So, what if I never find water-breathing gear?

[ianswatson]

Any suggestions? I've been through all the vendors twice - even for items that my character wouldn't use. Any way to reset the vendors? Or reset a zone? Or make something?

I've had a great playthrough and don't want to start over for something as dumb as not finding water-breathing gear.

[ianswatson]

... btw also looked for gear that treats you as undead while I looked for water-breathing gear. Never found that either.

[.//slayer]

You can skip the water-filled locations. The most important ones, such as the Lake under the Old Forest, can be done without the water-breathing gear - just refill your air by standing inside the bubbles of oxygen.

The only one that you really have to skip is the one in Far East. But again, it's not necessary to clear it in order to finish the main quest.

[Работяга с Завода]

You can look for belt (or lamp) with "to be undead" property. When you equiped item with this prorerty you no need to breath.
You can use tinker's craft for air recycler...
Or you can just look around for air bubbles in the dungeon. Move into (finish turn) and you should regain some air.

[Haplo]

It's quite easy to clear water levels using air bubbles. You just can't rest or autoexplore.

[Josh]

My tip for you all when starting a new game is to first un-equip all spells including the mana surge rune and if you are mage then un-equip your staff as well. Next exit to the world map and then re-enter the zone.

This will make the city visible to you so that you can visit it even if you later equip staffs and learn spells. The other thing I do is visit at least two cities and make sure one of them has an item with "of the deep" or more preferably and "un-life" trait to it.

making you temporarily undead is useful in the sand worm zone so that you cant die from suffocation

[davidb11]

Yeah, you can't die from the suffication, but that intitial 250 to 400 physical damage is your main issue. :)

[Nyx]

Originally posted by Josh:

making you temporarily undead is useful in the sand worm zone so that you cant die from suffocation

Phase door runes are actually incredibly useful here. They only move you a couple spaces so you're unlikely to jump into a room full of enemies, usually you just go a couple spaces down the path the sandworms have dug, and even if you do you'll have the out-of-phase effect for a few turns so you can set up a shield or regen infusion.

Tbh though... you shouldn't need undead equipment, and you shouldn't need water breathing, either. I can't remember the last time I died to either of those things. If they're killing you regularly and you feel you need them, by all means go for them, but know that you're relying on a crutch and you're better off learning the mechanics of the game so you don't need to rely on sub-standard gear in the future.

[davidb11]

Uh, I don't think using water breathing or undead gear comes close to relying on a crutch.
It's part of the game. Something that's part of the game is not a crutch by definition.
Why would they be in the game otherwise?

That said, not everyone plays the game the exact same way, and using certain gear to make certain areas easier is by no means a bad thing, nor is it against the main rules of a roguelike. :)

Honestly, the main rule of a Roguelike is don't savescum or cheat.

[Gluecost]

bubbles are your friend.
Water breathing makes it easier but it is in no way required.

[Nyx]

Originally posted by davidb11:

Uh, I don't think using water breathing or undead gear comes close to relying on a crutch.
It's part of the game. Something that's part of the game is not a crutch by definition.
Why would they be in the game otherwise?

It's a crutch because you could have significant better combat gear and use your game knowledge, good positioning, and air bubbles to stay alive.

Edit: So also the topic - "What if I never find water-breathing gear" - like.... you don't need it.

[davidb11]

I think you're vastly overselling the power of water breathing gear. :)
And no one is going to be vastly weaker because they wear a special belt/armor piece for one area. That just never happens ever in this game.

That's like saying getting lightning resist for the Darth lightning elemental mission is a crutch.

Also, it is still a part of the game, like it or not.
It breaks no rules to use it, there's no penalty imposed for using it.

Not every one has the same skill level as you. There's no reason to claim that using water breathing is bad.
You're the only person ever to state this that I've seen.

And regardless, there's no reason to just claim that people can't play this game differently than you.
Part of the game, designed specifically for getting you through certain areas, is not going to be called a crutch by the grand majority of people.

Exploration mode is a crutch. :P I use Exploration mode. I know how crutches work.

I've never heard of anyone saying a specific item in the game is a crutch.
That simply makes no sense to me at all.
Maybe i'm missing the blindingly obvious, wouldn't be the first time, but it seems like you're a bit upset at the idea of anyone using water breathing gear. :O

[JacksonTriggs Fan]

Dunno why they'd be mad at it, you actually do need some form of water breathing gear to 100% the game. They've probably never progressed far enough to reach the East though, so don't worry about their opinions. Of course, 100%'ing the game isn't mandatory, you can miss one minor zone, and I rarely if ever have water breathing pre-East.

There are crutch items, though. buying a torc of Mindblast from Zigur before doing anything, for example, can be seen as a crutch, running around dealing 200 damage at level 1. But usually you only use actual crutches like that on the Insane and harder difficulties, where there's no such thing as unfairness, as the game is unfair to you right back.

[ianswatson]

Thanks, all. I am aware of the bubbles. But I've had great success so far with my archer by switching to a cautious mode of play. Finding some water-breathing gear is in line with that. I did read that vendors restock after you beat the boss in Dreadfell. So that's worth knowing. Also in line with my cautiousness is ... counterintuitively ... trying to clear every mob in every zone so I give myself as much experience as possible to advance in preparation for more difficult areas. Water-breathing again comes in handy.

[davidb11]

Originally posted by JacksonTriggs:

Dunno why they'd be mad at it, you actually do need some form of water breathing gear to 100% the game. They've probably never progressed far enough to reach the East though, so don't worry about their opinions. Of course, 100%'ing the game isn't mandatory, you can miss one minor zone, and I rarely if ever have water breathing pre-East.

There are crutch items, though. buying a torc of Mindblast from Zigur before doing anything, for example, can be seen as a crutch, running around dealing 200 damage at level 1. But usually you only use actual crutches like that on the Insane and harder difficulties, where there's no such thing as unfairness, as the game is unfair to you right back.

Good point. I really didn't get why it was a crutch, and he never replied back, so I don't know.

[Morphic]

Originally posted by ianswatson:

Thanks, all. I am aware of the bubbles. But I've had great success so far with my archer by switching to a cautious mode of play. Finding some water-breathing gear is in line with that. I did read that vendors restock after you beat the boss in Dreadfell. So that's worth knowing. Also in line with my cautiousness is ... counterintuitively ... trying to clear every mob in every zone so I give myself as much experience as possible to advance in preparation for more difficult areas. Water-breathing again comes in handy.

Don't sweat it.

Water-Breathing isn't essential in the West. It can really help you out, depending on your Build and enemy comp in the Lake of Nur Zone. However, I find Water-Breathing becomes essential when doing a certain Quest Line in the East.

Aside from that, having something that makes you Undead is also pretty handy. I've had some instances where multiple Rares had Suffocation-type attacks that would make me take damage from not being able to breathe. Other instances, like getting trapped in sand/a wall can turn deadly if you don't have Undeath gear. Like that one type an Orc Berzerker knock-backed me 7 tiles into a wall that was dug out by a wandering whatchamacallit a few turns ago ... making trapped inside a wall.

Overall you shouldn't worry about Water-Breathing or Undeath gear until you are in The Far East. Then you may want to really start considering looking for it/farming patrols for a drop.