Character builds

[Vodked]

Hello, Im pretty new to the game, I mean I’ve played like 140hrs, got most of the mechanics, but due to updates never got to like late game. Wanted to know your opinions about character builds, I know I can just go and try whatever I want, but wanted you to share some builds that you had most fun with. Where do you invest most of your atribute points? Is it worth to max (330) one or the other skill?

[Kayeka]

I find that, when it comes to damage output with melee weapons, you're effectiveness "maxes out" (as in, you kill everything in one hit) long before you hit max level, especially if you go big on smithing and craft some super weapon. So it's not much of a problem to go a little lower on Vigor and go heavier on Intelligence, Social and Endurance.

[Twelvefield]

Characters of short stature have an easier time using swords on horses. That's the sum of my wisdom, but if your idea of fun is swinging and missing high every single time, by all means make a tall character.

[Vodked]

Any one tried out cunning build? Is it worth it? Im not in to rogue thing as I’ve read that its not that good yet, but what about tactics and scouting?

[Kayeka]

Scouting is a good skill to have, but can be done by an NPC and offers little additional benefits to a player character. Tactics, I believe, does have some goodies in the perks, but not enough to make it worth investing in, as its main benefit only applies to auto-resolving battles, which kind of misses the point of the game.

Originally posted by Twelvefield:

Characters of short stature have an easier time using swords on horses. That's the sum of my wisdom, but if your idea of fun is swinging and missing high every single time, by all means make a tall character.

Well, that explains why I had so much trouble connecting from my horse with a two-handed sword. Had a easier time with a one-handed saber, though.

[RJboxer]

1500+ hours here. These are my opinions, and are shared by many (though not all)

1- You want yourself to be all jobs, This gives you more xp for your main character, and thus more attribute and focus points. (this is controversial, but I'd say it's probably 80% agree to this. ) To keep all jobs to yourself never assign anyone a job (quartermaster, surgeon, scout, engineer) etc.

2- Caveat to #1 above. Some people love Scout skill. I'm starting to like it a bit more than I did. But the perk at Scout 175 (beast whisperer) is very good. It is the only way I know of to get the "rare horses" unless your family has one, and you take it. (But even then you can't get purebloods anymore AFAIKso if u want a pureblood u need this perk). So if you want to try for rare horses, and do not want to waste a ton of points in Cunning, and Scout. It's probably a good idea to assign a companion to scout. I only say in this case, because Cunning is a pretty trash attribute, so the less you have to waste there, the better. Let a companion pick it up if you want.

3-There is no "end game build" or however people wanna word it. This isn't like most games. There isn't even a "this is the end all be all troop/weapon/skill" etc. Though many noobs like to proclaim there is. Build your character as YOU LIKE to play him. I hate when people say that in a traditional RPG but in this game, I feel it's true

4- Attibutes are the Key to a build. Each attribute affects 3 skills. And you only get 1 att point ever four levels. If you ever make it to end game, you will MOST LIKELY be in the lvl 32-38 range. Some hit it a bit lower level, some end a bit higher.. but expect about 9 more attribute points from leveling (and maybe 1-2 from certain perks). This will dictate how you build.

5- Some top attributes I like, and many many others agree. Social, Intelligence, and Endurance. All three of those attributes have 3 skills 99% of people will use in every playthrough. You can't go wrong sticking points in those att's.

6- You only need 1 ranged skills. (most do bows, since it is finished. Xbows are not. The xbows and bolts are still basically miniscule... compared to the bow variety and power). Throwing can be fun too, But then you are hampered in siege defense. Since you only get 3-5 tosses before you are out of ammo. With a bow, you can shoot 20-25 (your quiver) then refill from a barrel. Endless arrows.

7-You only need 1 melee weapon. I've never seen Height matter on a horse. Ever. Sure the 5% shorter you can make your dude probably makes it a tad bit easier to hit a footmen with a sword. But I've never made a short guy, most of mine are Tall (to see better when I'm shooting) and I can hit footmen from horseback, with any weapon in the game. Easily.
A good beginner choice, and a choice for lazy old timers too (*ahem* me) is a Swing damage 2 handed polearm. It does super damage from horseback, makes it so you can hit enemies from the side... and when your horse is stopped from moving you still get to damage them (a thrust weapon will lose a ton of its damage if no Momentum behind it)... Etc. So for me I like to carry a Polearm (that's my primary skill in melee), and a 2 handed sword (meh, stick 1 point in 2 hander.. you already use the attribute of Vigor for polearm, so it only costs 1 point of 2 hander to get into the 30s range) for close combat in sieges.. and IF, (which I rarely do) I want to do tournaments put a point in 1 handed too (it will help u get better skills in tourny. meh)

