Which clan would you be?

[Protag]

disregarding the starting quiz at the beginning of the game, which clan do YOU think you would be in? based on your personality and where you feel you would most fit in.


im mainly taking into account the playable clans but i guess i'll allow you to choose non-playable ones...


me, i'd probably be a nosferatu becaue i am great at computers and im not a social person anyway. while i wouldnt like the whole "eternal ugliness" it really wont matter in the long run, seeing as how im indoors 99.9% of the time.

[Shahadem]

I'd probably end up Malkavian the same way that Dr. Grout did.

To me Andrei was a pretentious moron. Everything he said was stupid nonsense and there is no way such a dumb idiot acting the way he did would have avoided being visited and killed by the cops because he exercised ZERO DISCRETION.

I was also PISSED at the ridiculous nonsensical and undeserved plot armor he was given.

Andrei signals the point where the game switches being amazing to being ♥♥♥♥. Which is no surprise that the sewer level is immediately after. As far as I am concerned the sewer level starts with Andrei.

I cannot stand characters like this. Characters where the writer thinks they are SOOOO clever but really just show how bad at their craft they are. Andrei is a borderline author self insert Mary Sue fan fiction character. This is the character you see in every Obsidian game that I cannot stand. In Kotor 2 this was every villain character, in New Vegas it was every villain character. In this game Andrei is really the only completely objectionable poorly written character.

In fact the whole Tzimezsce clan concept represents a failure by the writers. It is a point where the writer should have said, "no this is stupid. I need to show restraint and not create something that is clearly against outside the original concept I created".

[Protag]

i....completely forgot what it was andrei did or try to do or what his goals were

[Gremling]

Originally posted by Protag:

i....completely forgot what it was andrei did or try to do or what his goals were

He created the creatures in the sewers. It's the dude in red gown in the cellar of the creepy mansion. You know... the one all green in the face. Weird head shape.
If I'm not mistaken he was a member of the Sabbat and his main-aim was to weaken the Camarilla by hunting down their "eyes and ears" aka the Nosferatu with his creations.

I'm not certain why exactly he deserves such an outburst by Shahadem, he was a pretty ok-ish character in my book. Pretty polite. Complimented the looks of my Nosferatu (ironically). The only thing I really disliked about him is that he introduced those loud, annoying monsters who were sometimes just impossible to battle in melee (the bigger, female ones). And to make it worse they were all over this nuisance of a sewer.

Now that I think of it - I may get the complaints. He hardly fits between all the other clans in the game. At least his powers resemble more of a hardcore slasher film, while the rest of the clans take a more subtle, vampiric approach. But eh. We got flesh-eating "vampires", shapeshifters and Tremeres, who can boil someone else's blood. It's not a huge stretch to a monster-creating vampire. Makes it sort of a Frankenstein-crossover.

[⛧ Morslyte ⛧]

Originally posted by Shahadem:

I'd probably end up Malkavian the same way that Dr. Grout did.

To me Andrei was a pretentious moron. Everything he said was stupid nonsense and there is no way such a dumb idiot acting the way he did would have avoided being visited and killed by the cops because he exercised ZERO DISCRETION.

I was also PISSED at the ridiculous nonsensical and undeserved plot armor he was given.

Andrei signals the point where the game switches being amazing to being ♥♥♥♥. Which is no surprise that the sewer level is immediately after. As far as I am concerned the sewer level starts with Andrei.

I cannot stand characters like this. Characters where the writer thinks they are SOOOO clever but really just show how bad at their craft they are. Andrei is a borderline author self insert Mary Sue fan fiction character. This is the character you see in every Obsidian game that I cannot stand. In Kotor 2 this was every villain character, in New Vegas it was every villain character. In this game Andrei is really the only completely objectionable poorly written character.

In fact the whole Tzimezsce clan concept represents a failure by the writers. It is a point where the writer should have said, "no this is stupid. I need to show restraint and not create something that is clearly against outside the original concept I created".

That's because you're utterly ignorant of the lore of VtM. Andrei is a Tzimisce, the Tzimisce are supposed to be pretentious, the clan of Dracula, aristocrats with a stuck up attitude. And the Tzimisce belong to the Sabbat, the Sabbat do not want to exercise ANY discretion whatsoever, it's exactly their intention to infiltrate Camarilla territory and draw as much attention as they can, to put heat on the Camarilla.

They also don't believe in hiding, the Sabbat is mostly made of Elders and they refuse to embrace any Masquerade, they believe mortals should be serving them as rulers of the world. Of course they seem to forget the Inquisition, which is why Masquerade exists in the first place.

