Install Steam
login
|
language
简体中文 (Simplified Chinese)
繁體中文 (Traditional Chinese)
日本語 (Japanese)
한국어 (Korean)
ไทย (Thai)
Български (Bulgarian)
Čeština (Czech)
Dansk (Danish)
Deutsch (German)
Español - España (Spanish - Spain)
Español - Latinoamérica (Spanish - Latin America)
Ελληνικά (Greek)
Français (French)
Italiano (Italian)
Bahasa Indonesia (Indonesian)
Magyar (Hungarian)
Nederlands (Dutch)
Norsk (Norwegian)
Polski (Polish)
Português (Portuguese - Portugal)
Português - Brasil (Portuguese - Brazil)
Română (Romanian)
Русский (Russian)
Suomi (Finnish)
Svenska (Swedish)
Türkçe (Turkish)
Tiếng Việt (Vietnamese)
Українська (Ukrainian)
Report a translation problem
Discussions Rules and Guidelines
Report this post
As part of the AI improvement mod, we revisited the weapon balance, knowing that some weapons were way too powerful (e.g. Singularity cannons) and others either completely useless or broken (e.g. most torpedoes). Furthermore, we wanted to ensure that each weapon strategy that the AI pursues (e.g. a focus on beams or missiles) provided a clear progression in technology from the early to end game.
AI ship designs are given a designation from "Mk 0" to "Mk 5," which corresponds to what technology level or "tier" the weapon is, which ranges from 0 to 5.
Some general notes about the rebalancing:
* We wanted to keep the spirit and design intent for weapons as close to the original game as we could. We don't want players to have to re-learn their basic assumptions regarding how all the weapons work. In some cases we had to make more drastic changes to a given weapon when the weapon was highly ineffective.
* In almost all cases, the power and ordinance requirements for weapons remained the same or were slightly reduced. This means that your existing player designs should still continue to work normally. The exceptions are the Heavy (Neutronium) Torpedoes, the Graviton Beam (which is now more of a weapon), and the Null Field Cannon (converted from energy to kinetic weapon).
* There is now a clear divide between Missiles and Torpedoes, both in terms of the names of the weapons and their functions. Torpedoes are single shot, high hitpoints and/or non-interceptable weapons, and generally cannot be jammed. Missiles generally fire in salvos, have lower hitpoints (can be shot down by point defense) and can be jammed.
REBALANCE Spreadsheet & References[docs.google.com]
The "ALT WEAPON REBALANCE" tab shows all of the below changes for easier digestion :) You can see how weapons generally scale up in effective DPS as you go up the tech tree.
Tier 0: Laser Cannons
- No changes
Tier 1: Plasma Cannon
- Increased projectile speed to 60 (from 35)
- Increased shield damage multiplier to 0.5 (was 0.25). They do more damage to shields now.
Tier 2: Disruptors
These are a little too strong for their tier originally. Also, the 2x3 variant was a lot weaker than the 2x2 turret in practical applications.
- 2x3 variant = reduced power and energy per shot to 8 + 12 (was 12 + 36). Increased max range damage to 400 (was 200).
- 2x2 variant = reduced max / min damage to 300 / 200 (was 400 / 250) - remember this also has a salvo count of 2.
Tier 3: Anti-Matter Cannon
The biggest issue is that the damage fallout for Anti-matter was way to high. At range they do a fraction of the damage of disruptors. So ....
- Reduced ordinance cost by 50% for both variants.
- 2x2 turret variant = increased range to 250 (was 150) and max range damage to 500 (was 10).
- 2x3 variant = max range damage increased to 750 (was 10).
Tier 4: Singularity Cannon
This weapon was simply overpowered. It was strongest weapon the game hands down.
- Removed ignore shield penetration (100% chance) and replaced with double shield damage.
- Maintained the unstoppable characteristic
- Reduced min/max damage to 600/600 (was 800/800)
Tier 5: Chaos Cannon
Not bad but terrible speed and range makes it much less useful given its inconsistent damage output.
- Increased max range to 400 (was 150)
- Increased projectile speed to 50 (was 30)
- Maintains 50% ignore shield chance and 0x to 10x random damage multiplier.
Tier 0: No Tier 0 beam weapon. AI designs use Laser Cannons.
Tier 1: Ion Beams
These were pretty good overall (the description is misleading!
- Increased max range damage slightly to 50 (was 30)
Tier 1: Fusion Beams
These are also pretty good.
- Increased max range damage to 50 (was 30)
- Increased max range to 200 (was 150).
- Decreased fusion beam power draw to 60 (was 80)
* Note that Fusion Beams are glitched and do not fire for as long a duration as other beams (1-2 seconds instead of 5 seconds). However, for whatever reason, the performance still seems reasonable as Fusion beams will out perform Ion Beams.
