Shower thoughts...

[Vepar]

And maybe some World of Darkness experts can answer them maybe?

Do vampires change at all?

Like, can vampires grow their hair, facial hair, nails etc.?

Can a vampire change their hairstyle or grow a beard? Or is it like in the movie vampires that they look exactly the same as they looked when they were embraced? Or in the Interview with a Vampire movie, when (i forgot who) cuts their hair and it grow back instantly and exactly the same haristyle (lol).

What about body shape? If a vampire was embraced thin, can they ever get fat? Or vice versa, can a fat vampire get thin? Or muscle mass? If some scrawny human was embraced by a vampire, can they get buff in undeath or do they forever look scrawny? Also, reverse, if a vampire is showing muscle, can they loose that?

I know their organs are atrophied (as the Fu syndicate guy says), but skin is an organ too, and so are muscles. Wouldn't that mean those are also atrophied?

And does any of this apply to Nosferatu at all?

Also, i'm talking about non Fleshcrafting vampires, i know Tzimisce can look how they want.

Please humor me, i know it's stupid but this has been buggin me lately!

[dwarfpcfan]

short answer yes sort off.

Long answer a vampire's appearance in VTM is essentially stuck in stasis as to how he looked like when he was turned. So if his hair was long and he was unchaved, he would remain so as his default appearance. If he shaves and cleans up, it grows back to what it was before it was turned as soon as he enters daysleep and or/torpor. Similarly, any tattoos or flesh/scarification alterations will disappear once he goes to daysleep.

If a vampire wants to keep a tattoo and or self inflicted scarification after turning alteration he has to actively will the change and spend blood to remain (spending/burning previous willpower and spending blood) to make the change permanent something that a majority of vampires will find a complete waste. But it won't change anything else of his appearance or how he reverts back once he goes to daysleep/

Vampire do not gain weight from substenance regardless of desire nor muscle mass from physical training post change in VTM. A vampire's strength is not based on actual muscle fiber and muscle density, it's body is dead and any strength is born from the mystical properties of being a vampire. Nor do their dead bodies generate fat, the biochemical mechanism that generate fat do not operate in a vampire. A vampire that was a scrawny nerd before being change can still get strength 5 and Potence 5, yet will still look like a scrawny nerd no matter what, it has nothing to do with actual physical appearance. Similarly a fat person in life, is stuck as a fat vampire in death.

The only change in appearance a vampire can make permanent other then the tattoos and/or self inflicted scarification mentioned above are the fleshcrafting of the tzimitzi or the subtle change when a vampire increases his appearance score, where upon he looks essentially the same but as his appearance stats improves any flaws gradually go away until he become an idealized version of his previous alive appearance (which won't affect body mass, shape or fat in any significant fashion). Essentially a fat vampire raising his appearance score will just be a better looking/more physically attractive fat vampire. The better his appearance score becomes the better looking he will be but he will still be a fat vampire. An appearance 5 vampire can still weight 250 pounds, he'll just be the most attractive 250 pounder a person has ever seen.

[Vepar]

Thank you for the detailed answer!

It would suck getting embraced in your most unpresentable edition ever hahaha and cursed to look like that forever! Like, it wasn't your year, you got out of shape, look like a slob and hey, it's your lucky day, you get to live forever but appeareance=1 lol. :P Well, maybe not that low, but you get the point haha.

But it's also kind of cool. Some scrawny looking nerd vampire is still 10 times stronger than the average human. They could use that look to attract bullies and when they get attacked - surprise mother****** - lifts him in the air by one hand lol.

I also laughed out loud at the "the most attractive 250 pounder a person has ever seen". But it's totally possible though, especially if you're a vampire.

I wonder if there's any Toreadors that got "stuck" in "not their best" and they have some issues regarding that.

Also, please tell me there's a Tzimisce "barber - plastic surgeon" in World of Darkness. One Tzimisce who couldn't care less about the Sabbat or humans or vampires, he just wants to give vampires haircuts, maybe some lyposuction, breast enlargement or reduction, you know, whatever they feel like. Not all Tzimisce are evil degenerates are they?

[Steerpike3]

An old manual for the pnp game has a section called Anatomia Vampirica, which says this:

"One seldom sees a stout vampire, and nearly all remark on a newfound slenderness after the Change." Also, "The skin becomes a little tighter over the bones, much as it does in the newly dead."

Also, "Hair and nails continue to grow for a few days, as they do on a fresh cadaver. If I wish my hair or nails to be shorter, I must cut them each evening after I rise."

Source: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/263175.Vampire

[Vepar]

Originally posted by Steerpike3:

An old manual for the pnp game has a section called Anatomia Vampirica, which says this:

"One seldom sees a stout vampire, and nearly all remark on a newfound slenderness after the Change." Also, "The skin becomes a little tighter over the bones, much as it does in the newly dead."

Also, "Hair and nails continue to grow for a few days, as they do on a fresh cadaver. If I wish my hair or nails to be shorter, I must cut them each evening after I rise."

Source: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/263175.Vampire

Nice! Thanks!

I should really get the books somewhere and read them one time. I'm interested in the world and its mechanics more and more.



Also... I'm not sure if it was mentioned here...
Vampires can cut their hair, nails, beard etc. and it'll grow back how it was when they got embraced after a daysleep. But can they grow hair like "on demand" or something?

[4d69636861656c]

Originally posted by Vepar:

Vampires can cut their hair, nails, beard etc. and it'll grow back how it was when they got embraced after a daysleep. But can they grow hair like "on demand" or something?

There are some disciplines that vampires can use to change their physique, or at least create the illusion of it.
Specific to clan Tzimisce is the discipline of Vicissitude, which could be used to alter one's body as well as others, provided the caster is skilled enough. This discipline is used for a variety of purposes, but members of the clan can use it to morph into beautiful and monstrous appearances alike, depending on their mood.
Another example is Chimerstry, which doesn't actually alter flesh or bone, it only creates the illusion of it. Kindred with a high enough level of Auspex can see through this though. Also, this effect only lasts as long as the illusions are not touched, as that dispells them (since they're not actual physical objects).

[Vepar]

Originally posted by Michael:

Originally posted by Vepar:

Vampires can cut their hair, nails, beard etc. and it'll grow back how it was when they got embraced after a daysleep. But can they grow hair like "on demand" or something?

There are some disciplines that vampires can use to change their physique, or at least create the illusion of it.
Specific to clan Tzimisce is the discipline of Vicissitude, which could be used to alter one's body as well as others, provided the caster is skilled enough. This discipline is used for a variety of purposes, but members of the clan can use it to morph into beautiful and monstrous appearances alike, depending on their mood.
Another example is Chimerstry, which doesn't actually alter flesh or bone, it only creates the illusion of it. Kindred with a high enough level of Auspex can see through this though. Also, this effect only lasts as long as the illusions are not touched, as that dispells them (since they're not actual physical objects).

Yes, i know about Vicissitude that the Tzimisce have. Though, do they ever use it for anything other than making themselves look like monsters and creating monsters? I doubt a Tzimisce just uses it to "botox" the face a bit, from what i read, it's usually always something rather extreme.

Didn't know about Chimestry, that's cool.

I suppose someone could use Vicissitude and/or Chimestry for infiltration purposes, that would be cool. Especially Vicissitude since it actually changes the body, can't Auspex through that, can you?