Best defense oriented faction

[=CrimsoN=]

I always say "the best offense is a stalwart defense". Deny the enemies ability to attack you in the first place. In Warband, the best defense oriented faction was objectively the Rhodoks and so I always loved joining them and using their units. Rhodoks were pure defense in the fact that they lacked a cavalry unit in native and excelled at pike formations and fielding crossbows.

Whats the best defensive oriented faction in Bannerlord?

Aserai, Khuzait, Empire are all definitely offense oriented

which leaves the Battania, Sturgia and Vlandia

Battania seems like they would be the most defense oriented. They occupy a forested reason which is a natural defense. They tend to field polearms and archers and they only have 2 types of cav (both of which are inferior to any other faction's cav). Only issue is that all their archers fall under the noble tree. So they are kind of difficult to acquire in large quantities. Their troops also aren't very well armoured.

Sturgia is next and I don't really know too much about them. Haven't played with their troops yet or even explored much of their territory. Far as I can see though, they have much easier access to ranged units and have slightly more cavalry options than Battania (but still inferior to Vlandian, Aserai or Khuzait cav). They have a lot of "blitz" units though since they are partially nord. So they'd probably be better on offense, but I don't know.

Last is Vlandia. Since the Rhodoks split from them by the time of Warband, it's no surprise that the Vlandians have an entire section of their unit tree dedicated solely to crossbowmen. In addition, all their infantry has access to polearms. The only thing is that their noble tree is dedicated to offense oriented knights. Outside of that though, their regular units seem to be mostly defense oriented.

So which out of these 3 would be best in defense? Has anyone tried all of their units yet?

[Mormacil]

Battania is 100% offense. They're glass cannons who lack defensive staying power. Don't use them for defense, they're ambushers and raiders.

Empire is solidly as much defense as offense. They get some of the best shielded infantry in the game, great archers and crossbows. They're a defensive power house.

Vlandia alongside Empire would be my main defensive factions honestly.

[Super Cosmic Space Magnet]

If you're talking specifically about sieges, I've found Vladians to be the hardest to beat when attacking their castles. Their garrison troops all have spears, which in those giant clusters at the tops of ladders/in the collapsed wall segments, makes them incredibly strong at avoiding damage while other factions will still get chipped here and there. That and because crossbowmen bend over to reload, they naturally spend more time ducking under ramparts than the AI archers who just stand at their posts and get shot.

[Apples]

Empire is pretty balanced.

[Swordmouse]

To me, defense means plentiful, hard-hitting missile units and the ability to fend off cavalry.

While the game is unbalanced in regards to spear lines/defending against cavalry, Vladia is the only line with great mass-fielded missile units and also a strong polearm line.

Sturgia is great while defending a city/castle, but that's it.

Battania would be OK... except fielding nobles en-masse is incredibly tedious.

Vladia wins hands-down as the faction that can be played defensively without a headache IMHO. Give the sharpshooters a try, they can do some work.

[Swirler]

Oh god. flashbacks to trying to take rhodok castles in warband. Crossbows everywhere.

They're a nightmare to take on in sieges. Dunno how they fare in autoresolve though.

[=CrimsoN=]

Good stuff, good stuff. So Vlandia and Empire are best for defense. Vlandia for their archers and polearms and Empire because they are an armoured powerhouse (and cataphracts are sexy asf)

[Halfgeek]

Originally posted by Swordmouse:

To me, defense means plentiful, hard-hitting missile units and the ability to fend off cavalry.

While the game is unbalanced in regards to spear lines/defending against cavalry, Vladia is the only line with great mass-fielded missile units and also a strong polearm line.

Sturgia is great while defending a city/castle, but that's it.

Battania would be OK... except fielding nobles en-masse is incredibly tedious.

Vladia wins hands-down as the faction that can be played defensively without a headache IMHO. Give the sharpshooters a try, they can do some work.

Empire has spear infantry with the best armor & shield. They have highly armored archers and crossbows, the latter also has a large shield.

I'd say they are as good or better than Vlandia in this aspect.

Though, almost nothing will break a Battanian line of Wildling infantry backed by Fian Champions. Few things will make it into close range, and those who make it, get a volley of javelins to the face from the Wildlings (who also have good armor + shield).

[Halfgeek]

Contrary to logic, the best anti-cav isn't spearmen currently. For foot soldiers, its crossbows or javelin infantry. Cav charging at these guys will get instant 1 hit killed.

[=CrimsoN=]

Originally posted by Halfgeek:

Contrary to logic, the best anti-cav isn't spearmen currently. For foot soldiers, its crossbows or javelin infantry. Cav charging at these guys will get instant 1 hit killed.

Yeah. really hoping that polearms get a buff. Archery seems a little too overpowered at the moment. You don't even have to headshot half the time to get a one-shot kill.

[Morkonan]

Originally posted by -CrimsoN-:

...Aserai, Khuzait, Empire are all definitely offense oriented
..

