n00b question: Why can't I kill Alice? [Normal Mode, Chapter 3, Screenshot included]

[XX //]

i've actually had this game for a while, but the steam sale reminded me i wanted to play it today! i'm playing on normal mode and CH 3 is the first time i feel like i encountered a "real" boss, but, i feel like i must have missed something very important during the tutorial stages?

(i am using all default mouse+keyboard input)

- i keep getting Alice to 1hp/ 0hp on repeated fresh attempts without much trouble, but i cannot "EXECUTE" her in the literal sense. i have tried: spamming F (default key) when prompted by the game, holding F instead of spamming, holding/spamming F while quickslashing, holding/spamming F while slow (special) slashing, etc.

it always cuts into a motion indicating this is the "executionor" move - but then she heals her HP up and we return to the "tedious scuttle dance"

i've also tried weird things like (in the screenshot) unnecessarily using all my BLOOD on her (just in case, i thought i'd try that)

anyway, i repeatedly get her to 0HP but cannot execute her and end the fight, and eventually she slowly whittles my health away even when i spend a long time dodging and kiting her, when she returns to the ground she gets 1 or 2 hits in each time and the cycle repeats.

i feel like i must have been taught how to execute her in the tutorial, but i don't know *where* i am making the controls mistake to execute her before she heals? can someone explain to me exactly what i am doing wrong, if possible? i know this is a really stupid question but i just can't figure out what i overlooked in order to execute her once i destroy all her HP.

example fight screenshot below:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=515012989

i constantly get to this point, fail to kill her, she eventually whittles my health down after 10+ mins of rinse-repeat or experimenting with other combos. i can't figure out what move i failed to learn.

also, i did experiment with reviving and using Mika tickets, but it's a waste of Mika tickets as the result is the same once i'm revived.

TYSM for your help, sorry for asking such a dumb question but this is beginning to be a bit frustrating and I feel sure it's because I just "missed" learning some essential move or am not executing the move i am prompted to do correctly.

I appreciate any responses.

[KuWanTum]

It's been a LONG time since I last played this game, but you need blood to perform an execution IIRC. When she is down, spam your standard attack and the blood bar will build with your combo. Once you have a bit of blood, try the execute then.

The execute move will need you to hold one button for the screen to turn grey, and then press another to perform the move (again, this is all from memory - I haven't played the game in more than a year)

[XX //]

thanks man! i cleared it after figuring that out. ill probably end up deleting this thread unless leaving it up will help someone else out in future <which it might> -- i'm genuinely not sure if i missed that part of the execute tutorial or if it was just 100% omitted but it certainly wasn't super obvious to me (otoh, i'm not very smart)

edit: also, the game only uses a visual cue to show you that the boss fight has multiple stages, i think i messed up before i was given the advice by @KuWanTam because i was trying to "execute" her before she reached her "final stage" (even though she can have 0hp in stage 1 of the boss fight) which is why buttons i was prompted to hold/spam might not have been working.

i really appreciate the help, even if this was explained in the tutorial for the game, i missed it, and knowing how games are sometimes... i wouldn't be surprised if it WASN'T mentioned either.

[Zarakaï]

I'm on this boss right now, used all my blood to shoot her so she falls of the wall, executed her once, then she got back on the wall and I have no blood left to shoot her again. Am I missing something ? She won't get back down and I can't touc her with my blade it seems...

[XX //]

@ Tex, if you have no blood to shoot her down, i haven't figured out a way to fix this yet. restarting from the checkpoint will save your Mika tickets and start you right at the pre-boss cutscene though. edit: this is on normal mode, idk if other modes have different checkpoints.

This boss is quite confusing because as I said, there are only mild visual clues that indicate she has ~3 (iirc) stages where you gradually mutilate her body and it will change in response to this inbetween which she will periodicallly do the healing + wall dance thingy.

you basically need to survive through several phases of the healing + walldance and get her to phase 3 before execute is successfuly which IMHO was the primary source of difficulty and confusion for me. i'm afraid i don't know what to do if you ran out of blood (in the screenshot, i had only used up all my blood ON PURPOSE because i was experimenting with ways to try and get her to actually DIE)

also: i found that for the actual fight, all execution spamming aside, it was made significantly smoother and easier after implementing the 60FPS PC fix by editing the .INI file to uncap the game from 30FPS (which is the console FPS cap) ... there are 2 guides on how to do this in the community hub. overall it made the boss fight smoother and more coherent, easier to navigate, a bit less frustrating.

still couldn't have killed her even when she's 0hp without knowing what @KuWanTam told me + realizing she must be on "unnanounced" boss phase 3, though

[Larry]

When you fight David are you supposed to die once for the tutorial to kick in on getting up again? I refused to use a respawn on him but when I finally did he went down literally five seconds after I used it...

