Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord

Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord

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Rykmentti 2020 年 4 月 7 日 上午 4:54
Is using macros in multiplayer considered cheating? (Yes it is)
So I was playing a siege and I noticed this guy who was very good at manual blocks, making seemingly impossible blocks and swings. (Turning to the character right while doing a left side swing or doing multiple blocks for my feints with no margin for error etc.)

So I dueled him couple times and then I confronted him about it and he told me he was using macros. A program, that you can use to simulate keyboard presses and mouse movement and then designate an input that simulates those inputs. So you can have 8 different inputs. 4 for left/right handed swing, overhead swing, thrust and 4 for blocks instead mouse movement and two buttons.

He also told me that in regular M&B there was an option to use inputs for all 4 blocks and 4 strikes. So it was pretty much stupid to use mouse aiming when you had superior control scheme right in front of you. (I didn't even know it existed back in M&B)

Are there inputs for all strikes and blocks in the control menu somewhere? I couldn't find it, if not, isn't that an unfair advantage over other players? Since we can't use this same control method in the game without external program.

I told him about this and he didn't consider it cheating, since he was doing same thing that was viable in M&B Multiplayer.

But still... If this is allowed, I'm sure as hell are going to learn everything I need to know about macros and start using them, since it seems to be so much more effective and reliable way to play the game.

I couldn't find any thread discussing this so I decided to make one. Discuss!

Edit: Please developers. If this thread is any clue, community would greatly appreciate your thoughts on this matter. Thank you!

Edit 2: Thank you for the clarification.
最后由 Rykmentti 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 10 日 上午 8:45
引用自 Aeronwen:
My information from TW is that macros are, of course, cheating in multiplayer.
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正在显示第 376 - 390 条,共 437 条留言
Monstreek 2020 年 4 月 12 日 上午 3:36 
引用自 CrazyCracker
引用自 Monstreek
Sometimes I "fix" ♥♥♥♥♥♥ controls with a macros in games. But wouldn't do it for blocking and attacking in M&B2 because I hardly find it more comfortable to use 8 more buttons lol

Now if he would make some kind of auto-block in multiplayer you could say that it is cheating. But he still has to pick direction and press correct key for it. There is no advantage in that.

PS: macros use isn't cheating
enjoy your ban then
Learn to read. First of all I said that I see no point doing it for M&B2. Second, I don't play M&B2 for multiplayer. There are better games if I would want PvP. And by saying that there is no difference between hardware and software macroses you just make yourself look stupid and uneducated.
Gondola 2020 年 4 月 12 日 下午 3:29 
引用自 Monstreek
引用自 CrazyCracker
enjoy your ban then
PS: macros use isn't cheating


LOL, I can read fine. You have a literal smooth brain.
最后由 Gondola 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 12 日 下午 3:31
Mollerz 2020 年 4 月 25 日 上午 11:28 
We ran into a squad doing this last night. We just stopped playing because we kept getting matched to them over and over.

Became stupid.
TheUgly 2020 年 4 月 25 日 下午 1:24 
Whole squad of dbags were doin this last night, just ruins the skill and ultimately the fun of the game. @devs please disallow
B2own 2020 年 4 月 25 日 下午 1:33 
Theres a few of them..... jsut deal with them, they are naturally trash at the game, and frankly they arent to bright in general so even the smallest tactics and skill will crush these fools
Gondola 2020 年 4 月 26 日 上午 8:24 
引用自 B2own
Theres a few of them..... jsut deal with them, they are naturally trash at the game, and frankly they arent to bright in general so even the smallest tactics and skill will crush these fools
Terrible attitude. Deal with cheaters? ♥♥♥♥ no, report them and try to get them banned.
最后由 Gondola 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 26 日 上午 8:24
MiKye200 2020 年 4 月 26 日 上午 8:28 
So, all those guys furiously whirling in circles and swinging two-handed axes were using macros?
I was wondering why they kept running into walls.
sjorpha 2020 年 5 月 7 日 上午 5:47 
What is cheating?

Cheating is breaking the rules of a game, so whether macros are cheating is simply a question of whether taleworlds makes a rule against them or not.

Something that is allowed can still be considered immoral, unfair, unsportsmanlike and so on, but that doesn't make it cheating.

There are games that allow macros, in those games macros are NOT cheating, regardless of whether they give you an advantage or not.

There are games that don't allow macros, in those games macros ARE cheating, regardless of whether they give you an advantage or not.

There are some things macros can not do, they are strings of pre-configured input and cannot adapt to the game state. So things like automatic blocks in the right direction, aimbots and so on can not be done with just a macro. If someone has an inhuman block accuracy (always right direction) and claims it is because of a macro they are lying, it is of course possible to be extremely good at blocking while also using a macro, but the macro can not pick the right block direction for you.

I have seen games where macros are a genuine problem, primarily in shooters with fixed recoil patterns, where a macro can be made to essentially remove recoil from automatic weapons making them overpowered.

I have also seen games where macros are not a problem, for example in Mechwarrior online you can macro perfect chainfire of autocannons, which is impossible to do manually, but since chainfire is objectively worse than shooting them together it's a non-issue as you get no advantage from it. There are still people there who thinks it should be banned though.