8-No need to max any skill to 330 that I've seen. The differences between 250 -330 are very small in most things. (certainly combat things). Sure it's there, but it won't make or break your ability to destroy anything in your path. By the time you could hit 330 in a combat skill, you are already probably very late game, and can do whatever u want anyway. This is why others have said, don't put too many attribute points into Vigor, and control (I agree). Look for the weapons u gonna use (polearm, and bow for example). See their skill tree, See which perks over 175 you REALLY want. If there is something, then make sure you have enough points for it. most likely nothing is that good. 3-5 points in either or both... VIgor and Control is usually enough. and 3-5 points in the skill u like is fine as well.



Lastly, as to "cunning Build". I'd say that isn't really "a thing" yet.
Cunning affects Scouting, Tactics, and Roguery.

Scouting is the main one people care about (if even that...) since it gives a small boost to speed (Which I find is ZERO help, based on the way the AI catches you).. a decent boost to Sight (which can be useful, and some people love it) to help avoid huge armies, and The horse Perk I said (Beast Master) .

Tactics, helps you fight better in autofight, but by the time you are doing this regularly, you can replace any losses nearly instantaneously. So it's not a big deal. if its a super big fight, and you don't wanna lose many troops, you PROBABLY aren't auto Calc the fight anyway.

Roguery. currently is the worst skill IMO. It has some of the aboslute most useless perks, I think its kind of a "troll" by the devs. I can't imagine anyone makes a build and thinks "man it sure would be great if bandit units in my party gained xp faster". "man I sure wish I had 10% more damage with a civilian weapon", or "man I sure wish I had 1% more loot after each fight". None of those are worth anything. But.... the devs at one time talked about making Banditry/Roguery/Criminal builds more of a thing. There were big plans (maybe still are) to make it quite interesting. but It is not in the game yet, nor is it on their "future plans" thing for the near future. So for me.. I'd not do a cunning build


Good luck. Have fun

[Kayeka]

Originally posted by RJboxer:

1500+ hours here. These are my opinions, and are shared by many (though not all)

1- You want yourself to be all jobs, This gives you more xp for your main character, and thus more attribute and focus points. (this is controversial, but I'd say it's probably 80% agree to this. ) To keep all jobs to yourself never assign anyone a job (quartermaster, surgeon, scout, engineer) etc.

Does that actually, yah know, work out? Levels don't actually do anything for you other than give you more focus points. Yes, by doing all the jobs yourself you will gain more focus points quicker, in an absolute sense, but unless you also invest those focus points into those skills, the xp gain will slow to an absolute crawl, and quite quick at that. If you're not interested in investing those skills yourself, you'd be screwing yourself out of a Quartermaster or Surgeon that's actually good at the job for a very minor xp benefit.

Personally, with my admittedly limited experience compared to you, I'd say that if you intend to make an int-based character, there's some real benefit to be gained from doing the jobs yourself, but if that's not what you had in mind, you'll be better of just hiring NPCs to do it.

[RJboxer]

Originally posted by Kayeka:

Originally posted by RJboxer:

1500+ hours here. These are my opinions, and are shared by many (though not all)

1- You want yourself to be all jobs, This gives you more xp for your main character, and thus more attribute and focus points. (this is controversial, but I'd say it's probably 80% agree to this. ) To keep all jobs to yourself never assign anyone a job (quartermaster, surgeon, scout, engineer) etc.

Does that actually, yah know, work out? Levels don't actually do anything for you other than give you more focus points. Yes, by doing all the jobs yourself you will gain more focus points quicker, in an absolute sense, but unless you also invest those focus points into those skills, the xp gain will slow to an absolute crawl, and quite quick at that. If you're not interested in investing those skills yourself, you'd be screwing yourself out of a Quartermaster or Surgeon that's actually good at the job for a very minor xp benefit.

Personally, with my admittedly limited experience compared to you, I'd say that if you intend to make an int-based character, there's some real benefit to be gained from doing the jobs yourself, but if that's not what you had in mind, you'll be better of just hiring NPCs to do it.

as I mentioned, this is "controversial".

In my mind, it is more than 100% accurate. For the last year and a half (since game came out). There have been people saying it is true, and a select few arguing to the death it is not.

