i never knew lee could be so ♥♥♥♥♥♥ up to clem.

[Yeshalot]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdtAlcEclbk#t=36
this video so messed up and i wonder how clem would have reacted in these episodes honestly i never knew lee could be as mean as this video.

[MorningLightMountain]

You can be a complete arse towards her if you want. The only thing you can't do is not give back the hat.

[NEONDRAGON]

A scumbag Lee ends up making a scumbag Clementine. Like father like daughter.

[SIT_ROM.exe]

This is basically how I treated Clem in my playthrough...

I was trying to turn her into a heartless badass...

...

However it would seem, judging from the first episode, that I was too optimistic...

The player's decisions in the last season do not have a significant impact on the characterization of Clementine in this season...

[MorningLightMountain]

acamp1995 eredeti hozzászólása:

This is basically how I treated Clem in my playthrough...

I was trying to turn her into a heartless badass...

...

However it would seem, judging from the first episode, that I was too optimistic...

The player's decisions in the last season do not have a significant impact on the characterization of Clementine in this season...

That we've seen so far which would be a single episode.

[Mori me, Daddy]

Funny

[Pipuk]

I dunno , tell that woman "whos the father" was pretty heartless and badass =p

[SIT_ROM.exe]

MorningLightMountain eredeti hozzászólása:

acamp1995 eredeti hozzászólása:

This is basically how I treated Clem in my playthrough...

I was trying to turn her into a heartless badass...

...

However it would seem, judging from the first episode, that I was too optimistic...

The player's decisions in the last season do not have a significant impact on the characterization of Clementine in this season...

That we've seen so far which would be a single episode.

"However it would seem, judging from the first episode, that I was too optimistic..."

...

Pipuk eredeti hozzászólása:

I dunno , tell that woman "whos the father" was pretty heartless and badass =p

True, but that action could be selected irregardless of the scenarios Clementine had encountered prior...

Players should be allowed agency over what Clementine says and does, but she isn't a blank slate like Lee, she should have some noticeable personality established from the last season...

It would be nice to see the dialogue and character actions differing between the player which decided to have Lee coodle Clem and the player who wanted Lee to be more distant and blunt towards her, prioritizing getting her ready to survive in the world over all else, or a player which instructed Clem to execute Lee and a player which begged her to abandon him...

These choices feel like they deserve to have an impact upon the characterization of Clementine, beyond adding a couple throw-away lines...

To see such a feature implimented, to see that making different decisions can result in the formation of a tangiably different character, would be fantastic...

...

Many of the others have already heard my opinion on this matter...

In fact, I am fairly sure that MorningLightMountain has even provided a concise explaination of the inherent difficulty of implimenting such a system...

Still, if done well, I feel that such an addition would only serve to intensify the player's connection with their Clementine, and perhaps that would be worth the effort...

[MorningLightMountain]

"The player's decisions in the last season do not have a significant impact on the characterization of Clementine in this season"

[SIT_ROM.exe]

MorningLightMountain eredeti hozzászólása:

"The player's decisions in the last season do not have a significant impact on the characterization of Clementine in this season"

This season being thus far comprised of one episode, as denoted a sentence prior...

...

I made no error...

Although if that sentence is particularly troubling to you I could simply modify it so my meaning is more clear...

[Kdrizzie]

acamp1995 eredeti hozzászólása:

This is basically how I treated Clem in my playthrough...

I was trying to turn her into a heartless badass...

...

However it would seem, judging from the first episode, that I was too optimistic...

The player's decisions in the last season do not have a significant impact on the characterization of Clementine in this season...

You actually thought that how you treated her in the first season would shape her character? If her behavior and actions were pre-determined from how you treated her in the first game then there goes the decisions and dialogue options that Telltale prides themselves on... You still have the option to play Clementine somewhat that way but obviously it's not pre-determined for you. Silly.

[SIT_ROM.exe]

KevinA335 eredeti hozzászólása:

acamp1995 eredeti hozzászólása:

This is basically how I treated Clem in my playthrough...

I was trying to turn her into a heartless badass...

...

However it would seem, judging from the first episode, that I was too optimistic...

The player's decisions in the last season do not have a significant impact on the characterization of Clementine in this season...

You actually thought that how you treated her in the first season would shape her character? If her behavior and actions were pre-determined from how you treated her in the first game then there goes the decisions and dialogue options that Telltale prides themselves on... You still have the option to play Clementine somewhat that way but obviously it's not pre-determined for you. Silly.

Firstly, all of Clementine's actions are predetermined...

The word you are looking for is limited, or restricted...

And even then no, even a halfway competent writer can figure out how to apply a particular disposition to a three-dimensional character without writing themselves into a corner...

...

Secondly, Explain to me how a system which permits a character to jump from a brooding badass to a frightened child is more competent a design choice than allowing the player to make decisions which determines the disposition of a particular character, thus effecting the mood and tone of how said character carries out the player's instructions...

