Estelle is a great protagonist.

[: D]

She somehow mixes her tomboyish nature and her love for Joshua into a great blend of character development, it’s really blown my mind how she matures throughout these 2 games, damn. Also Agate, wasn’t expecting his story to be THAT touching.

Playing through New Game+ really makes you appreciate the char development more (less time worrying about Quartz n stuff).

[myhr2]

Agreed, one of my favorite JRPG protag ever, she's a straight-forward girl, and while she may lack subtelty, she makes up for it with sheer will and charisma. Plus, she really has to grow and mature during the time she's seperated from Joshua, being able to stand as his equal when she finally joins with him again. The beach scene is one of the best "anti-emo" thing I've ever seen.

[: D]

You said it brother, that scene was super well done. (Also manly(?) tears ftw)

[butterbattle22]

You're a great OP.

[Oguzhan]

My favorite thing about Estelle is how she still manages to be herself EVEN AFTER all the character development she goes through. It is a natural character development and not a forced one where the character suddenly becomes a different person entirely because of one stupid epiphany moment. At the start of FC, Estelle was a really nice person who wouldn't stand for anyone's bs. At the end of SC, she is still that character BUT she is more mature and experienced. And she still continues to grow which is just insane considering her main arcs are done. A lot of the time, when the tomboy character becomes more "girly" they pretty much become submissive waifus. Estelle on the other hand see merit in becoming more "girly" but doesn't change her entire character just to fit the mold. She still keeps up with her other, "manlier" hobbies. A good example of this is in Sky 3rd where Josette makes fun of her for not knowing any handcraft skills like baking and cooking. Estelle DOES argue with her but she also says "you know what, I can't disagree that is not one of my strong suits". It is a simple touch yet it speaks volumes on how well her character development has been.

It is weird how much I am able to resonate with this character despite me not being a girl nor a staff using bracer. However, due to the amazing writing, Estelle is able to connect with the player despite being very different from them. Usually in Rpgs the devs make the main character to be the most plain person ever just so the player can put themselves in their shoes but in all honesty, imo, most of the time that just results in generic characterizations.

Estelle is one of those RARE female characters who are not a waifu. MOST OF THE TIME, especially these days, female characters are just these cute anime girls who are always nice to people. Submissive waifus who exist to charm the player basically. Estelle on the other hand? ♥♥♥♥ no! She is going to call you out on your ♥♥♥♥ the moment she gets the least bit of smell of it. However, she is also not one of those robotic, battle hardened warrior girls without flaws where their entire character is about learning to care for others.

And finally, she doesn't eat the spotlight meaning the other characters are not overshadowed.

[Dragon]

I don't think Estelle is so great as everyone says.

Her love for Joshua makes no sense whatsoever. He has no personality at all. He might as well be a mannequin or a cardboard cut-out or a stick in the mud or something like that.

So she loves him why, exactly? These games never do anything to explain why she loves Joshua.

Also she becomes a Mary Sue by the end of this SC game (and so does Joshua also) by them being able to beat all the Enforcers (and multiple times, ROFL!) including Loewe without any help from Cassius...all of which is absolutely ludicrous.

And it doesn't make sense how she is always swearing like a drunken sailor yet the game also says she supposed to be good and bright like the sun, which are two totally different and utterly incongruent character premises.

[butterbattle22]

What Dragon says - "I don't think Estelle is so great."

What I hear - "I-i-i-it's not like I like her or anything!"

On a more serious note, what character do you like Dragon? If I took your posts at face value instead of realizing you're a tsundere, I'd have to conclude that you hate everyone and everything.

[Dragon]

Originally posted by butterbattle22:

what character do you like Dragon?

It's hard to say, because they all kind of jump the shark sooner or later.

Weissman started out being a great villain and a very complex character, but then they flushed that all down the toilet by the end and turned him into a one-dimensional caricature by having him say ludicrous cartoony things like he tortures people because he likes it.

Zin started out being a great character, but his development goes nowhere in this SC game and instead it gets totally taken over by Kilika who is an awful character.

Loewe started out being a great character but then they turned him into a total joke by the end of this game.

Closest thing I can think of to a really good character would be Instructor Sara in the CS games, but I don't yet know if she jumps the shark in the later CS games. She kind of jumps the shark a bit in CS 1 and CS 2 in how her students quickly become just as powerful as her, if not more so, even though story-wise that makes no sense and she is supposed to be way stronger than them.