Nothing we say will sway them, So I have finally learned to say (cool, do it as u wish. you're right).

But if I'm feeling energetic, and wanna explain it all. (I do not). I'd say Yes, you get MORE xp for char. MORE ATT, and MORE FOCUS points. But even if you did not (you do. ) You'd still get to take advantage of all the "self perks".

Keep in mind, perks are what most people (i'd say 99.99999% but there is always a troll, or noob) think make your character powerful. If I'm looking at the medicine tree, Does it help me to have my Surgeon with the self perks? no. Also, what happens when you have a quartermaster and he's got a whopping 270 steward, you are rocking your 350+ man party... then he dies. oooops. That's a cool 80-100 guys auto dead.

There are multiple reasons, MANY in my mind. But I think if the "you want perks to benefit YOU", and "yep you get more xp" doesn't sway someone, Nothing will.


For me, I always take all four jobs, in every play through I do.

(though.. I am reallllllllllly considering trying a Scout companion someday, and seeing how that works out. Just so HE grabs the Beast Master perk, and I can spend 1 extra attribute, and 2 extra focus elsewhere).

[Kayeka]

So you're saying to always invest in the "job" skills because the perks are great?That makes a bit more sense, but I do think that "you'll get more focus points!" is a pretty bad argument if you need to put those points into skills you didn't intend to take to begin with.

[RJboxer]

Originally posted by Kayeka:

So you're saying to always invest in the "job" skills because the perks are great?That makes a bit more sense, but I do think that "you'll get more focus points!" is a pretty bad argument if you need to put those points into skills you didn't intend to take to begin with.

You would mostly be correct. IF THAT was the only way to get more skill. (putting points in the att, and focus).

About the only skill you would do that for is Steward.
Medicine and Engineer are by less likely to need a focus point. So just by you using 2 attributes (total,.. on top of the 3 u start with), and a couple focus in steward, and 1 value in engineer/medicine. you will go far. (grand total of about 2 ATT, and 5-6 focus points)

I'm not saying "add 7 attribute to INT, to make it 10.. then add however many focus you need to each skill in that tree, to make it FIVE" etc. I'm saying you can easily spare 2 INT, (since as discussed VIGOR, and CONTROL , and Cunning aren't super useful). you get extra Endurance ATT from skills. (so can hit 9 endurance SUPER EASY).

So basically the 3 INT you most likely start with at creation, add another 2 INT, and max steward Focus, and put 1-2 points in medicine, and engineer. Will take you far.

The XP you get in return is probably going to replace 1.5 of that attribute, and 4-6 of those spent focus points. (remember you don't need to take INT to 10, and each skill to FIVE). If you have a scrub companion in medicine, you get zero xp in med. (Yet, you probably have 3 INT already, and maybe even 1 in Med) etc.

Regardless, I do it. Many do it. No one has to do it. If there is a better way for them to hit level 40... with 300 Steward, 180+ medicine, and 100+ engineer.. go for it.

I also end up with 300+ smithing, 200+ riding, 200+ athletics. 200+ charm, 200+ trade, 200+ leadership. 250+ polearm, 200+ bow, and 175+ scout. Pretty easily. The other skills raise too, but I don't find them to be Core to my builds.

If they TRULY feel they need 300 Medicine, or 300 Engineer. yeah probably not a great idea to try it yourself, since it takes more INT points than it's worth in my opinion.

[djo1313]

Originally posted by Vodked:

Any one tried out cunning build? Is it worth it? Im not in to rogue thing as I’ve read that its not that good yet, but what about tactics and scouting?

For my style of play sight and speed are the most important elements of the game. Once you raise your sight and speed high enough (app. day 300-400 if you push scouting) you should never get caught by any party/army that can beat you. Before that time you can manipulate your speed, with horses, horse troops, and a smaller party size, and rarely get caught by an enemy. Plus you can get into a lot more battles in a shorter time frame.

I put 7 points in cunning and 5 in scouting, even though I agree with boxer that roguery is currently basically worthless and tactics is less useful than I previously thought (thanks to something boxer recently pointed out). Sight and speed are that important to my enjoyment of the game. But there are some tough trade-offs to make in regards to attribute and skill points.

If you are interested in something like this, search the forum for a thread titled - "Scouting and party speed". In that thread I go into a lot more detail of the advantages of that style of play. It is definitely a viable and fun way to play.