Originally posted by Mlem:

Originally posted by Protag:

i....completely forgot what it was andrei did or try to do or what his goals were

He created the creatures in the sewers. It's the dude in red gown in the cellar of the creepy mansion. You know... the one all green in the face. Weird head shape.
If I'm not mistaken he was a member of the Sabbat and his main-aim was to weaken the Camarilla by hunting down their "eyes and ears" aka the Nosferatu with his creations.

I'm not certain why exactly he deserves such an outburst by Shahadem, he was a pretty ok-ish character in my book. Pretty polite. Complimented the looks of my Nosferatu (ironically). The only thing I really disliked about him is that he introduced those loud, annoying monsters who were sometimes just impossible to battle in melee (the bigger, female ones). And to make it worse they were all over this nuisance of a sewer.

Now that I think of it - I may get the complaints. He hardly fits between all the other clans in the game. At least his powers resemble more of a hardcore slasher film, while the rest of the clans take a more subtle, vampiric approach. But eh. We got flesh-eating "vampires", shapeshifters and Tremeres, who can boil someone else's blood. It's not a huge stretch to a monster-creating vampire. Makes it sort of a Frankenstein-crossover.

Yes indeed, the Clan Tzimisce is inspired by slasher horrors, their whole persona is based on Dracula, and so is the Old Clan Tzimisce, but the Tzimisce, especially in regard to Vicissitude, the aesthetic was inspired by films like Hellraiser. Also the plural of Tremere is... Tremere.

[progect savior]

i forget the name but those blood mages. just hell yes.

[R.I.P]

I believe that Dracula was originally considered a Gangrel in the lore. Anyone have an early edition source book?

[Gremling]

Originally posted by R.I.P:

I believe that Dracula was originally considered a Gangrel in the lore. Anyone have an early edition source book?

Idk, I never had access to a source book. Everything I know is from the game and internet. But it does make sense that Dracula was a Tzimisce. Their Clan-Symbol is a dragon, as Draculas name sorta means: son of the dragon. Also Draculas inspiration Vlad the impaler had connections to templars called "order of the dragon" and was known to be one of the most cruel people in history. A reputation you could also describe the Tzimisce with.

[⛧ Morslyte ⛧]

Originally posted by R.I.P:

I believe that Dracula was originally considered a Gangrel in the lore. Anyone have an early edition source book?

Wrong. https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Dracula_(VTM)

Originally posted by Mlem:

Originally posted by R.I.P:

I believe that Dracula was originally considered a Gangrel in the lore. Anyone have an early edition source book?

Idk, I never had access to a source book. Everything I know is from the game and internet. But it does make sense that Dracula was a Tzimisce. Their Clan-Symbol is a dragon, as Draculas name sorta means: son of the dragon. Also Draculas inspiration Vlad the impaler had connections to templars called "order of the dragon" and was known to be one of the most cruel people in history. A reputation you could also describe the Tzimisce with.

Vlad the Impaler's father founded an order of knights called Order of the Dragon, it had nothing to do with Templars. Templars were not the only knighthood order that existed in history.

[Protag]

dracula himself was a tzimisce? but...why does andrei look so fugly? i thought all tzimisce were as ugly as him...the dude looks like a nosferatu

[⛧ Morslyte ⛧]

Originally posted by Protag:

dracula himself was a tzimisce? but...why does andrei look so fugly? i thought all tzimisce were as ugly as him...the dude looks like a nosferatu

Not all Tzimisce look like that, it depends a lot on the vampire in question, some like to take their Vicissitude to the extremes, to not hide the horror they are on the inside, expose the Beast. Some however, use Vicissitude to make themselves even look more attractive in human standards. It varies. Although it's very common for Tzimisce to look as horrifying as Andrei.

[R.I.P]

"Early edition source book"

Edit: The wiki that Morslyte linked to states that the Tzimisce only received a passing mention in the original rule book (1991), and were not described in detail until the first supplement (1992). This seems to fit with the vague impression that I have had for many years that:

1991: Dracula is thought of as Bela Lugosi's Count, and is considered a Gangrel due to use of the Protean discipline.

1992: Francis Ford Coppola's film Bram Stoker's Dracula is released, and White Wolf decides to "ret-con" the Count based on what is seen in the film (which is arguably much more interesting).

The problem with this idea though, is that the film was supposedly not released until mid November '92...


Anyway, don't let my query kill the conversation...

[Shahadem]

Originally posted by ♰ Morslyte ♰:

Originally posted by Shahadem:

I'd probably end up Malkavian the same way that Dr. Grout did.

To me Andrei was a pretentious moron. Everything he said was stupid nonsense and there is no way such a dumb idiot acting the way he did would have avoided being visited and killed by the cops because he exercised ZERO DISCRETION.

I was also PISSED at the ridiculous nonsensical and undeserved plot armor he was given.

