Sex with Phaere

[Washcloth Repairman]

Viconia: Approves.
Jaheira: Understands and forgives you.
Aerie: Goes ballistic.

I get that she's supposed to be naive and innocent, but come on. She has to understand by now that sometimes you have to do things you don't want to do (sure, that's it...) and what a dangerous place and situation you're in. If you told Phaere no she, according to Drow culture and law, would be well within her right to just have you killed and the rest of the party killed. Sure, she doesn't do that, but she could have.

[Washcloth Repairman]

What part of "Season 1 Sansa" did you not understand?

And for the record, yes, she's still kind of stupid.

And you can't seem to accept that's it's not acceptable for someone to act like a child in her situation, especially when she wanted to go on the mission to prove she wasn't a child.

[Sarsben]

I think it's perfectly fine for Aerie (or any other character) to be written as an actual person with imperfections and irrational traits. She just happens to be written as a person I probably wouldn't want to hang out with, much less be romantically involved with, and I think that's fine too. It's the main reason I can never bring myself to complete the romance with her, even if it's entirely possible I'd like her more if I did.

For comparison's sake, both Jaheira and Viconia say and do things in the course of their romantic subplots that are arguably irrational, unkind, or even stupid, but I find it easier to justify and sympathize with them because of their circumstances, and because they seem to be mature enough to realize when they've been unreasonable. (Aerie's circumstances go a long way toward justifying a lot of her behavior too, of course, but I still just find that for me she crosses a line into "why am I even bothering with her" territory.)

For the record, I disliked a lot of the characters in Dragon Age 2 on a personal role playing level, but I still think most of them were decent-to-good characters. I enjoy RPGs that have multidimensional and sometimes unlikeable characters. If a party member disagrees with my choices and reacts to them in ways that provoke visceral reactions from me as a player, they were probably effectively written and designed. Of course, not all RPG companions are created equally, but in general I find this often to be the case.

[anferFFmax]

Originally posted by Washcloth Repairman:

What part of "Season 1 Sansa" did you not understand?

Which part of season 6 Battle of the Bastards did you not get? Sansa may be no genius, but she's not dumb either. Lets see how they develop her in season 7. And please don't even bother mentioning the books, they are a wholly different story. People seem to miss that.

[Medolicious]

Originally posted by anfermin:

Originally posted by Washcloth Repairman:

It's more that Viconia understands Drow culture.

Viconia is a ho mate, someone who would F. her way out of problems, there is no suagar coating that. Of course she understands Drow culture. But the point is it's easy to see why she can roll with these things. She really isn't any different than Phaere.

Originally posted by Washcloth Repairman:

Being a teenager isn't an excuse

Yes it is. An inocent teenager is not going to react to situations the same way two highly experienced women like Jaheira and Viconia, who are many times her age, and have been through all over Faerun. Aeries' reaction is what you would expect an inexperienced teen girl to have, as fauxpas already explained.

Viconia is a Drow priestess and she will f her way to power, ho or no ho. I have been reading Drizzt books years ago and in one chapter Drow priestesses do it with demons to gain more power. The only thing that would perhaps annoy Viconia is that another Drow priestess would be using her toy.

[anferFFmax]

Originally posted by Medolicious:

Viconia is a Drow priestess and she will f her way to power, ho or no ho. I have been reading Drizzt books years ago and in one chapter Drow priestesses do it with demons to gain more power. The only thing that would perhaps annoy Viconia is that another Drow priestess would be using her toy.

Viconia is a ho, and for no religious reasons mate. Her character is supposed to be slutty. Sure you are right about Drow priestess, but in her case this is a personality trait, and not a religious ritual. Oh by the way, the idea of drow priestess having sex with demons to gain power is simply incredible. Diabolical in every way, which is super cool! Sadly, Salvatore can't really go too deep into these kinds of things lest the conservatives (that think is a sin), and the feminists (that think this is objectifying women) would crucify him.

There is so much material in the Fareun for fantasy horror, but the political wings on this era restrict it to just fantasy. Which is infuriating to say the least...

[Washcloth Repairman]

Originally posted by anfermin:

Originally posted by Medolicious:

Viconia is a Drow priestess and she will f her way to power, ho or no ho. I have been reading Drizzt books years ago and in one chapter Drow priestesses do it with demons to gain more power. The only thing that would perhaps annoy Viconia is that another Drow priestess would be using her toy.

Viconia is a ho, and for no religious reasons mate. Her character is supposed to be slutty. Sure you are right about Drow priestess, but in her case this is a personality trait, and not a religious ritual. Oh by the way, the idea of drow priestess having sex with demons to gain power is simply incredible. Diabolical in every way, which is super cool! Sadly, Salvatore can't really go too deep into these kinds of things lest the conservatives (that think is a sin), and the feminists (that think this is objectifying women) would crucify him.

