Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord

Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord

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Rykmentti 2020 年 4 月 7 日 上午 4:54
Is using macros in multiplayer considered cheating? (Yes it is)
So I was playing a siege and I noticed this guy who was very good at manual blocks, making seemingly impossible blocks and swings. (Turning to the character right while doing a left side swing or doing multiple blocks for my feints with no margin for error etc.)

So I dueled him couple times and then I confronted him about it and he told me he was using macros. A program, that you can use to simulate keyboard presses and mouse movement and then designate an input that simulates those inputs. So you can have 8 different inputs. 4 for left/right handed swing, overhead swing, thrust and 4 for blocks instead mouse movement and two buttons.

He also told me that in regular M&B there was an option to use inputs for all 4 blocks and 4 strikes. So it was pretty much stupid to use mouse aiming when you had superior control scheme right in front of you. (I didn't even know it existed back in M&B)

Are there inputs for all strikes and blocks in the control menu somewhere? I couldn't find it, if not, isn't that an unfair advantage over other players? Since we can't use this same control method in the game without external program.

I told him about this and he didn't consider it cheating, since he was doing same thing that was viable in M&B Multiplayer.

But still... If this is allowed, I'm sure as hell are going to learn everything I need to know about macros and start using them, since it seems to be so much more effective and reliable way to play the game.

I couldn't find any thread discussing this so I decided to make one. Discuss!

Edit: Please developers. If this thread is any clue, community would greatly appreciate your thoughts on this matter. Thank you!

Edit 2: Thank you for the clarification.
最后由 Rykmentti 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 10 日 上午 8:45
引用自 Aeronwen:
My information from TW is that macros are, of course, cheating in multiplayer.
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Rykmentti 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 10:34 
Sigh... I got emotional and got carried away...

But still Developers. PLEASE integrate macros into the game if you are going to make it all about using macros, because if there are people using macros and people using their own manual inputs for everything, people using macros will ALWAYS have an advantage.

Don't make it like, we have to use an external program not endorsed by you guys, to actual beat people who are using them.
最后由 Rykmentti 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 10:43
TommyFresh 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 10:40 
引用自 nakoda
so Logitech G keyboards are cheating now? what about mice with a baker's dozen macro buttons?

what about mods? are mods cheating? they explicitly alter game variables.

there is a mod called AutoBlocker that has a ContinuousDrag mode that is, IMO, how blocking should work in teh game to begin with. am I cheating for using it?


Yes

Why do you need auto block? Are you that terrible you cannot right click?
最后由 TommyFresh 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 10:43
Rykmentti 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 10:42 
引用自 Asmodeus
i don't really care about pressing one button to simulate a swing that releases after a set delay. that seems pretty stupid and you're better off manually controlling it anyway. however, if what you say about these automated mouse movements is true (which i HEAVILY DOUBT because of the absolutely ridiculous amount of programming it would take to give you any viable advantage in this game), then yes ♥♥♥♥ that guy. its just melee aimbot at that point.

Literally every single macro program allows you to set delay between the inputs. Even the ones that come with these "macro" keyboards. The thing here is that, you can do perfect feints as in, lowest possible time to to do a feint and then strike, in succession, without any room for human error, among other things.

Someone without macros will always be slower to strike and prone to mistakes while the player who is using macros is always going to be frame perfect with his strikes, his strikes will always be faster and he's NEVER going to make mistake while trying to strike, unlike a regular humanbeing with no macros.

Yes, you need learn the game to know when to block and when to start with the macros but everything else is removed from the skill equation, thus giving an advantage to players using macros.
最后由 Rykmentti 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 10:49
»Matrim Cauthon« 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 11:00 
引用自 Rykmentti
引用自 »Nihilist«
You know the game natively supports the direction keys for attack and defending right?

Any macro like this is going to be an arrow key plus mouse button macro, no mouse movement.

That said, you've got a great point with complex macros, that's taking it far beyond simple accessibility and taking it to another level.

Thank you for your response.

I know that, you can manually block each direction with mouse and keyboard but there is not explicit button for "block left/Right/up/down" same for strikes. If I'm wrong please correct me.

You are incorrect here.

The game supports 2 different modes for attacking and blocking.

The default is "Mouse movement" + "Bound Key"

The alternative is "Arrow Key" + "Bound key"


While the default bounds are to left and rick mouse click, this can also be changed natively in the game.

Nothing stops me from, again natively through the game, changing the block button to the shift key and using shift + arrow to block. There are various ways it can be set up to completely eliminate any chance of error in executing your chose action.

Both striking and blocking can be completely divorced from mouse input.
Rykmentti 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 11:13 
引用自 »Nihilist«
You are incorrect here.

The game supports 2 different modes for attacking and blocking.

The default is "Mouse movement" + "Bound Key"

The alternative is "Arrow Key" + "Bound key"


While the default bounds are to left and rick mouse click, this can also be changed natively in the game.

Nothing stops me from, again natively through the game, changing the block button to the shift key and using shift + arrow to block. There are various ways it can be set up to completely eliminate any chance of error in executing your chose action.

Both striking and blocking can be completely divorced from mouse input.

