202 length. The lance can hit one target incredibly hard but doesn't punch through multiple targets on the slash. The axe hits a single target slightly less hard but punches through almost anything and also does fantastic damage on objects like gates and siege equipment. Both the axe and the lance have fantastic value.

[Gibletstein]

Okay. I'm on another playthrough so I'll get my smithing up to 250 and craft a longer more powerful polearm and try again. If I can land a few hits my skill will increase. I've never got polearm above 40 as I wouldn't waste points on it. I like crafting 2 handed axes as they can be used as civilian weaponry which I can use to clear gangs out of towns.

[Agent]

You either use them on horseback or in defense against a cav charge. Spears in square formation destroy cav, except horse archers of course. Even if they miss the rider, the horse will kick up if stabbed by the polearm making the knight a sitting duck.

[fragonard]

That's not a vanilla axe though.

[12345shane]

Stabbing polearms are great. Get going at a fast speed on the horse, and then just skirmish the outsides by stabbing the stragglers while going at mach 10. They'll struggle to hit you, while you can just keep the cycle repeating until they're all dead. Also it's nice that if you time it correctly it is a one hit kill.

[Philippe_at_bay]

Polearms are misunderstood and badly represented in most video games.

Judging from the HEMA fight camp videos I've seen, Spear and no shield versus sword will win almost every time, and if the swordsman also carries a shield, the spear will still win most of the time, But if the spearman happens to carry a shield, the odds change considerably: the spear will win slightly more than half the time, but less than 60% of the time. The problems start when you add archers into the mix: that's why spearmen needed to carry shields.

There's a reason why the spear was the dominant battlefield weapon for at least three or four thousand years before firearms, and it makes nonsense out of the video game convention of units armed solely with swords. The sword was a sidearm, not the primary weapon.

To get back to ignoring reality, I always found it impossibly difficult to level up the polearms skill in Bannerlord, until I discovered arena practise sessions in Vlandia. It's really easy to get kills and experience points with the Vlandian slashing polearm, and the game system doesn't distinguish between slashing polearm experience and stabbing polearm experience. So if you're starting a character and want him to have skill with polearms, park him in Vlandia for a while. When he's got more than 30 points in polearm skill he'll start getting polearm kills ouside Vlandia.

As an aside, when I'm in Battania or the Empire and have to use a polearm in the arena, if there is one I put the shield on my back so that I can run faster (it doesn't seem to offer any protection for arrows from behind). I go around the arena looking for pairs of people already engaged in combat, and run up and stab one of them from behind. That gets you a few experience points.

[Gibletstein]

Originally posted by Philippe_at_bay:

Polearms are misunderstood and badly represented in most video games.

Judging from the HEMA fight camp videos I've seen, Spear and no shield versus sword will win almost every time, and if the swordsman also carries a shield, the spear will still win most of the time, But if the spearman happens to carry a shield, the odds change considerably: the spear will win slightly more than half the time, but less than 60% of the time. The problems start when you add archers into the mix: that's why spearmen needed to carry shields.

There's a reason why the spear was the dominant battlefield weapon for at least three or four thousand years before firearms, and it makes nonsense out of the video game convention of units armed solely with swords. The sword was a sidearm, not the primary weapon.

To get back to ignoring reality, I always found it impossibly difficult to level up the polearms skill in Bannerlord, until I discovered arena practise sessions in Vlandia. It's really easy to get kills and experience points with the Vlandian slashing polearm, and the game system doesn't distinguish between slashing polearm experience and stabbing polearm experience. So if you're starting a character and want him to have skill with polearms, park him in Vlandia for a while. When he's got more than 30 points in polearm skill he'll start getting polearm kills ouside Vlandia.

As an aside, when I'm in Battania or the Empire and have to use a polearm in the arena, if there is one I put the shield on my back so that I can run faster (it doesn't seem to offer any protection for arrows from behind). I go around the arena looking for pairs of people already engaged in combat, and run up and stab one of them from behind. That gets you a few experience points.

I've tried that on the practice field only the damage I inflict is about 10 I would need to hit them about 10 times for a knock out. But I am on sandbox I have been practising in Battania. I'll move to Vlandia to see if I can improve it there instead.

[Karna5]

Originally posted by Philippe_at_bay:

...if there is one I put the shield on my back so that I can run faster (it doesn't seem to offer any protection for arrows from behind). ...

FYI, there's a Crossbow Skill (225, Pavise) which says: "+75% chance of blocking projectiles from behind with a shield on your back."

The implication is that the shield has a chance of blocking projectiles on your back, but not as much as with that skill. I find crossbow pretty hard to level up that far unless you do a zillion sieges *laughs*, so I've only gotten the skill that high a couple of times, and I usually pick the opposite 225 skill which lets you dismount horsemen with a crossbow.

[Karna5]

Originally posted by fragonard:

That's not a vanilla axe though.

I had no idea. I've been using KOTK Armory for the last 900 or so game hours, so I'm guessing the axe is from that. But I didn't know until you mentioned it.

[The Mau Corporation]

Originally posted by 12345shane:

Stabbing polearms are great. Get going at a fast speed on the horse, and then just skirmish the outsides by stabbing the stragglers while going at mach 10. They'll struggle to hit you, while you can just keep the cycle repeating until they're all dead. Also it's nice that if you time it correctly it is a one hit kill.

This is my go-to also. There is a learning curve associated with the polearm length but once mastered is freakin killer. Takings out groups of charging knights solo is thrilling.

[Brax]

The last update, that updated enemy AI, completely ruined the early game for everyone. Those small bands of looters are your ONLY chance to make progress, in the entire game at the very beginning.
You have no choice now but to buy cheap sheep and hogs, slaughter them and sell the meat and hides. Because you have to buy either a better bow or a LONGER polearm depending on your intended build.
Forget starting as one or two handed. You could maybe get by as a thrower.
In other words, if you start a new campaign in 1.2.8, you HAVE to use the slaughter exploit or you will never get past the first fights.

[Karna5]

Originally posted by Brax:

You have no choice now but to buy cheap sheep and hogs, slaughter them and sell the meat and hides. Because you have to buy either a better bow or a LONGER polearm depending on your intended build.

*Laughs* Oh my gosh I played 948 hours of Bannerlord and never knew you could slaughter animals for meat *Laughs* I always figured it was an automatic thing because I saw the meat icon on certain animals. But I didn't know you need to slaughter them, haha.

On side note, though, I've noticed looters aren't all equal, tnough I'm not sure if it's a vanilla thing or a modded thing. In my game looters vary from T1 to T7 in difficulty. The T7 looters are super tough, but the T1 aren't bad at all. I use mods like Adjustable Bandits, Kult of the Kalypagos (sp?) and the like, so it's been around 900 game hours since I played vanilla Bannerlord.

[Alf Stewart]

they are pretty good on horseback. bad on foot

[Alf Stewart]

oh and good for stopping horsemen and stabbing them off horse. also the swinging polearms are godlike