There is so much material in the Fareun for fantasy horror, but the political wings on this era restrict it to just fantasy. Which is infuriating to say the least...

I'm writing a dark fantasy novel and I don't care what SJWs or conservative moral crusaders say, I'm writing it the way I want to. A demon rapes an angel and gets her pregnant, and the daughter she gives birth to fcks her way to the top and ends up murdering her mother and her pureblood half-sister.

[anferFFmax]

Originally posted by Washcloth Repairman:

Originally posted by anfermin:

Viconia is a ho, and for no religious reasons mate. Her character is supposed to be slutty. Sure you are right about Drow priestess, but in her case this is a personality trait, and not a religious ritual. Oh by the way, the idea of drow priestess having sex with demons to gain power is simply incredible. Diabolical in every way, which is super cool! Sadly, Salvatore can't really go too deep into these kinds of things lest the conservatives (that think is a sin), and the feminists (that think this is objectifying women) would crucify him.

There is so much material in the Fareun for fantasy horror, but the political wings on this era restrict it to just fantasy. Which is infuriating to say the least...

I'm writing a dark fantasy novel and I don't care what SJWs or conservative moral crusaders say, I'm writing it the way I want to. A demon rapes an angel and gets her pregnant, and the daughter she gives birth to fcks her way to the top and ends up murdering her mother and her pureblood half-sister.

That's the way to go! The hell with the moralists! Don't lose the momentum on that story and finish it!

[fauxpas]

Eh, I've found that with nearly no exceptions people use dark and edgy as an excuse for poor writting. Feel free to prove me wrong though and as long as your "dark fantasy novel" is well crafted (and not merely an edgy porno) I'll at least read the sample the same as I read the last one someone linked to although sadly in that case the only thing dark and edgy was covering for was furry snuff porn complete with a pot endorsement from the Grim Reaper himself. (Poorly written as well.)


But as for the topic of demonogists trading sex for power the question that needs answered is what does the demon get out of the exchange? ... And no the answer isn't "sex".

[Morphic]

Originally posted by fauxpas:

But as for the topic of demonogists trading sex for power the question that needs answered is what does the demon get out of the exchange? ... And no the answer isn't "sex".

I don't remember clearly from some of the D&D errata that was 3rd party ... but I recall there being a few errata going into this sort of thing. It even started covering Child Birth, creating "Half-Races", "Sex Magic" and going into detail the entire point of Succubus/Incubi and Demons in general.

I think it was "Book of Vile Darkness" or something like that... Anyway, the point of most Demons(usually Succubi) "trading sex for power" is that during the process they basically Level Drain their victim partner. In exchange the person in question gets pleasure + whatever they were bargaining for; at the cost of a Level Drain or more. Whereas the Demon gets the Energy Drained and manipulated the person into doing what they want.

IMO, this stems from Demon/Deities like Lolth who were all about Chaos, creating strife and essentially seducing people into debase acts and giving in to carnal desires. Which lead into weird hybrid monsters effectively being off-spring from aforementioned Demons. Funny how Driders went from being "a punishment for failing Lolth" and being unable to reproduce to being "Lolth's chosen" and able to magically reproduce. 3e to 4e really shook stuff up, no idea about 5e.

TLDR:
Depending on the Demon; it gets pleasure from the act of manipulation/causing strife(Succubi just love screwing people over) and I *think* the energy from the Level Drain. Though I might confusing Pathfinder with D&D. Admittedly it's been months since I've last played/read about this sort of stuff. Tieflings had to come from somewhere I guess.

[fauxpas]

Although the Book of Vile Darkness as well as whatever its "goodness" mate was called tends to be deservedly ignored as low points in 3rd Edition at least the level drain energy theory makes some sense I suppose. (I forget how hard it was to cure drained levels in 3rd but I'd imagine that the benefit of the pact can't be enough that curing the drained levels was trivial enough to make the idea actually be a viable one.)

[Morphic]

Originally posted by fauxpas:

Although the Book of Vile Darkness as well as whatever its "goodness" mate was called tends to be deservedly ignored as low points in 3rd Edition at least the level drain energy theory makes some sense I suppose. (I forget how hard it was to cure drained levels in 3rd but I'd imagine that the benefit of the pact can't be enough that curing the drained levels was trivial enough to make the idea actually be a viable one.)

*Shrugs* Like I said don't really remember.

As for Level Drain, pretty sure it could only be cured by the 7th Level Cleric spell 'Restoration'. Which, iirc, you only had a week per Caster Level to "Restore" the drained levels or they were lost permanently.

I never really had Campaigns with this sort of content so I wouldn't know. The most "raunchy" campaign was a Pathfinder one where the party decided on helping a Tiefling and Aasimar sibling duo looking for their parents/heritage. Was usual fluff until we encountered a Succubus "great aunt" lol.