[Citronvand]

Originally posted by Dragon:

It's hard to say, because they all kind of jump the shark sooner or later.

I'm curious what you think about Anelace and Renne? Have you played the Crossbell games by the way? Because that may affect your answer.

[butterbattle22]

Originally posted by Dragon:

Closest thing I can think of to a really good character would be Instructor Sara in the CS games, but I don't yet know if she jumps the shark in the later CS games.

*exaggerated yawn*

God, you're so boring Dragon. If you weren't a troll, you'd be the most boring person in these forums so I'm not sure why you're slamming on Joshua.

Since nothing you write is half as objective as you think it is anyways, would it hurt for you to show some preferences? I'm trying to ask you about your favorite flavor of waifu, not DragonCambridge Character Building 301.

Here, I'll go first.

Sky - Kloe
Crossbell - Rixia
Cold Steel 1-2 - Laura

Or if you like husbandos better, you can describe your husbandos.

[butterbattle22]

Originally posted by Citronvand:

I'm curious what you think about Anelace and Renne?

Oh, Anelace is a good example too.

I feel that conversations where people talk about what characters they like are actually two different conversations.

1) I like this character.

2) This is an adeptly written character with a realistically complex personality, logically coherent pattern of thoughts and behavior, and extensive backstory.

This obviously isn't mutually exclusive, but it's not the same thing either. This is complicated by the fact that people tend to view their favorite characters as having more depth than they actually have. I LOVE ANELACE. But at the end of first chapter, she's barely even a character. By the end of SC, we know some things about her, but honestly she still doesn't have that much depth. Weirdly enough, it's not until the Third when we get more of that juice, through one of the doors.

More than anything, Anelace captured a very likable archetype. She's a cute girl with a sword that likes cute things. She's feminine, but strong. She's energetic and optimistic, but not dumb. She protects her friends and has a sense of justice, but isn't obsessed with it. She frequently delivers comic relief in her scenes, but she is a competent bracer and certainly not just a comic relief character. It's almost impossible to not like her honestly.

Dragon probably doesn't though (lmao), and if he doesn't, it's because his 1) doesn't exist. He only sees characters in 2)s. But if his 1) does exist, commmeeee oonnnnn Draaaggooonnnn

[Citronvand]

Originally posted by butterbattle22:

Originally posted by Citronvand:

I'm curious what you think about Anelace and Renne?

I feel that conversations where people talk about what characters they like are actually two different conversations.

1) I like this character.

2) This is an adeptly written character with a realistically complex personality, logically coherent pattern of thoughts and behavior, and extensive backstory.

I think that is good way to put it. Anelace definitely is a 1 for me, as in I like this character. I have honestly very few characters I dislike, I even like Elise which it seems everyone ♥♥♥♥♥ on. My favorite is Renne though, since she is a mix of 1 & 2 for me.

Originally posted by butterbattle22:

Or if you like husbandos better, you can describe your husbandos.

If Dragon's favorite husbando is not Ragnard I'm going to be disappointed.

[: D]

my husbando is definitely Agate. aiyaaaa the tsundere is strong in him lmao (i mean id go joshua but thats too obvious)

[butterbattle22]

Originally posted by butterbattle22:

If Dragon's favorite husbando is not Ragnard I'm going to be disappointed.

Lmao

[Endora]

To Dragon:
Joshua is kind, gentle and a bit of a teaser at sometimes. It's obvious that he is strong, but he has no need for all that crap macho-s**t that makes some pseudo machos try to get the women go down so they can feel superior. On the contrary, every time Estele feels down he said the right thing to help her to be herself again (note: herself, he isn't trying to format her).

Estele doesn't need an alfa-male, she needs a partner and that's what Joshua is.

I'm sory, but if you don't understand this I'm afraid I'll have to say that you don't understand strong women at all.

[Terranigma23]

Originally posted by Endora:

To Dragon:
Joshua is kind, gentle and a bit of a teaser at sometimes. It's obvious that he is strong, but he has no need for all that crap macho-s**t that makes some pseudo machos try to get the women go down so they can feel superior. On the contrary, every time Estele feels down he said the right thing to help her to be herself again (note: herself, he isn't trying to format her).

Estele doesn't need an alfa-male, she needs a partner and that's what Joshua is.

I'm sory, but if you don't understand this I'm afraid I'll have to say that you don't understand strong women at all.

+1