Andrei signals the point where the game switches being amazing to being ♥♥♥♥. Which is no surprise that the sewer level is immediately after. As far as I am concerned the sewer level starts with Andrei.

I cannot stand characters like this. Characters where the writer thinks they are SOOOO clever but really just show how bad at their craft they are. Andrei is a borderline author self insert Mary Sue fan fiction character. This is the character you see in every Obsidian game that I cannot stand. In Kotor 2 this was every villain character, in New Vegas it was every villain character. In this game Andrei is really the only completely objectionable poorly written character.

In fact the whole Tzimezsce clan concept represents a failure by the writers. It is a point where the writer should have said, "no this is stupid. I need to show restraint and not create something that is clearly against outside the original concept I created".

That's because you're utterly ignorant of the lore of VtM. Andrei is a Tzimisce, the Tzimisce are supposed to be pretentious, the clan of Dracula, aristocrats with a stuck up attitude. And the Tzimisce belong to the Sabbat, the Sabbat do not want to exercise ANY discretion whatsoever, it's exactly their intention to infiltrate Camarilla territory and draw as much attention as they can, to put heat on the Camarilla.

They also don't believe in hiding, the Sabbat is mostly made of Elders and they refuse to embrace any Masquerade, they believe mortals should be serving them as rulers of the world. Of course they seem to forget the Inquisition, which is why Masquerade exists in the first place.

Originally posted by Mlem:

He created the creatures in the sewers. It's the dude in red gown in the cellar of the creepy mansion. You know... the one all green in the face. Weird head shape.
If I'm not mistaken he was a member of the Sabbat and his main-aim was to weaken the Camarilla by hunting down their "eyes and ears" aka the Nosferatu with his creations.

I'm not certain why exactly he deserves such an outburst by Shahadem, he was a pretty ok-ish character in my book. Pretty polite. Complimented the looks of my Nosferatu (ironically). The only thing I really disliked about him is that he introduced those loud, annoying monsters who were sometimes just impossible to battle in melee (the bigger, female ones). And to make it worse they were all over this nuisance of a sewer.

Now that I think of it - I may get the complaints. He hardly fits between all the other clans in the game. At least his powers resemble more of a hardcore slasher film, while the rest of the clans take a more subtle, vampiric approach. But eh. We got flesh-eating "vampires", shapeshifters and Tremeres, who can boil someone else's blood. It's not a huge stretch to a monster-creating vampire. Makes it sort of a Frankenstein-crossover.

Yes indeed, the Clan Tzimisce is inspired by slasher horrors, their whole persona is based on Dracula, and so is the Old Clan Tzimisce, but the Tzimisce, especially in regard to Vicissitude, the aesthetic was inspired by films like Hellraiser. Also the plural of Tremere is... Tremere.

I'm not ignorant of the lore. Rather the Tzimezce and Tremere are a CONTRADICTION within the lore.

IE if the lore is that all the clans get their powers specifically from one of the original 7 people who were turned into vampires by Caine then the writer contradicted himself/herself when claiming that Tremere got their powers by diablerizing something which could not have yet existed according to that setup. IE the Tzimezce could not yet exist because the only 7 clan elders did not include the Tzizmezce!!!!!!! So it isn't possible for the Tremere clan elder to Diablerize a clan that didn't exist!!!!! So the writer contradicted himself/herself.

Also the writer stated that all the different elders got their own original powers. Well that means the Tremere must have also gotten their own original powers. So what were those original powers from the Tremere elder? Obviously the ones they have. See, another clear contradiction by the writer when the writer claims the Tremere got those by diablerizing a clan that could not have existed instead of simply inheriting them from the clan elder like all the other clans.

Clearly then the writer needs to be ignored in this section and we must adopt what is required for consistency, which is that it was the Tzimezce who got their powers by diablerizing a powerful Tremere!!!!!!

But my biggest hatred with Andrei stems more from the fact that he is the start of the horrible sewer level and the point where the games goes from being a damned good RPG to a really bad action game. And that is of course why Andrei has plot armor, because he is an action game boss.

ALthgouh Andrei isn't really the first problem. The first real problem is Grout's mansion which is the point where the game will stop letting your character ask pertinent questions or have input that feels meaningful. It's also where you see a bunch of bones on the bed even though every other vampire you've killed left NO BONES. Yet this is never brought up, nor are you allowed to ever lie and say you didn't see Nines nor are you allowed to say that you thought someone was trying to pass themself off as Nines. The story is too railroaded and too heavy handed. It's a twist that the player sees coming from a mile away but is never allowed to bring up in conversation in a meaningful way because that would interfere with the heavy handed railroaded story.