Macros are actually really hard to ban. They are built into every modern gaming keyboard and mouse, and there isn't really a way to automatically detect them as there is no unusual software to scan for. You can't realistically ask people to not run the controller software that came with their peripherals. So the only way to enforce a ban on macros is manual moderation, and since there are players who are insanely good at the game, it's not enough to just observe a series of "perfect" moves that some bad player decided was "impossible". Most accusations of cheating in online games are bad players unable to accept that good players can be really really good at the game.

I'm normally against rules that cannot be consistently and effectively enforced. I'm open to macros being banned in bannerlord, but only if there is a reliable way to enforce it. If it's going to be sporadic manual moderation I'm not so sure, in that case it's better to try and make the mechanics such that macros don't give a big advantage. I'm actually not convinced they do that now.
最后由 sjorpha 编辑于; 2020 年 5 月 7 日 下午 4:50
Claus 2020 年 5 月 7 日 上午 6:00 
Use macros till you die, this is a singleplayer focused game.
Gator 2020 年 5 月 7 日 上午 6:12 
引用自 sjorpha
What is cheating?

Cheating is breaking the rules of a game, so whether macros are cheating is simply a question of whether taleworlds makes a rule against them or not.
...
There are some things macros can not do, they are strings of pre-configured input and cannot adapt to the game state. So things like automatic blocks in the right direction, aimbotd and so on cannot be done with just a macro. If someone has an inhuman block accuracy (always right direction) and claims it is because of a macro they are lying, it is of course possible to be extremely good at blocking while also using a macro, but the macro can not pick the right block direction for you.
...

This
BigShootata 2020 年 5 月 7 日 上午 6:40 
how macros can help you with blocking in this game i dont get it?...cause u have to choose the block direction...
HarshHash 2020 年 5 月 7 日 上午 6:49 
引用自 Supirmin
how macros can help you with blocking in this game i dont get it?...cause u have to choose the block direction...

From what i understood from the main post you can set up a macro and keybind so viewing direction isn't a thing.

You play with like 20 keys.

1 for left swing, 1 for right swing, 1 for overhead, 1 for thrust, 1 to block left, 1 to block right, 1 to block up, 1 to block low. idk how many keys or things you can do in this game because who the fk plays MP but imo i dont see anything wrong with that if that is what they're "macroing".

Chillum 2020 年 5 月 7 日 上午 6:53 
引用自 HarshHash
引用自 Supirmin
how macros can help you with blocking in this game i dont get it?...cause u have to choose the block direction...

From what i understood from the main post you can set up a macro and keybind so viewing direction isn't a thing.

You play with like 20 keys.

1 for left swing, 1 for right swing, 1 for overhead, 1 for thrust, 1 to block left, 1 to block right, 1 to block up, 1 to block low. idk how many keys or things you can do in this game because who the fk plays MP but imo i dont see anything wrong with that if that is what they're "macroing".
Thats not the entirety of the macro abuse.

You can also write a simple swing macro, now you never miss your combo swing window.

Feint macros are self explanatory. Ever wonder how that guy can feint 5x, swapping his attacks without any bleed over. Not once does he throw two horizontals in a row. Hes using macros.

Macros can also allow you to change block directions without ever leaving block animation, just smooth transfer between blocks.

And plenty of us played MB MP. And planty of us play Bannerlord MP. Its just the server amount and quality thats stopping us.
HarshHash 2020 年 5 月 7 日 上午 7:02 
引用自 Chillum
引用自 HarshHash

From what i understood from the main post you can set up a macro and keybind so viewing direction isn't a thing.

You play with like 20 keys.

1 for left swing, 1 for right swing, 1 for overhead, 1 for thrust, 1 to block left, 1 to block right, 1 to block up, 1 to block low. idk how many keys or things you can do in this game because who the fk plays MP but imo i dont see anything wrong with that if that is what they're "macroing".
Thats not the entirety of the macro abuse.

You can also write a simple swing macro, now you never miss your combo swing window.

Feint macros are self explanatory. Ever wonder how that guy can feint 5x, swapping his attacks without any bleed over. Not once does he throw two horizontals in a row. Hes using macros.

Macros can also allow you to change block directions without ever leaving block animation, just smooth transfer between blocks.

And plenty of us played MB MP. And planty of us play Bannerlord MP. Its just the server amount and quality thats stopping us.


I don't play MB multiplayer so yeah I was only guessing what people can even do in the game lol, I just know when i played mordhau I personally had my keys set up like this macro, it was ingame keys on mordhau though so you could bind each swing/stab/overhead/block direction individually I had like 20 keys lol. But in that sense alone i dont think there's anything wrong with it, idk how feinting works in MB at all but if they can do things that trick you visually and shouldn't be possible to do if it was a real human movement and thats the skill of blocking feints removed then yeah probs not good
Subak 2020 年 5 月 7 日 上午 7:03 
isn't that an unfair advantage over other players?

This right here.

PC gaming markets cheating even when it's not selling you hacks on shady websites.

Higher frame-rate/input latency/polling? Technically, it's all cheating.

But I don't think all cheats are made equal and macros are far worse (more imbalanced) than any of the above.

That said, just ditch the MP so they will put those folks on the wonderful SP experience and make SP super extra awesome.
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发帖日期: 2020 年 4 月 7 日 上午 4:54
回复数: 437