Firkraag

[Giblets]

Well oddly i just killed Firkraag with ONE hit.
Got me wondering if anyone else has had anything like happen against a big baddie?

[red255]

did you use the silver sword.

I mean he can be killed with a chromatic orb if he rolls a 1, which isn't too unlikely.

SPELL SEQUENCER CHROMATIC ORB.

if you were going for the one hit approach.

so assuming 5% chance to slay, 3 chrome orbs chance of slaying is 14.2%? (1-.95*.95*.95)

so one in 7 attempts.

[Giblets]

Silver sword indeed. i had only just got it. Which makes it seems over powerful. (but i'm only on normal mode, as this is my first time playing)

Firkraag did kill me a couple of time, i was thinking of giving up ad trying later and then all of a sudden it died as soon as i started one last attempt.

[red255]

Silver sword is post underdark and I normally clear way too many sidequests before underdark, not exactly sure the slice.

Ravenger halberd. gets a 10% chance to kill per hit and gets an enchantment of +6 making it more useful abeit a later addition since its some distance into throne of Bhaal.

if you cleared your way thru the underdark there should be a sizable amount of Experience in your squad and firkaag strategies are numerous.

simply protection from energy (level 8 mage spell) resist fear (level 2 mage spell) improved haste (level 6 mage spell)

and you shouldn't be having too much trouble. if you arent damaging things Breach, summon a planetar (level 9 mage HLA) (planetars carry a silver sword as their main weapon, in a pinch I might attempt to see if a planetar improve haste and protection from energy can kill firkaag easily on its own. while you go off somewhere safe. never really worried about firkaag myself. planetars are nice little beefcakes.

but yeah when in doubt chromatic orb. that can be pulled off a mage level 12.

[Giblets]

I did all the side quests in chapter two, with the exception of the evil characters as i'm on a good play through, and Mazzy's sister which didn't trigger till after underdark.

Anyway, back at work for a few days so wont get to load up again till the weekend, i'm heading to watchers keep next and doing that before i progress.

[philos3]

SPOILER. There is cheesy method I read about where you use Yoshimo and have him set as many traps as he can (that amount depends on his level IIRC) at Firkraag's feet. Have a fighter type with the Dragonbane Halberd swat him once. He goes hostile, all the traps go off and boom, no Firkraag. I did it once and it surprisingly worked. The silver sword would certainly be able to do it in one hit. I have had Minsc take out Adamantite Golems with one hit.

[Bob Rooney]

Originally posted by red255:

I mean he can be killed with a chromatic orb if he rolls a 1, which isn't too unlikely.

SPELL SEQUENCER CHROMATIC ORB.

if you were going for the one hit approach.

so assuming 5% chance to slay, 3 chrome orbs chance of slaying is 14.2%? (1-.95*.95*.95)

so one in 7 attempts.

Your math does not add up. Spell sequencer is a way of casting 3 spells one after another very quick. if you put 3 chromatic orbs in the sequencer, they don't multiply. ( Might be wrong but the description clearly says so )

Still, chromatic orb is known to be working very well on dragons.

[red255]

Tell you what. why don't you prep a sequencer and save before firkaag, then run 100 attempts and tell me how many times firkaag dies to to the sequencer.

or if you want to be mean, get a party of 6 level 12+ mages, give them all loaded sequencers. pause the game, trigger and target all the sequencers and hit firkaag with 21 chromatic orbs.

tell me how often he dies.

[Bob Rooney]

does not change the fact, that 3 orbs in a sequencer do not multiply... read the description of the spell. or go to a wiki and read up on it. they are cast at the same time, but they hit as 3 seperate spells.not saying chromatic orb does not work on dragons ( as i stated clearly in my last comment ) they just don't multiply

[red255]

whats your point?

[Bob Rooney]

learn to read ... that's my point. take care

[wendigo211]

Red's math is correct. The probability of three chromatic orbs killing the dragon is the complement of the probability that none of the chromatic orbs killing the dragon. Since we can assume statistical independence of the saving throws, the probability that none of the orbs kill the dragon is 0.95^3. Thus the probability that the sequencer of orbs kills the dragon is 1-0.95^3=0.142625, or approximately 14.3%.

[Bob Rooney]

no it's not, as i explained earlier... but hey, you wanna believe in sequencer stacking spells? fine, doesn't make it right. take care, bye

[wendigo211]

Originally posted by Bob Rooney:

no it's not, as i explained earlier... but hey, you wanna believe in sequencer stacking spells? fine, doesn't make it right. take care, bye

The complete set of possible outcomes is:

• Chromatic orb 1 kills the dragon (0.05)
  
• Chromatic orb 1 doesn't kill the dragon and chromatic orb 2 does kill the dragon (0.95)*(0.05)=0.0475
  
• Chromatic orb 1 and 2 don't kill the dragon and chromatic orb 3 does kill the dragon (0.95)^2*(0.05)=0.045125
  
• None of the chromatic orbs kill the dragon (0.95)^3=0.857375

So you either calculate the probability by summing the first 3 probabilities=0.05+0.0475+0.045125=0.142625
or you use the complement of the 4th probability =1-0.857375=0.142625

[Kyutaru]

Originally posted by Bob Rooney:

no it's not, as i explained earlier... but hey, you wanna believe in sequencer stacking spells? fine, doesn't make it right. take care, bye

It has nothing to do with sequencers stacking spells. It has to do with probability math for multiple independent events. Sort of like how when you buy more lottery tickets your odds of winning improve because you have more tickets. Flipping multiple coins improves your odds of at least one of them being heads. Rolling multiple dice enhances your chances that one of those dice will roll a 6. This has nothing to do with spell sequencer as you could just straight cast three Chromatic Orbs in a row. It's simply how probability works.

[Bob Rooney]

... you know.... this topic bugged me... hard. even more the fact, that my previous comments MIGHT read kind of unfriendly.... if so, sorry for that, didn't mean to be mean or naggy or something.

I'm also willing to change my mind if i'm wrong on things.

i thought the probability ( ~ 14% ) of killing only applied if the enemy does only have 1 save throw for all 3 orbs. it got stuck in my mind, that tthe enemy has 3 save throws for 3 orbs, so that the probability would not increase. above the 1. possible outcome on the list here

Originally posted by wendigo211:

The complete set of possible outcomes is:

• Chromatic orb 1 kills the dragon (0.05)
  
• Chromatic orb 1 doesn't kill the dragon and chromatic orb 2 does kill the dragon (0.95)*(0.05)=0.0475
  
• Chromatic orb 1 and 2 don't kill the dragon and chromatic orb 3 does kill the dragon (0.95)^2*(0.05)=0.045125
  
• None of the chromatic orbs kill the dragon (0.95)^3=0.857375

So you either calculate the probability by summing the first 3 probabilities=0.05+0.0475+0.045125=0.142625
or you use the complement of the 4th probability =1-0.857375=0.142625

again, if i'm wrong i'll admit it ( probably the case the longer i think about it ) and sorry for maybe coming off as kind of a prick.