Tier 2: Graviton Beams
These re-worked to be a mid-game weapon on par with disruptors to get a nice progression in beam technology.
- Increased power per shot to 100 (was 20)
- Increased max / min damage to 550 / 325 / 150 (was 20 / 20 / 20)
Tier 3: No Tier 3 Beam weapon, but Graviton Beams can hold their own pretty well.
Tier 4: Phasors
- No changes
Tier51: Dark Particle Beam
This weapon was absolutely terrible before, and is now pretty solid.
- Damage at min / max range increased to 750 / 750 (was 400 / 400)
- Increased max range to 300 (was 150).
Tier 5: Death Ray
- No changes
- Not used by the AI, as the weapon is only acquired through special events.
Tier 5: Star Lance
- No changes
- Not used by the AI, as the weapon is only acquired through special events.
Tier 0: Rockets
Overall, rockets were a bit too powerful given their Tier 0 status and have been tweaked slightly:
- 1x3 Rocket Variant: Projectile health reduced to 20 (was 50)
- 2x2 Rocket Turret: Reduced salvo count to 4 (was 6)
Tier 1: No Tier 1 Missile weapon
Tier 2: Cruise Missiles
These were also a little too powerful for their tier and made it hard to have a nice progression in missile technology. Minor changes:
- Reduced damage per missile to 750 / 750 (was 1000 / 1000).
- Reduced missile projectile health to 30 (was 100)
Tier 3: Anti-Matter Missiles
Anti-matter Torpedoes were converted to function more in line with missiles (can be jammed and intercepted), to provide a Tier 3 missile weapon, and renamed "Anti-Matter Missile" accordingly. They needed a big buff as well
- Increased projectile speed to 60 (was 40).
- Increased shots per second to 0.1 (was 0.05) (1 shot every 10 seconds instead of one every 20).
- With the increased the fire rate, damage was reduced to 1750 (was 3500)
- 3x3 Missile variant added (instead of 2x5) along with a new icon. Allows missile to be mounted consistently with other missile weapons for races limited by the original 2x5 size weapon.
Tier 4: Swarm Missile
These were just terrible AND broken (the AI can't use swarm weapons). So...
- Removed broken swarm effect. Weapon now fires 4 salvos of missiles every 2.5 seconds.
- Damage per projectile increased to 250 / 250 (was 100)
- Reduced projectile health to 20 (was 50) to make more vulnerable to point defense
- Increased firing arc to 90 degrees (was 80 degrees)
- Improved icon (shows 4 missiles on the rack)
Tier 5: Vertical Launch Missiles
These were also not very great before, and the AI did not have access to them.
- Added VLS Missiles to the Tech Tree (Tier 5 weapon)
- Improved module icon (turret launcher with 4 missiles showing)
- Reduced size of the module to 3x3 (was 4x4)
- Increase damage to 1000 (was 500)
- Increase range to 600 (was 300)
- Increase projectile speed to 75 (was 30)
- Reduced projectile health to 40 (was 50)
- Maintained salvo count of 4
Tier 0: Rockets
Same as for Missiles, above.
Tier 1: Plasma Torpedoes
These were terrible and broken weapons previously.
- Removed broken swarm effect. Now fire a 2 projectile salvo
- Range decreased to 350 (was 500)
- Base projectile damage increased to 1000 / 750 damage (was 100 / 0).
- Damage overtime increased 750 damage over 5 seconds (was 500 damage)
- Damage multiplier versus shields increased to 0.5 (was 0.25)
- Projectile speed increased to 60 (was 35)
Tier 3: No Tier 2 Torpedo Weapon
Tier 3: Photon Torpedoes
These were pretty good originally. Needed a little tweak:
- Decreased energy consumption per shot to 250 (was 500)
- Increase damage to 2400 / 1200 (was 2000 / 1000).
Tier 4: Neutronium Torpedoes
"Heavy" Torpedoes were one of the worst things in the game. They were slow moving, slow firing, and easy to intercept with other weapons.
- Renamed to "Neutronium" Torpedoes, so we can forget that "Heavy" torpedoes ever existed :)
- Increased shots per second to 0.1 (was 0.05) - now fires every 10 seconds (was 20)
- Increased projectile speed to 40 (was 10)
- Increase projectile hit points to 600 (was 400)
- Changed weapon type to properly be a "Torpedo", which means it is no longer jammable or interceptable.
- Increased energy per shot to 100 (was 0). Still required 20 ordinance per shot.