[Washcloth Repairman]

Originally posted by Washcloth Repairman:

I admit it... I have Cave Fever.

For those of you that don't know, in America there's a somewhat racist term in America "Jungle Fever" when a white guy is attracted to black women. Futurama made the same joke when Fry was dating robot Lucy Lui, Bender said he had "Metal Fever."

[Long Journey]

Just thinking about Aerie makes me wonder about myself and my friends when we were teens. Eugh! She is a elf that probably over 60 years old with the mind of a teen. Deceptively ironic.

Given how she only saw the world from above for the longest time, a teenager relatively speaking, and had the misfortune of being captured (along with losing her wings, shown around as a object of fascination) compounding on top of her agnst/despair, I'd say she is well within her right to act as she does. That sheer shock from her time leading up to meeting you has left her traumatized and rather emotionally volitile x5. Look, she is a pain to listen to and I get where you are coming from. She desperately tries to cling to whatever and whomever can support her since her self-confidence is nearly dead. I may be playing devil's advocate but looking it as such, it makes sense. She's a good kid, just a teen. She isn't innocent either. The wings of innocence died when her actual wings got the axe.

[anferFFmax]

Originally posted by Doc45:

Just thinking about Aerie makes me wonder about myself and my friends when we were teens. Eugh! She is a elf that probably over 60 years old with the mind of a teen. Deceptively ironic.

I'm very certain that she's a teenager. In fact, I estimate her age to be at around 15YO. The protagnists is supposed to be 20YO as per the game's canon by the time of BG2. And since Quayle was a companion in BG1, where the protagonists was around 16-18YO, before he had his circus, that would mean the events Aerie is telling you about as if they happened a long time ago, are actually quite fresh. Something you need to understand about teenagers is that a year or two for them is a VERY long time. This is due to their short age! A year to someone that's 15yo is effectively 1/15 of its total age, but what is a year to someone that is 90? See, my point?

People meassure up time in realtionship to their own age, and the older we get, the shorter we perceive our time frames to be. Young people would perceive time as if it is passing slower, and therefore would think a year or two to be a long time. Aerie is merely reflecting that.

Originally posted by Doc45:

Given how she only saw the world from above for the longest time, a teenager relatively speaking, and had the misfortune of being captured (along with losing her wings, shown around as a object of fascination) compounding on top of her agnst/despair, I'd say she is well within her right to act as she does. That sheer shock from her time leading up to meeting you has left her traumatized and rather emotionally volitile x5. Look, she is a pain to listen to and I get where you are coming from. She desperately tries to cling to whatever and whomever can support her since her self-confidence is nearly dead. I may be playing devil's advocate but looking it as such, it makes sense. She's a good kid, just a teen. She isn't innocent either. The wings of innocence died when her actual wings got the axe.

Totally agree! And she actually grows into a woman as the game progresses. My only beef with her is the fact you have to be a monk to make the relationship work with her. That is one huge pile of BS right there.

[Silverymoon]

If I remember this one correctly, you can tell Phaere you belong to another female (higher rank). Not a party member or Phaere will threatened to kill them. There are a number of options, some funny lies (you can claim to be celibate, cursed, or a eunuch). Viconia understands but not in the way you think she does (she is evil and knows 100% why you did it and expects nothing else). Jaheira requires you to explain it was against your will and she accepts this being more of a neutral alignment. note A neutral alignment for example may use torture to extract information, but never for pleasure. This is how it is viewed with you having sex with Phaere. A lawful good alignment would never use torture for any reason or have sex with anyone other than for love.

Now with Aerie.
Aerie will dump you if you sleep with Phaere, this is what you should be expecting from a lawful good alignment. Aerie was abused as a child, leaving her deeply traumatized. She was abducted by slavers when she was young, who sold her to a circus where she was put in a tiny cage. The terrible living conditions damaged her wings so badly, that they had to be cut off and no longer being of use to the circus, she was tossed aside.

Aerie personality is a sweet and timid young woman. She is idealistic through and through but also rather shy and unsure. Think of how damaging facing an evil world would be as a lawful good alignment and have that happen when you are very young. You are ment to be helping her to come to terms with the loss of her wings, a strong bulwark for her to grow beside and become a strong independent women.

When you sleep with Phaere you have just tossed her aside for the very type of people that caused her abuse as a child. The Drow are a race of slavers, an abhorrent abomination, you are foricating with them and embracing their evil ways. How could you do such a thing, you would have sex with her just because she told you too? See where this would lead... Aerie is the best romance.

Lawful good people will not stand for treachery. She is 100% going to go mad over it, she is a good person who will feel deep betrayal over the act. You will be dumped.

Lawful good characters are friendly, courteous, sensitive to the feelings of others, scrupulous, honorable, trustworthy, reliable, helpful, loyal, and respectful of "life, love, and the pursuit of happiness." http://easydamus.com/lawfulgood.html