Stonehearth

Stonehearth

Kasa Dec 23, 2021 @ 10:20am
Recommended Mods/Templates
I don't care about RP at all so are there any template and mod packs that people would recommend for some one new to the game?

Things like smart crafter look pretty essential if vanilla functions like I think it does. And yes I already have ACE installed.
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findersword Dec 23, 2021 @ 10:45am 
If using ACE mod, there are actually several mods that don't work properly alongside it, and Smart Crafter mod is one of them - Ace mod has its own smart crafting built in, and a toggle switch in the gameplay settings to enable it.

Currently these mods also don't work well with Ace: Piles Plus, Animalot, Better Storage, Brewery Mod, Dense Fields, Unit Frame Plus, Box Command Tool, Charcoal isn't Fuel, Minimod: Archers don't kite.

You could check out the Mod Repairer and see which mod it can apply fixes to. Recently it adds a fix for Better Storage if using Ace.
Kasa Dec 23, 2021 @ 1:46pm 
Right, thanks!
Any pre-made template for efficient homes?
YetiChow Dec 24, 2021 @ 2:08am 
Any of Banto's templates are great for efficient homes that are aesthetically pleasing -- they cost a bit more than strictly necessary in stone and wood to build the structures, but nothing ridiculous; and they look a lot nicer than generic box-apartments!

I like to have a pack of pre-made wall sections for quickly building up defensive walls. Note that it's far better to NOT completely wall off your settlement, but to use walls to create specific entry-points (you can always make a tower-defence style maze to slow down incoming enemies, and fill it with traps or let your archers kite enemies through it with spiky arrows)
Kasa Dec 24, 2021 @ 3:30pm 
I don't care for aesthetics at all to be honest, so any extra materials for that purpose are a waste imo for what I was hoping to find.
YetiChow Dec 24, 2021 @ 10:48pm 
If pure efficiency is your goal, don't even bother building -- find a nice mountain to dig into, and your homes will cost you NEGATIVE resources lol! They'll be extremely easy to defend, immune to any form of construction delay that stems from a lack of materials, and you'll probably find some ore veins in the process to kick-start your blacksmith and mason (your mason can be bundling all that stone up into piles rather than using their time laying foundations and walls; so they'll be gaining XP and you can build better quality decorative items faster.) Oh, and your hearthlings will never have to worry about weather effects when moving around town for their jobs, too!
Kasa Dec 25, 2021 @ 7:01am 
Makes sense, any issues growing crops underground?
YetiChow Dec 25, 2021 @ 9:02am 
Originally posted by Kasa:
Makes sense, any issues growing crops underground?

"underground" is an interesting concept in Stonehearth -- the ground level is defined within the map generator for the biome and it's generally that plains level that makes up the obvious/visible starting layer of the map, so most mountains are "above ground" since they rise above the default plains level. Underground is below that plains level, even if you have a wide open pit the then anything below that initial ground line is underground.

As far as growing crops not exposed to sunlight, I believe ACE might have a growth speed modifier for that but it should still work; and I'm not sure whether it's possible to grow plants on stone in ACE but I remember it being possible in vanilla. Either way, if you want/need some grass underground to grow plants on, you can use the geomancer's grass blocks or patches to create some (if you don't have a geomancer you can still use debug tools or command console to spawn in the summon stones for them -- if you use the iconic version it will drop the item on the ground, but by default it will place an active summon stone which will immediately start to transform into the appropriate feature.) You could also do a "cavern with a hole in the roof" that is inaccessible from the outside but has an open ceiling to let light in; you might even want to get creative with your geomancer to put in a spring and/or a rune sigil (a very efficient way to get a large area of grass, and some wild plants as a bonus!) to make a natural-looking "hidden grotto" that doubles as an area to put a trapper field thanks to high wilderness from trees and plants.
Kasa Dec 25, 2021 @ 9:38am 
Interesting, shame the game is no longer being actively developed (ACE and other mods aside) it was shaping up to be a unique experience compared to the likes of Rimworld and DF.
Kasa Dec 25, 2021 @ 4:43pm 
So update, I tried digging down and building underground and you CAN do that.

But the game REALLY doesn't like it.
It was murder trying to wrestle the camera for layers and doors were maddening to try and account for. Nothing shows the flaws in the 3D design of the game then trying to actually build up or down from inside the earth.
findersword Dec 25, 2021 @ 5:27pm 
Using the Slice view button and adjusting the height level makes it easier to see your mining zones at different depths.
But you are right, mining upward is difficult here, so its best to mine the top layers first, and only make them 4 blocks of depth at a time, and wait for them to finish that before going downward further.
Kasa Dec 25, 2021 @ 6:02pm 
Originally posted by findersword:
Using the Slice view button and adjusting the height level makes it easier to see your mining zones at different depths.
But you are right, mining upward is difficult here, so its best to mine the top layers first, and only make them 4 blocks of depth at a time, and wait for them to finish that before going downward further.

Ya I was using the slice option about half way through, it was mostly trying to use doors that did it.
Unlike rimworld or the like settlers won't carve out the needed area when place doors so not only must the floor be swept of refuse you must make sure there is enough room above and beside the door.