Ah I found it. It's on the gameplay settings. Thanks, so it is in the game but what I meant still stands about macros

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ I tried that and it would take me ages to learn to play with that scheme now that I'm used to mouse movement. But yeah that would make it possible to completely remove mouse input from strikes and blocks. But it would still require at least two inputs to do a block. Movement key and strike/block.

In a way... this could be a superior control scheme when compared to mouse control scheme, probably takes ages to learn to play with it.
最后由 Rykmentti 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 11:27
nakoda 2020 年 4 月 7 日 下午 11:42 
honestly i think the biggest issue is the amount of clicking with the mouse, rather than press and hold (especially for block) ... i just feel like it would be more intuitive to hold down right click to block, and move the mouse up/down/left/right to block in that direction while moving with WASD/mouselook. Likewise, positioning the mouse, then clicking, then moving the mouse to attack is cumbersome. why not allow player to hold down click and move the mouse to simulate the swing direction.
Gondola 2020 年 4 月 8 日 上午 3:29 
引用自 quicKmEtaL
Not Cheating and not an unfair advantage. Nothing stopping anyone else from buying the same equipment available, or learning how to remap mouse controls with macros.

How is it cheating if one team has access to better equipment. Better monitor, better cpu, better gpu, faster ssd, faster ram, better audio, better mouse with higher dpi. Where is it gonna end?

Your logic is ♥♥♥♥♥♥. So I can play csgo with an aimbot because anyone can go download it. Thus it is not cheating. Thats not how it works. Using macros is dishonest, and its clearly not the intention of the gameplay to be made easier via 3rd party programs. Also, did you seriously compare using a extrnal program to PC specs? Stfu idiot. Get good.
最后由 Gondola 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 8 日 上午 3:32
Blind 2020 年 4 月 8 日 上午 4:27 
Look at it in terms of mechanical advantage, you pull a lever that moves 2 levers, that moves 4 levers. You are the one pulling that lever. The levers do no deviate from the path you've set them on. It still depends on your talent when to activate those levers and decide when to and how to use them strategically. In games like WOW and SC2 macros are essential and therefore adopted by the comp scene as a whole to benefit everyone. In Bannerlord it is questionable because of the nature of the game.
Wither 2020 年 4 月 8 日 上午 5:50 
引用自 CrazyCracker
引用自 quicKmEtaL
Not Cheating and not an unfair advantage. Nothing stopping anyone else from buying the same equipment available, or learning how to remap mouse controls with macros.

How is it cheating if one team has access to better equipment. Better monitor, better cpu, better gpu, faster ssd, faster ram, better audio, better mouse with higher dpi. Where is it gonna end?

Your logic is ♥♥♥♥♥♥. So I can play csgo with an aimbot because anyone can go download it. Thus it is not cheating. Thats not how it works. Using macros is dishonest, and its clearly not the intention of the gameplay to be made easier via 3rd party programs. Also, did you seriously compare using a extrnal program to PC specs? Stfu idiot. Get good.

Dose remap control count as cheating?
Gondola 2020 年 4 月 8 日 下午 5:00 
引用自 ONE
引用自 CrazyCracker

Your logic is ♥♥♥♥♥♥. So I can play csgo with an aimbot because anyone can go download it. Thus it is not cheating. Thats not how it works. Using macros is dishonest, and its clearly not the intention of the gameplay to be made easier via 3rd party programs. Also, did you seriously compare using a extrnal program to PC specs? Stfu idiot. Get good.

Dose remap control count as cheating?

Can you do it within the game? If so, then it isnt cheating
Rykmentti 2020 年 4 月 8 日 下午 9:01 
♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥... Are you people really fine with this? That this game could become dependant upon macros? Where someone has an advantage, just because he's using an external program, seperate from the main game, and other one is not?

And don't you dare tell me that, "It's just couple people using it" It WILL become more mainstream if we let it happen. It's kind of stupid to play at an disadvantage when everyone has an advantage over you.

I can't believe this.
最后由 Rykmentti 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 8 日 下午 9:03
Truth🤍 2020 年 4 月 8 日 下午 9:06 
Using WoW as an example does not justify using macros for Bannerlord. In WoW macros are literally built into the game, and they are not in Bannerlord.

If it is not a feature of the game, they should not be used.
Flippy 2020 年 4 月 8 日 下午 9:07 
Of course its cheating, but in the defence of those that dont think it is, they are most likely running 3 other third party programs for multi player they also dont think are cheats. ;)
最后由 Flippy 编辑于; 2020 年 4 月 8 日 下午 9:08
L 2020 年 4 月 8 日 下午 9:10 
Macro is not cheating. bots scripts are.
howerver, t's controversial about how smart macros should be.
In dota2 there are many macros that pro used in the past that are added into the game cuz it's useful and enabling everyone to use them would improve the game. Like constant right click etc settings.
Sumail used simple macro as Storm in pro games in the keyboard or mouse. It raise controversy but in the end he is not banned.
SuperCrumpets 2020 年 4 月 8 日 下午 9:11 
macros are cheating but so is having a better mouse/framerate from better pc/bigger higher res monitor so i can see better etc.
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发帖日期: 2020 年 4 月 7 日 上午 4:54
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