[Kayeka]

Originally posted by RJboxer:

Originally posted by Kayeka:

So you're saying to always invest in the "job" skills because the perks are great?That makes a bit more sense, but I do think that "you'll get more focus points!" is a pretty bad argument if you need to put those points into skills you didn't intend to take to begin with.

You would mostly be correct. IF THAT was the only way to get more skill. (putting points in the att, and focus).

About the only skill you would do that for is Steward.
Medicine and Engineer are by less likely to need a focus point. So just by you using 2 attributes (total,.. on top of the 3 u start with), and a couple focus in steward, and 1 value in engineer/medicine. you will go far. (grand total of about 2 ATT, and 5-6 focus points)

I'm not saying "add 7 attribute to INT, to make it 10.. then add however many focus you need to each skill in that tree, to make it FIVE" etc. I'm saying you can easily spare 2 INT, (since as discussed VIGOR, and CONTROL , and Cunning aren't super useful). you get extra Endurance ATT from skills. (so can hit 9 endurance SUPER EASY).

So basically the 3 INT you most likely start with at creation, add another 2 INT, and max steward Focus, and put 1-2 points in medicine, and engineer. Will take you far.

The XP you get in return is probably going to replace 1.5 of that attribute, and 4-6 of those spent focus points. (remember you don't need to take INT to 10, and each skill to FIVE). If you have a scrub companion in medicine, you get zero xp in med. (Yet, you probably have 3 INT already, and maybe even 1 in Med) etc.

Regardless, I do it. Many do it. No one has to do it. If there is a better way for them to hit level 40... with 300 Steward, 180+ medicine, and 100+ engineer.. go for it.

I also end up with 300+ smithing, 200+ riding, 200+ athletics. 200+ charm, 200+ trade, 200+ leadership. 250+ polearm, 200+ bow, and 175+ scout. Pretty easily. The other skills raise too, but I don't find them to be Core to my builds.

If they TRULY feel they need 300 Medicine, or 300 Engineer. yeah probably not a great idea to try it yourself, since it takes more INT points than it's worth in my opinion.

That is all very informative. Thanks for typing it out.

[RJboxer]

^^^^ @djo

And he is who convinced me to try more points in scouting. So yep, it definitely has uses.

I personally don't want to put too many Attributes in Cunning, but have no problem throwing a few focus there. (especially for the Beast master perk). Most builds I think tend to start with an average of 3's in all attributes, at character creation, with maybe one or two pushing 5.

So assuming you have a 3 to start in cunning, it is definitely worth it to throw maybe 1 more in cunning, and a few focus in scout. There are some definite benfits there. and you can get the skill quite high IMO with minimal effort

As Djo says, There are definitely people who have different playstyles than me, and certainly value other things Less, or More than I do.

Kudos to TW for making it at least a "little viable" to do different builds. (though I still fee end, int, and soc are too valuable compared to vigor, cont, cunning... but that's just me)

[RJboxer]

Originally posted by Kayeka:

Originally posted by RJboxer:

You would mostly be correct. IF THAT was the only way to get more skill. (putting points in the att, and focus).

About the only skill you would do that for is Steward.
Medicine and Engineer are by less likely to need a focus point. So just by you using 2 attributes (total,.. on top of the 3 u start with), and a couple focus in steward, and 1 value in engineer/medicine. you will go far. (grand total of about 2 ATT, and 5-6 focus points)

I'm not saying "add 7 attribute to INT, to make it 10.. then add however many focus you need to each skill in that tree, to make it FIVE" etc. I'm saying you can easily spare 2 INT, (since as discussed VIGOR, and CONTROL , and Cunning aren't super useful). you get extra Endurance ATT from skills. (so can hit 9 endurance SUPER EASY).

So basically the 3 INT you most likely start with at creation, add another 2 INT, and max steward Focus, and put 1-2 points in medicine, and engineer. Will take you far.

The XP you get in return is probably going to replace 1.5 of that attribute, and 4-6 of those spent focus points. (remember you don't need to take INT to 10, and each skill to FIVE). If you have a scrub companion in medicine, you get zero xp in med. (Yet, you probably have 3 INT already, and maybe even 1 in Med) etc.

Regardless, I do it. Many do it. No one has to do it. If there is a better way for them to hit level 40... with 300 Steward, 180+ medicine, and 100+ engineer.. go for it.