- Damage reduced to 3000 / 3000 (was 3500 / 3500)
Tier 5: Quantum Torpedoes
These were broken and did not behave like Torpedoes (could be jammed + show down easily). They were also not previously available to the AI (not in the tech tree).
- Added Quantum Torpedoes to the tech tree (late game energy tech)
- changed projectile type to not be interceptable or jammable (like photon torps)
- Decreased power per shot to 300 (was 350)
- Increased damage to 2500 / 2000 (was 2500 / 1000) - Buffed minimum damage only
- Increase speed to 90 (was 30)
- Maintains double damage versus shields
Tier 0: Artillery
- No change
Tier 0: Flak Cannon
- No change
Tier 0: Vulcan Cannon
- Increase damage to 20 (was 15).
This gives the weapon some viability relative to other Tier 0 weapons.
Tier 1: Mass Driver
These were somewhat weak overall. Basic artillery was often better.
- 2x5 variant = Increased max / min damage to 725 / 600 (was 500 / 500).
- 2x4 snub-variant = increased damage to 800 / 750 (was 500 / 500).
- All variants: Increase shots/second to 0.2 (was 0.1) - Fires every 5 seconds (was 10)
Tier 1: Phoenix Cannon
Not used by the AI.
- Increase damage to 200/100 (was 90/80)
Tier 2: Gauss Cannon
This performs pretty well. However its use as a Tier 2 weapon was severely limited due to the size of the weapon and most races requiring battleship or titans to mount the weapon.
- Increase projectile speed to 120 (was 80)
- Added a smaller 2x5 Gauss Cannon variant with new icon
-- Energy & ord per shot = 120 & 5 (full size gauss is 200 / 10)
-- Damage = 1250 / 1250 (full size gauss is 3000 / 3000)
-- Range = 800 (same as full size gauss)
-- Projectile speed =: 100 (full size gauss is 120)
Tier 3: Cluster Cannon
Not a very good or reliable weapon previously, also had the broken swarm effects.
- Removed broken swarm effect (and sound glitches). Now fires a 4 projectile salvo every 4 seconds.
- Increased damage. Now does 400 / 400 damage per projectile (was dealing flak projectile damage of 25 per projectile, with 10 projectiles)
- Range reduced to 250 (was 400)
- Field of fire increased to 90 (was 75)
- Projectile speed increased to 100 (was 40).
- Projectile hit points increased to 100 (was "0")
Tier 3: Dual Mass Driver
These were pretty decent but not available to the AI.
- Added to the tech tree as a Tier 3 energy tech.
- Reduced mid-range damage to 1500 (was 1750)
- Increased max range to 750 (was 500)
- Increased max range damage to 500 (was 350)
Tier 4: Sub-Space Artillery
These were also good, but not available to the AI.
- Added to the tech tree as a Tier 4 Physics tech.
- Increased damage to 2000 / 1250 (was 1500 / 1000)
- Increase projectile speed to 120 (was 60)
Tier 5: NullField Cannon
Null Field Cannons was pretty good originally. Revamped slightly to work as a kinetic wepaon instead of an energy cannon.
- Changed weapon type to Kinetic Weapon (was Energy Cannon)
- Decreased power per shot to 200 (was 1000)
- Increased ordinance per shot to 10 (was 0)
- Increased range to 400 (was 300)
- Increased minimum damage to 8000 (was 5000)
Fighters were not all that strong originally, and have been tweaked slightly:
- Fighter shields provides 1500 shield strength to regular fighters (was 200) and 3000 to heavy fighters (was 400).
- Heavy fighter bays now provide a squadron of regular fighters in addition to the squadron of heavy fighters.
- Quantanium armor health increased to 4,250 / 20,000 / 50,000 (was 2,550 / 12,000 / 30,000). Quantanium armor was buffed significantly to compensate for AIs or players choosing it over Starbases in the tech tree.
- Tritanium armor health to 4,000 / 18,000 / 45,000 (was 3,000 / 13,800 / 35,100). Buffed considerably to account for players choosing it over battlestations in the tech tree.
- Solar armor power generation increased to 5 / 25 / 75 (was 3 / 15 / 45) to better compensate for AIs or players that choose fusion beams over over fusion power plants.
Take a look at this spreadsheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tCBbT514siTsZjlUYk_pELyiLgjukEexz2Zlv7ocC4E/edit?usp=sharing
The "ALT WEAPON REBALANCE" tab shows all of the above changes for quicker digestion :)
********** Note Regarding DPS Calculations in the Spreadsheet *******************
I've iteratively built the DPS model by observing weapon performance relative to benchmark weapons (phasors and disrupters mostly) and then tweaking some of my assumptions in the spreadsheet until the existing ranking of weapons (un-modified weapons) mostly met my in-game observations.