All around the games building mechanics are less intuitive then most base builders I've played.
It's most reminiscent of Dragon Quest builders but do to the fact your trying to direct some lemmings to build it feels very clunky.
YetiChow Dec 25, 2021 @ 9:21pm 
Originally posted by Kasa:
Originally posted by findersword:
Using the Slice view button and adjusting the height level makes it easier to see your mining zones at different depths.
But you are right, mining upward is difficult here, so its best to mine the top layers first, and only make them 4 blocks of depth at a time, and wait for them to finish that before going downward further.

Ya I was using the slice option about half way through, it was mostly trying to use doors that did it.
Unlike rimworld or the like settlers won't carve out the needed area when place doors so not only must the floor be swept of refuse you must make sure there is enough room above and beside the door.

All around the games building mechanics are less intuitive then most base builders I've played.
It's most reminiscent of Dragon Quest builders but do to the fact your trying to direct some lemmings to build it feels very clunky.

That's because this is the first game to have truly dynamic voxel terrain at this level of "macro-management" detail.

There are other macro-management games that have voxel terrain, but it's not truly dynamic -- it's cleverly faked to look like it is, but really it's a set of predetermined chunks with specific options you can turn them into (a wall, a door, or whatever) rather than the true freedom to build whatever you want wherever you want it.

Then there are macro-management games where you have dynamic terrain, but it's not really voxels (it's cleverly faked 2D meshes masquerading as 3D space), which is orders of magnitude easier to compute.

And then you have the ones that do have true 3D or voxel terrain, that is truly dynamic, but operate at a much closer-in scale with no macro-management -- everything has to be ordered step-by-step with no AI to connect the dots.

Stonehearth's building mechanics are not particularly intuitive, no, but they are consistent and logical. Once you understand the logic, they're perfectly usable and quite robust -- I've built some truly whacky buildings like an upside-down concentrically layered pyramid and a model of the Earth's core/crust layers just to test what's possible, and was able to get both of those things to build with no issues and no stuck hearthlings.

But before I understood the rules/logic of how the hearthlings go about building a blueprint, I used to run into issues with even the basic 1-bedroom cottage -- I'd add an extra bed or change the roof and wonder why it would get stuck, only to realise that I hadn't accounted for how the hearthlings would actually move around the space to complete the orders I'd given them. A classic example from those days: I put a bed directly below one of the lamps, the bed would go down first and then when it came time to place the lamp there was no place to put the ladder and so no access to the block where the lamp had to go. It's not something that's immediately obvious, but when I watched the hearthlings place the lamp without the bed being there, it clicked that the hearthlings don't stop and think about order of operations -- they just do exactly what you tell them to do, in the default order that the game assigns their tasks. It's the classic "garbage in, garbage out" situation; you have to make sure that the orders you give don't just work individually but also that none of them interfere with each other.

It would be nice if the game a) did a little more automation of things like "I want to place a door here so I need space for it first", and b) had a really good tutorial to explain its logic and workflows to new players. But at the end of the day, it's a management sim -- solving problems and figuring out how to make things work is intentionally part of the game; having the computer do all that for you would make it basically into an idle game where you click a button and a house magically happens (rather than one where you need to design a house that fits into the landscape and is physically inhabitable.)
Kasa Dec 26, 2021 @ 6:54am 
I'd say the dynamic voxels actually work AGAINST the game, I mean that's great and all but it's a situation where does this increase in complexity actually HELP the game?

Other builders might fake voxels but it's close enough and more intuitive.
The only thing the dynamic voxels bring to the table that I've seen so far is how intricately you can build a building, which is great for people who love designing extravagant pieces of art but the setters don't care.

On top of that it seems like from what you said most of the difficulty of this game comes from the bad AI, with no priority system and no way to directly force the settlers to do something it's just a exercise in frustration.

Like you said after you realise you can't just design a house and leave them to build it you actually need to place things piece by piece and wait for them to actually put that part in before you place another piece just screams of bad design.

Rimworld has it's far share of problems too, but at least most of the challenge and fun comes from outside events no arguing with your settlers trying to place window beside a bed but having to sit there and wait for when the feel like making and placing the window watching them putter about till you can finally tell them to place a bed and do the same thing over again.
Eagle_of_Fire Dec 30, 2021 @ 9:55am 
Originally posted by Kasa:
I'd say the dynamic voxels actually work AGAINST the game, I mean that's great and all but it's a situation where does this increase in complexity actually HELP the game?
That's not a question of helping the game, it is a question that SH is entirely built around this. If you're not playing SH for this then you are playing it wrong and it is normal that it frustrate you to a certain point.

For your original question, I have downloaded templates from the workshop. I picked those which fit my fancy. But however good they are, they never match what I can build myself. I simply sometimes (and after numerous playthrus) don't have the time to truely dedicate to building the "perfect template" for building type x yet again. I either use a previous template of mine or spice it up with one of those I downloaded prior.

What I make the most use of every single run are specific building like my vault and my road system I built up from scratch and which I summon out of thin air from specific building blocks that I put together when I need a road. I always have to connect the dots eventually but at least 90-95% of my roads are made up with pre-made blocks.
Kasa Dec 30, 2021 @ 5:45pm 
Not sure I follow as it's just imo but I don't think people would buy a settler sim just because it uses voxels.

But then again by the number of templates on the workship perhaps I'm wrong in this regard.
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Date Posted: Dec 23, 2021 @ 10:20am
Posts: 20