At a micro level the game works pretty well as all the characters are very well written, well acted, well designed and the player is made to feel that their actions have a meaningful impact. But at a macro level the overall story is ♥♥♥♥ and doesn't work even a little. Especially since the ending is a big F U to the player after a really long slog through some really awful and overly tedious bad action game gameplay with no real RPG elements and no payoff. I think I've played up through Chinatown 30 times but only actually completed the full game twice.

[⛧ Morslyte ⛧]

Originally posted by Shahadem:

Originally posted by ♰ Morslyte ♰:

That's because you're utterly ignorant of the lore of VtM. Andrei is a Tzimisce, the Tzimisce are supposed to be pretentious, the clan of Dracula, aristocrats with a stuck up attitude. And the Tzimisce belong to the Sabbat, the Sabbat do not want to exercise ANY discretion whatsoever, it's exactly their intention to infiltrate Camarilla territory and draw as much attention as they can, to put heat on the Camarilla.

They also don't believe in hiding, the Sabbat is mostly made of Elders and they refuse to embrace any Masquerade, they believe mortals should be serving them as rulers of the world. Of course they seem to forget the Inquisition, which is why Masquerade exists in the first place.



Yes indeed, the Clan Tzimisce is inspired by slasher horrors, their whole persona is based on Dracula, and so is the Old Clan Tzimisce, but the Tzimisce, especially in regard to Vicissitude, the aesthetic was inspired by films like Hellraiser. Also the plural of Tremere is... Tremere.

I'm not ignorant of the lore. Rather the Tzimezce and Tremere are a CONTRADICTION within the lore.

IE if the lore is that all the clans get their powers specifically from one of the original 7 people who were turned into vampires by Caine then the writer contradicted himself/herself when claiming that Tremere got their powers by diablerizing something which could not have yet existed according to that setup. IE the Tzimezce could not yet exist because the only 7 clan elders did not include the Tzizmezce!!!!!!! So it isn't possible for the Tremere clan elder to Diablerize a clan that didn't exist!!!!! So the writer contradicted himself/herself.

Also the writer stated that all the different elders got their own original powers. Well that means the Tremere must have also gotten their own original powers. So what were those original powers from the Tremere elder? Obviously the ones they have. See, another clear contradiction by the writer when the writer claims the Tremere got those by diablerizing a clan that could not have existed instead of simply inheriting them from the clan elder like all the other clans.

Clearly then the writer needs to be ignored in this section and we must adopt what is required for consistency, which is that it was the Tzimezce who got their powers by diablerizing a powerful Tremere!!!!!!

But my biggest hatred with Andrei stems more from the fact that he is the start of the horrible sewer level and the point where the games goes from being a damned good RPG to a really bad action game. And that is of course why Andrei has plot armor, because he is an action game boss.

ALthgouh Andrei isn't really the first problem. The first real problem is Grout's mansion which is the point where the game will stop letting your character ask pertinent questions or have input that feels meaningful. It's also where you see a bunch of bones on the bed even though every other vampire you've killed left NO BONES. Yet this is never brought up, nor are you allowed to ever lie and say you didn't see Nines nor are you allowed to say that you thought someone was trying to pass themself off as Nines. The story is too railroaded and too heavy handed. It's a twist that the player sees coming from a mile away but is never allowed to bring up in conversation in a meaningful way because that would interfere with the heavy handed railroaded story.

At a micro level the game works pretty well as all the characters are very well written, well acted, well designed and the player is made to feel that their actions have a meaningful impact. But at a macro level the overall story is ♥♥♥♥ and doesn't work even a little. Especially since the ending is a big F U to the player after a really long slog through some really awful and overly tedious bad action game gameplay with no real RPG elements and no payoff. I think I've played up through Chinatown 30 times but only actually completed the full game twice.

First of all, yes you're incredibly ignorant of the lore:

You can't spell Tzimisce properly.
You refer to Antediluvians as "elders".
You claim the Childer of Caine founded 7 clans.

You haven't even read the books, let alone a wiki and you want to say the writer should be ignored for consistency?

Please.

There are 13 Clans, the founders of these clans were the Grandchilder of Caine, not his Childer. His original Childer were diablarised by them.

The Eldest was not diablarised and the Tzimisce is not a diableried clan.

The only diableried clans are the Tremere, from the Salubri through the diablerie of Saulot, and the Giovanni, from the Clan Cappadocian through the diablerie of Cappadocius.

An elder is any vampire over 250 years of age.

An Antediluvian is the founder of a Clan.

Back to your hovel! You're a shameful disgrace comparable to a shovelhead.

[Sheogorath]

I would of been a Gangrel, but since I now have some lovely mental illness I would most likely be a proud Malkav and that's fine by me as they are my favorite clan anyway :)

[Mad Jack]

Definitely True Brujah. Pity nobody ever bothered to make a mod that would introduce them as properly playable.