[XX //]

i'm on David fight right now actually, i tabbed out because i blew a Mika ticket on him and was feeling a bit frustrated... can confirm that either i'm doing something wrong, or you might be right, but the TL;DR is i still can't kill David after being knocked out and using a revive ticket on Mondo (ch. 4 final boss fight, to be clear)

again, here the guidelines that indicate the correct phase for "executing" David + whether this is his "final boss form" or not are incredibly absent and only present as ambiguous visual clues. i don't mean to complain so much but it's frustrating when i can tell that the game is *TRYING* to tell me how to do something but *FAILS* at teaching me how to do it.

like i said in previous post, it's entirely possible this is my own ignorance at work, but so far all evidence points to lack of adequate tutorial guidance from my biased POV...

if anyone wants to help me with David in detail, i have him at this stage:

EDIT: added another screenshot of epic failing to execute the boss when he appears @ 0hp as below -

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=515093808

so...i'm at the phase of the David fight where you lock swords with him (cough, as if it wasn't lewd enough...) and you have to spam (as indicated by the visual cue - if it's a hold indication then kill me now pls, though i did try just holding once that really didnt make sense from a gamedev POV anyway) the left mouse button.

my mouse is pretty beat up but i had no problem with getting Mika to beat David back to life by spamming in sync, but i've now died several times simply because i CANNOT spam the button fast enough.

so, um, is this intentional?

despite the fact that the visual flashes (indicating fast clicking is required to execute David)...
maybe have i mistakenly interpreted it and i'm supposed to hold it instead?

there is no text here to tell me what to do.

edit: spoilered text downwards because the below is just me ranting a lot and i'll spare you that unless you really want to mouse over it...

i swear to god i have tried spamming the mouse button: in a pattern, as fast as i can, etc. i am OK with boss fight gimmicks but this is *normal* mode and i even at one point PICKED UP THE MOUSE AND TOOK MY HANDS OFF THE KEYBOARD so that i could spam the button with BOTH MY DAMN HANDS.

am i just really bad at this game?

oh god, every boss fight is going to be like this isn't it? i have *no* trouble smashing the goons leading up to the boss on normal, getting the hidden treasures, even found the nurse without looking at the guide several times... get the boss low on HP = suddenly i can't kill him because i'm either failing to do what the game wants me to do, or the game isn't giving me enough information for me to KNOW what to do.

sorry to rant - i'm GENUINELY frustrated as heck because this is the *ONLY* part of the game so far that i haven't fully enjoyed/ had a lot of fun with... i definitely want to play this game to the story finale at least once, the "end boss fights" with the gimmick executes are really the only thing that i have a problem with. and *maybe* it's just me?

i mean, perfectly fine boss fights have suddenly become incredibly tedious every time i need to go into the very last "execute" phase and it's only going to get more gimmicky, right....?

if someone doesn't mind my wall of text, can a more experience played help me out again?

maybe give me some tips for figuring this out on my own in future since i expect all other chapter bosses will have strange gimmicks like this?

i have flipped through the comm hub guides but can't find a boss-by-boss strat one. if there is one in a foreign language (not english) that exists you can feel free to link me something like that, too, i don't mind reading something not in my native language if you can point it out to me.

[KuWanTum]

Originally posted by ӾӾ HEATWAVE IS REAL :

i'm on David fight right now actually, i tabbed out because i blew a Mika ticket on him and was feeling a bit frustrated... can confirm that either i'm doing something wrong, or you might be right, but the TL;DR is i still can't kill David after being knocked out and using a revive ticket on Mondo (ch. 4 final boss fight, to be clear)

again, here the guideliens that indicate the correct phase for "executing" David + whether this is his "final boss form" or not are incredibly absent and only present as ambiguous visual clues. i don't mean to complain so much but it's frustrating when i can tell that the game is *trying* to tell *me* how to do something but *fails* at teaching me how to do it.

anyway i'm at the phase of the David fight where you lock swords with him (cough, as if it wasn't lewd enough...) and you have to spam (as indicated by the visual cue - if it's a hold indication then kill me now pls, though i did try just holding once that really didnt make sense from a gamedev POV anyway) the left mouse button.

my mouse is pretty beat up but i had no problem with getting Mika to beat David back to life by spamming in sync, but i've now died several times simply because i CANNOT spam the button fast enough.

so, um, is this intentional?

despite the fact that the visual flashes (indicating fast clicking is required to execute David)... have i mistakenly interpreted it and i'm supposed to hold it instead? there is no text here to tell me what to do.

i swear to god i have tried spamming the mouse button: in a pattern, as fast as i can, etc. i am OK with boss fight gimmicks but this is *normal* mode and i even at one point PICKED UP THE MOUSE AND TOOK MY HANDS OFF THE KEYBOARD so that i could spam the button with BOTH MY DAMN HANDS.

and, as mentioned, i *have* tried holding it.

am i just really bad at this game? oh god, every boss fight is going to be like this isn't it? i have *no* trouble smashing the goons leading up to the boss on normal, getting the hidden treasures, even found the nurse without looking at the guide several times... get the boss low on HP = suddenly i can't kill him because i'm either failing to do what the game wants me to do, or the game isn't giving me enough information for me to KNOW what to do.

sorry to rant - fi'm GENUINELY rustrated as heck because this is the *ONLY* part of the game so far that i haven't fully enjoyed/ had a lot of fun with...

otherwise perfectly fine boss fights have suddenly become incredibly tedious every time i need to go into the very last "execute" phase and it's only going to get more gimmicky, right....? :doubt::sweat:

if someone doesn't mind my wall of text, can a more experience played help me out again? maybe give me some tips for figuring this out on my own? i have flipped through the comm hub guides but can't find a boss-by-boss strat one. if there is one in a foreign language (not english) that exists you can feel free to link me something like that, too.