Empire is "armor-centric." I'd disagree it's "definitely offense oriented" when compared to other Factions. It's balanced for armor, staying healthy in long battles with tough melee units, and "holding the line," but its ranged units aren't that great at "ranged unit stuff." While it does have the really nice Elite Cataphract units, its Buccalari are not really that great at "horse archer" and are very squishy in sieges. (Buccalari are nice skirmishers to confuse the enemy and to temp them out of defensive positions, but they don't tend to rack up tons of kills and die very frequently in offensive sieges.)

Empire Menavaltions <sp> suck. They are usually just battlefield carpet when ever someone is throwing sticks using wood and string. The Elite Menavaltions, though, are pretty decent polearm units and do a great job as long as a nearby crossbowman isn't angry at them. (They can blank any cavalry unit that gets tied up with them very quickly.)

I have never had the chance to participate in a defensive siege... Not once. Not even a little bit. :/, :/, :/,.... :/ So, I can't speak to any unit's effectiveness, there. Be advised, though - Some castles have confined spaces that cause big issues for units with long weapons, like Menavaltions. <sp>

To give Empire a "definitely offense" winning ticket, it'd need double quivers on Palantine Guard, a light "Lancer" line of cav, and maybe change the standard Menavaltian so they're equipped with some javelins. Leaving the Elite without them is fine.

[=CrimsoN=]

Originally posted by Morkonan:

Originally posted by -CrimsoN-:

...Aserai, Khuzait, Empire are all definitely offense oriented
..

Empire is "armor-centric." I'd disagree it's "definitely offense oriented" when compared to other Factions. It's balanced for armor, staying healthy in long battles with tough melee units, and "holding the line," but its ranged units aren't that great at "ranged unit stuff." While it does have the really nice Elite Cataphract units, its Buccalari are not really that great at "horse archer" and are very squishy in sieges. (Buccalari are nice skirmishers to confuse the enemy and to temp them out of defensive positions, but they don't tend to rack up tons of kills and die very frequently in offensive sieges.)

Empire Menavaltions <sp> suck. They are usually just battlefield carpet when ever someone is throwing sticks using wood and string. The Elite Menavaltions, though, are pretty decent polearm units and do a great job as long as a nearby crossbowman isn't angry at them. (They can blank any cavalry unit that gets tied up with them very quickly.)

I have never had the chance to participate in a defensive siege... Not once. Not even a little bit. :/, :/, :/,.... :/ So, I can't speak to any unit's effectiveness, there. Be advised, though - Some castles have confined spaces that cause big issues for units with long weapons, like Menavaltions. <sp>

Yeah I was wrong. It seems like the Empire and Vlandia are the best defense oriented factions. I wasn't thinking of armor, but yeah the Empire do field the most armoured units who can tank ridiculous amounts of damage.

[Morkonan]

Originally posted by -CrimsoN-:

...
Yeah I was wrong. It seems like the Empire and Vlandia are the best defense oriented factions. I wasn't thinking of armor, but yeah the Empire do field the most armoured units who can tank ridiculous amounts of damage.

With the exception of the lower Tier Menavaltions <sp> and Buccarli - The lower Tier Menavaltians.. (Can't spell that for @%^ consistently) will die if an archer looks at them in a mean way. Buccalarri tend to get chewed up if they can't run away from sharp things.

ALL of the other Top Tier units are pretty darn durable, though. (Highest armor values in the game, I think.)

PS: A castle garrisoned with Legionnaires, some Noble line troops (ridiculously sturdy), a good number of Sergeant Crossbowmen with a smattering of Palantine Guard for quick dps, and Elite Menevaltions... I don't think it could be taken by anything other than a huge numbers advantage if the player participated. (That doesn't count having enough of those units to cover the Siege Tower/Ladder and Gate slots. If any one of those is fully breached, no castle can withstand a siege if the attacker has a standard "numbers advantage.")

Unfortunately, the Lord "All Recruit" armies tend to disallow us having a really good working knowledge of comparable army strengths in the field as well as in sieges.

[katzenkrimis]

Originally posted by -CrimsoN-:

Sturgia is next and I don't really know too much about them.

I don't know.

They are both. Highly versatile.

The only units worth using are the Veteran Warriors, Veteran Archers, Horse Raiders and Druzhinnik Champions. You can easily stomp the AI and beat the game with these units.

Veteran Warriors and Druzhinnik Champions are tough as nailz. = Defense

Horse Raiders and Veteran Archers are decent snipers = Offense

You can turtle or use these units offensively. Take your pick. The AI can't stop you.

As long as you keep your unit count balanced. Don't be one of those idiots that just spams one unit. Always use combined arms. No matter how flawed the game is. It's good practice for when you transition to other combat games.

[Trip]

An all archer empire army works great on the defense.

A line of crossbows
A double line of archers withe the palatine guard in the back in lower tier archers/crossbows in the middle.
Buccii's to harrass other horse archers and confuse cavalry, they can be told to hold fire and do a charge too, but you have to REALLY watch them close.

The Imperial Crossbow Sergeant can be told to hold fire and shield wall and, by and large, they do a pretty damn good shield wall. Palatine guard as well can take a beating which is why you put them a little towards the back to deal with the cavalry that makes it past the bucciis. Your "trainee" crossbows and archers go in the middle since they will have the weaknesses of most archers.

The main weakness is running out of arrows, which does happen kinda fast so you have to micro manage the hold fire/fire at will.