I also end up with 300+ smithing, 200+ riding, 200+ athletics. 200+ charm, 200+ trade, 200+ leadership. 250+ polearm, 200+ bow, and 175+ scout. Pretty easily. The other skills raise too, but I don't find them to be Core to my builds.

If they TRULY feel they need 300 Medicine, or 300 Engineer. yeah probably not a great idea to try it yourself, since it takes more INT points than it's worth in my opinion.

That is all very informative. Thanks for typing it out.

You're welcome. Thanks for reading my opinions :)


~cheers

[Swordmouse]

The INT path is definitely valid and RJ makes some good points, it's a good build that nets you a fair amount of abilities you'll miss by assigning a companion to the job.

I'm still in the process of trying various builds, but so far I personally prefer assigning companions to INT jobs so I can put my points where companions CAN'T already help me - skills like Charm, Tactics, Leadership, Roguery, Trade (to a large extent) and the personal combat/movement skills (if you want) are all things where you are entirely on your own. Since Scouting shares CUNNING with Roguery and Tactics, that's generally the job I'll take for myself if I'm boosting CUNNING anyway, since there's a decent amount of "party leader" perks.

As mentioned, you can get away with neglecting combat skills entirely and still be sufficiently effective with good gear - so it's more down to how much you'd like to focus those skills/that playstyle.

For a "hands on" character, Bow is insanely good and versatile, and IMHO pretty satisfying to use. You can put 0 points in polearm and SHRED with a few choice bladed polearms, but if have 0 in bow and try to use one, you're gonna mostly suck. Athletics has some great perks which can be worth grinding out, but in serious battles, you're ultimately at a disadvantage if you're on foot because it's harder to command your troops. And if you're deciding to be mounted, IMHO polearm is simply the way to go - 1H and 2H can be satisfying, but the reach and damage of a good polearm is such that it feels like if I'm playing with something else, it's for the novelty/theme of the build and not effectiveness.

TLDR: Lots of great builds, but so far my favorite is probably high Social/Cunning (with associated skills) a good chunk in Bow, some ENDURANCE (both Athletics and Smithing can boost your Attributes a couple times each in their own right, which means even more points), and virtually nothing in INT and VIGOR.

[Elriadon]

Do all fo the party leader jobs, more XP for you, plus the best attributes boost those skills anyway.

The best skills are noncombat skills, your army is the bulk of your power, being a great general is way more important the longer the game goes than being good in combat. Not to mention you can be a great general who is also great in combat. Better damage with your sword doesn't compare to something like +20 HP to every soldier in your army (pretty much a 20% HP increase for every unit).

Focus your attribute points on Intelligence, Charisma and Cunning or Endurance, in that order.

For Intelligence, Focus on Steward and Medicine, Engineering is good too, but can wait until later in the game. Medicine has wonderful perks that work only for Party or Clan leader, so you need them on your main character.

For Charisma, Charm becomes really important once you have a kingdom (for recruiting lords), but the main skill you want is Leadershiop Trade is great too, if you like the playstyle. An early trade perk allows you to level up your clan really fast.

Cunning is nice to have atleast at 5, Scouting is pretty useful to have, Roguery is entirely unneeded, but Tactics are severely underestimated, you can autoresolve against an army double your size with zero losses by the time you get the final perk, even autoresolving against town becomes ridiculously good, especially if you pick that decreased fortifications bonus perk. Just like max Trade allows you to buy your way to victory, max Tactics allows you to autoresolve your way to victory.

Lategame is pretty much constant battle after constant battle. Being able to autoresolve the fights you don't particularly care about without you whole army dying offscreen is pretty much a must at that point.

Tactics are also an incredibly important skill for leaders of your Clan Parties, it's the only skill that determines how well their army fights against enemies.

Vigor can be skipped, you really only need one melee skill and you don't need it higher than 100. Just put focus points to your favorite melee skill, get an OP weapon and you are set. Probably Two-Handed, since 2H Axes can cleave.

For Control, decide if you want to be an Archer or not, if yes, you need to invest in it, as shooting without a high ranged skill is pretty difficult. Mounted Archer is probably the best combat build in the game.

Endurance is probably the most important out of the 3 "personal attributes", you want both Athletics and Riding. You can get some really cool horses with high riding skill Athletics is the most important skill if you want to fight on foot. Smithing... better to have an NPC for it.

Also, your character's kids will be ridiculously more powerful than your first character, your heir will get great stats and a high level with a lot of attribute and focus points to minmax him to your hearts content. I actually have 10 in half of the stats and all of the other ones are 5 at least.