Why does anybody play by email when theres a multiplayer service built into the game?

[Ponypony]

You can just set up the IP and host, and let people use the GUI in game, rather than fiddling with email files, which adds several actions every turn that should be unneccesary.

I am running a game RIGHT NOW, with 13 players. They just go to the network tab, click on the game, and do their turn.

[Eldritch Gentleman]

Because not everyone can put aside several hours in a day to play a blitz game. Playing a turn every day for a game is a lot less time-intensive, and lets you play multiple games at once.

[Ponypony]

what? this is not about blitz games

[Eldritch Gentleman]

Originally posted by trademark2:

what? this is not about blitz games

Well, Blitzing is the most common use of the network tool.

Clockwork Hounds run games over Network, but that's because they have a dedicated server with a bot. Without dedicated effort to keeping the server up at all hours of the day, it won't work. It's a lot easier to just use Llamaserver to run your games for you over email.

[Ponypony]

Why do you think that? Why not use the multiplayer service built into the game? I am running a game right now, with 13 players. They just go to the network tab, click on the game, and do their turn.

[Eldritch Gentleman]

Originally posted by trademark2:

Why do you think that? Why not use the multiplayer service built into the game

Because if you're just hosting the game on your own computer, the other players will have to play around your schedule, as you need to constantly have the server open, preventing you from playing in other games, and if your computer goes to sleep or is powered off, the server will close. A dedicated server will prevent this from being a problem, but not everyone is able to do that. Hosting a game using a dedicated server is a valid way to play an MP game, but since not many people do that, most people prefer to simply use Llamaserver.

[meglobob1]

Llamaserver's great, its been around 10+ years now and I have played 120+ MP games on it of Dom 3 & 4. Also, PbEM is very easy and takes a few secs to get and send your turns.

I have played around 3-4 games by direct connection too and those are good too.

So either are good.

[DasaKamov]

What the others said. Both forms have their advantages; direct connect lets you responsnd to games much quicker and allows for more immediate play.

In PbEM games, you have the confidence that the game won't be scrapped if someone loses their internet connection. You also have the luxury of taking time with your strategic planning, as well as engaging in deeper diplomacy (if desired).

I'm a bit bemused by the somewhat confrontational tone in the OP -- both PbEM and Direct-Connect games are legitimate ways to enjoy MP Dominions, and no form is more "right" than the other, since the game is designed to use both forms.

[Shinuyama]

Direct connect requires an open instance on a computer that is always on, and has in my experience often had network issues, sometimes horribly extensive ones, requiring fiddling with settings in people's routers all the way to killing and restarting the instance of the game, to get it to work. If someone's computer is the host and they for any reason want to restart it, game goes down. Setting up dominions to work on a dedicated server is nontrivial and there are exactly 2 of those in existence - snek.earth (goons server) and the clockwork hounds server.

There was also the blitzserver, but that's not currently being worked on I don't think, and wasn't finished when it was up either.

Meanwhile I have some scripts so it takes me 1 click to receive an email turn from llama, and 1 click to send it, and I can do my turns from any computer on any network with no connection issues or ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ around or needing to ring jim and ask him how to get from someone else's PC that i've downloaded dom4 onto, on to the server, etc.

It's not ideal, and i'm planning to host a game on snek.earth soon, but the reason people use llamaserver is that it's very reliable, it's simple, they don't need to understand port-forwarding to use it, llama fixes it very quickly if it breaks, they can email llama with problems and he'll help them out, etc. It's simple and reliable and for 1 turn/day the email bit is not hugely annoying.

[Morsigil]

Three cheers for Llama! He is literally doing god's work.

[Ponypony]

Originally posted by Eldritch Gentleman:

Originally posted by trademark2:

Why do you think that? Why not use the multiplayer service built into the game

Because if you're just hosting the game on your own computer, the other players will have to play around your schedule, as you need to constantly have the server open, preventing you from playing in other games, and if your computer goes to sleep or is powered off, the server will close. A dedicated server will prevent this from being a problem, but not everyone is able to do that. Hosting a game using a dedicated server is a valid way to play an MP game, but since not many people do that, most people prefer to simply use Llamaserver.

You seem to be under the misconception that computers can only be on when you are next to them.

I guess setting up a server can be pretty difficult though, so my question is answered! Still seems wierd to me. I was thinking about writing a script, still though, the other players would have to deal with the hassle

[Gregstrom]

Also, and this hasn't been mentioned yet, llamaserver is a trusted third party host - it's independent and reliable. Player hosts can cheat, and have done (although very rarely AFAIK) in the past. They can also (and this is more common) just stop hosting.

Llamaserver archives turns and can be (and has been) used to identify cheaters who have bypassed the game's own cheat protection. When you're playing against people you don't know, it's nice to have a degree of surety that your next couple of months worth od Dom4 won't turn out to have been a wash, whether that be due to the host abusing trust or just dropping their server when they lose interest.

The third party direct connect servers don't have as much history, but they work well and I've no reason to think they're either likely to disappear or being abused. I also don't know what barriers there are to starting games on the direct servers - llamaserver is completely open access.

[Ponypony]

That is a good point too! I have thought about peeking at other nations in my game :3. its tempting since im new i wanna see what strats are being used! But, I have not done it! I think the host of one of my other games might have though...

[Eldritch Gentleman]

Originally posted by trademark2:

Originally posted by Eldritch Gentleman:

Because if you're just hosting the game on your own computer, the other players will have to play around your schedule, as you need to constantly have the server open, preventing you from playing in other games, and if your computer goes to sleep or is powered off, the server will close. A dedicated server will prevent this from being a problem, but not everyone is able to do that. Hosting a game using a dedicated server is a valid way to play an MP game, but since not many people do that, most people prefer to simply use Llamaserver.

You seem to be under the misconception that computers can only be on when you are next to them.

I guess setting up a server can be pretty difficult though, so my question is answered! Still seems wierd to me. I was thinking about writing a script, still though, the other players would have to deal with the hassle

If you have a home PC, that's fine. If you have a laptop that you tend to move around, then that's a different story. Power outages, curious cats, and other acts of god may also power down the computer, and the server with it. Llamaserver is regarded as a much safer alternative.

[garegoylant]

Originally posted by Shinuyama:

...I have some scripts so it takes me 1 click to receive an email turn from llama, and 1 click to send it...

Care to share?
I'd like to upgrade from this if possible

[Ica]

One more thing I like about PBEM is that every turnfile gets automatically archived. It's often very useful to be able to check some combat results from a past turn to see what units or scripting someone had, or to check scout info over several turns when expanding to be able to guess better how many indies some province has.

Still I also like the direct multiplayer. It's just rare that I get to play it.