The QTE/button-bashing is linked to framerate - if you are having trouble with a boss QTE, drop it back to 30fps and you will find it a LOT easier

[XX //]

THAT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE. thank you again. i had fixed the framerate to correlate to 60FPS for revival before starting this level - but not considered anything else would be necessary (no guides mentioned it either, that i could find)

if you can remember correctly, are there any other points i'll need to fix the FPS for? i probably can actually edit the .INI files for the fights so that any "spam checkpoints" work @ 60FPS with a little tinkering. problem is i need to know what to look for before i can adjust it to work @ 60FPS (you can just mentioned what boss name, or describe the point of the fight, if there is a similar gimmick mechanic)

i would highly appreciate it thank you thank you~

edit: also can you confirm exactly what i'm meant to be spamming? i want to be sure i didn't misunderstand the visual indicator of the left mouse button etc and whether i need to be keyboard spamming instead/ as well.

edit: also, guess i'll leave this thread up so i can be the figurehead of shame for any forum lurkers who are having the same problems i am, but don't want to own up to it... i can take the embarassment of being bad at videogames, i can't take the frustration of knowing i'm supposed to be doing something and not being told how to do it...!

[KuWanTum]

Originally posted by ӾӾ HEATWAVE IS REAL :

THAT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE. thank you again. i had fixed the framerate to correlate to 60FPS for revival before starting this level - but not considered anything else would be necessary (no guides mentioned it either, that i could find)

if you can remember correctly, are there any other points i'll need to fix the FPS for? i probably can actually edit the .INI files for the fights so that any "spam checkpoints" work @ 60FPS with a little tinkering. problem is i need to know what to look for before i can adjust it to work @ 60FPS (you can just mentioned what boss name, or describe the point of the fight, if there is a similar gimmick mechanic)

i would highly appreciate it thank you thank you~

edit: also can you confirm exactly what i'm meant to be spamming? i want to be sure i didn't misunderstand the visual indicator of the left mouse button etc and whether i need to be keyboard spamming instead/ as well.

edit: also, guess i'll leave this thread up so i can be the figurehead of shame for any forum lurkers who are having the same problems i am, but don't want to own up to it... i can take the embarassment of being bad at videogames, i can't take the frustration of knowing i'm supposed to be doing something and not being told how to do it...! :think::surprise:

I believe it was the X button (I used an xbox controller) which was the standard attack

You will need it for a few more boss fights IIRC; I was able to pass them all at 60fps since you can slide your fingers across the controller button easily so I did not need to change the ini file

[XX //]

thanks, you have been so helpful, i'm incredibly grateful. i'll leave this thread up for future problems if they arise + maybe to help others. you're awesome

[Zarakaï]

Yeah I restarted from checkpoint and killed her. Shouldn't have tried to shoot her when she was moving, wasted a lot of blood ^^. But it's strange that the devs didn't think about that, they could have thrown some little mobs like in phase 3 to replenish blood. Problem fixed.

[KuWanTum]

Originally posted by Texelion:

Yeah I restarted from checkpoint and killed her. Shouldn't have tried to shoot her when she was moving, wasted a lot of blood ^^. But it's strange that the devs didn't think about that, they could have thrown some little mobs like in phase 3 to replenish blood. Problem fixed.

You need to shoot her down from the roof. Once she falls, you can keep attacking - you quickly earn blood as your combo builds up.

Then you can execute :-)

[Zarakaï]

The problem was that I had no blood left to shoot her, so she stayed on the wall. Had to restart.

[XX //]

Originally posted by Texelion:

The problem was that I had no blood left to shoot her, so she stayed on the wall. Had to restart.

yeah, i can see how easily that would happen but with all the questionable dev decisions (see the pinned post for the most pressing one) i'm suddenly not surprised they "didn't think" about this scenario during QA...

... was there QA...?

[Icecreammouth]

Originally posted by ӾӾ /// :

yeah, i can see how easily that would happen but with all the questionable dev decisions (see the pinned post for the most pressing one) i'm suddenly not surprised they "didn't think" about this scenario during QA...

... was there QA...?

Judging from how the other bosses are set up, and the AAA rank strategies gamers formulated for these boss fights. I'd say those were made like that on purpose, and this bossfight is supposed to teach players why you need to conserve blood as much as possible. Killer Is Dead is entirely built around playing defensively.