Some of the details and specific assumptions I've made here:
* DPS/Tile considers the support space required for a weapon under "nuclear power" and under "anti-matter" power. So, how much power + ammo + capacitor space is needed. For the DPS calculator for anti-matter power, I also added in the likely technology bonuses (e.g. PowerDensity that buffs energy cannon damage) that players would have. The "AVG NET DPS" column is a weighted average in DPS between the nuclear value vs. the anti-matter value. It is weighted based on the tier level of the weapon, with higher tier weapons favoring the anti-matter DPS values. You can see that, in general the more power hungry a weapon is, the more it benefits by transitioning to a higher power reactor.
* The next assumption deals with range. I averaged the base NET DPS value (which uses range 0) with the DPS of the weapon at max range. So the DPS values reflect the point in weapon damage. In addition, a max range factor was derived as a function of range 250. Weapons with a max range below 250 have a slightly penality to their DPS, while weapons above 250 get a slight bump (+75% damage for max range of 1000 weapons).
* Lastly, based on observing combat behavior, I made a few adjustments based on the type of weapon mount and field of fire.
(1) Weapons on spinal/broadside mounts have a 5% DPS penalty. Weapons with narrow cones of fire (e.. 45-degrees) also get a 5% DPS penalty. The speed of the projectile also
(2) Projectile speed has a significant impact on hit frequency. Projectiles speeds below 75 (original photon torpedo speed) inure a minor penalty. Beam weapons get a 10% bonuses do their instant firing and non-missing capabilities.
(3) Counter-able weapons (e.g. missiles) that can be shot down by point defense or ECM's get A 15% penalty to DPS.
(4) Tracking weapons (e.g. missiles) get a 15% bonuses to DPS :)
Must say this icemania dude sounds for me reasonable person cause i remember him from Distant worlds forum as an active and he helps a lot new players. May be we should have him as our representant for Zero so that Zero doesn't need to go through all commentars? So that Icemania summmons what we want and makes some general suggestions to make this great game even better!
Specially for rally points and governors
5. The ability to select multiple ships when Deploying Your Fleet, and being able to drag and drop multiple ships at once. This makes it much easier to organize your fleet formations. Having to handpick hundreds of ships to put them into the right formation is simply too tedious.
All of this basically sounds good, like rally points and customizable governors and a launch all button. I've got to figure out some UI stuff and implement these kinds of changes in a smart way.
E.g. If you look at Blueprint Designs for Battleships, you have one very long list. (If you make lots of blueprints) If players could make custom headers and put ships into open/closeable lists, it would be much easier to deal with numerous ship designs.
So e.g:
BATTLESHIPS
"Carrier Design"
> Super Battleship Carrier MK I
> Super Battleship Carrier MK II
> Amazing Carrier
"Long Range Battleship"
> Sigma Class Battleship
"Favorite Battleship Designs"
> TDB Glorious
The same, but not customizeable for weapons & system would also make ship designing much easier, by having weapons of a class under one header, e.g.
Beam Weapons
Missile Systems
Ballistic Weapons
etc.
In Systems there could be:
Reactors
Engines
etc.
All of that would cut down a lot of the time spent searching for a particular ship design or ship system, making ship designing more fun and less time intensive.
In particular the latter would be immensily helpful for mods that add more stuff to the game, because otherwise new weapons and systems will clutter up the interface.
Every time the AI has a Battlecruiser or Titan, as rare as it is, I check their builds. And I'm yet to see one with anything more than early game technologies. When you look at the AI xml files that observation makes sense because there really isn't much there and it's mainly early game technologies that are required. One of the five AI xml files doesn't even target shields at all and some AI xml's only do Class I shields. Or are you saying these xml's are not used?
Where big companies fail, a one men can handle it..
Cannot wait on the buy all button and all the other features :)
I would buy more DLC if there where :.(
Also, as I've posted over at the eXplorminate forums, to close out any doubt about poor mid-to-late game AI ship building performance, I’ve just played a game on Brutal 4X with a turtle strategy (i.e. did not invade any of the AI early and gave the AI technology for peace if anybody declared war). Ascension victory was disabled, the idea was to see what the AI puts up given it’s had late game technologies for quite some time due to the Brutal 4X bonuses. I also traded some technologies with the AI to make sure they could build titans etc. I’m now battling through the AI (just exterminating everyone to avoid troop and colony micromanagement) and in every case so far the AI has put up extremely weak designs and every battle was a cakewalk … even when the AI had more than an order of magnitude more CP in their fleets. With larger ships, the AI always had early game technologies. With medium sized ships, they often had early game technologies and only occasionally did I see mid-game technologies.