You aren't even losing anything, you have the same amount of content except that each of the two general archetypal dispositions, 'nice' and 'badass', are independent of one another...

Not to imply that you cannot have a badass that can do something nice or feel empathy, or vise versa, that can be done within the context of the story without compromising the tone and mood associated with the character in question...

...

The idea is a simple one: to establish a couple simple overarching dispositions based on the character's experiences and establish a sembelence of character consistancy...

I thought it was a pretty simple idea, comparatable to looking at something through a piece of coloured cellophane in order to appriciate it from a slightly distorted perspective...

...

But apparently I am just silly...

I suppose you had best ignore me least you become infected by my silliness...

[Kdrizzie]

acamp1995 eredeti hozzászólása:

KevinA335 eredeti hozzászólása:

You actually thought that how you treated her in the first season would shape her character? If her behavior and actions were pre-determined from how you treated her in the first game then there goes the decisions and dialogue options that Telltale prides themselves on... You still have the option to play Clementine somewhat that way but obviously it's not pre-determined for you. Silly.

Firstly, all of Clementine's actions are predetermined...

The word you are looking for is limited, or restricted...

And even then no, even a halfway competent writer can figure out how to apply a particular disposition to a three-dimensional character without writing themselves into a corner...

...

Secondly, Explain to me how a system which permits a character to jump from a brooding badass to a frightened child is more competent a design choice than allowing the player to make decisions which determines the disposition of a particular character, thus effecting the mood and tone of how said character carries out the player's instructions...

You aren't even losing anything, you have the same amount of content expect that each of the two overarching dispositions 'nice' and 'badass' are independent of one another...

Not to imply that you cannot have a badass that can do something nice or feel empathy, that can be done within the context of the story without compromising the tone and mood associated with the character in question...

...

The idea is a simple one: to establish a couple simple overarching dispositions based on the character's experiences...

I thought it was a pretty simple idea, comparatable to looking at something through a piece of coloured cellophane in order to appriciate it from a slightly distorted perspective...

...

But apparently I am just silly...

I suppose you had best ignore me least you become infected by my silliness...

They wouldn't do what you are suggesting and for you to think they would is silly. What happens to the people who hadn't played the first game? They now have a Clementine who acts like a heartless person because the game randomly generated choices from the first game and they don't have the option to change the way she acts or talks. Anyway Telltale is all about giving the player's the liberty of choosing how the playable character acts and talks in different situations. If they did what you had suggested than as I said there goes the aspect of the game which made the first so successful (giving the players the ability to CHOOSE what to do/say in certain situations). Simple, no?

[MorningLightMountain]

What Acamp is suggesting sounds more similar to what was implemented in Westwood's Bladerunner game where you could select the tone of how your character would choose to interact with characters or you could just go with the manual option which is probably what most people did.

They could have gone with that or a way that the choices effect the overall framework of the character's personality and seperate dialogue choices which only occur with that framework. The problem with that is that to experience everything not only would you need to replay season two it would also force you to have to replay season one in case you made choices you didn't want in regards to Clementine's behaviour.

[Kdrizzie]

MorningLightMountain eredeti hozzászólása:

What Acamp is suggesting sounds more similar to what was implemented in Westwood's Bladerunner game where you could select the tone of how your character would choose to interact with characters or you could just go with the manual option which is probably what most people did.

They could have gone with that or a way that the choices effect the overall framework of the character's personality and seperate dialogue choices which only occur with that framework. The problem with that is that to experience everything not only would you need to replay season two it would also force you to have to replay season one in case you made choices you didn't want in regards to Clementine's behaviour.

And those two problems are big ones. Telltale specifically made it so that you can still enjoy the second season without playing the first however if Clementine's overall behavior and actions were determined based on how you treated her/what you told her in the first game then as you said the player would be forced to play the first game if they wanted Clementine to act a certain way. Either way, going that route would probably not work so well for Telltale. The first game was praised in part by the player having the option to make tough decisions/side with different people in conflicts etc. For them to abandon that model completely for the second game would probably be catastrophic.

[yusupov]

what acamp is suggesting might be 'nice' or cool but its not happening (or even, at least fiscally, possible, use common sense please). they couldnt even really pull such a thing off within the first season. its a lot more predetermined than you might believe at the beginning. the idea that the story adapts is really just a slightly deeper version of the same "when you select different dialogue options, you hear different dialogue options" mechanic that has been used since the beginning of time.

theres basically one ending to season one & occasionally 1.5 endings to some of the episodes (in that you might have doug or carly, but youll end up w/ neither by the midpoint of next episode; you might choose to leave or keep whatshername [possible 'dead' person], but shell end up disappeared by the midpoint of next episode, etc). its all pretty predictable & simple.