No tanks?

[~WiFiEmoPurrletarianNekoGirl~]

You must be thinking who the ♥♥♥♥ does not want tanks in an cold war RTS.
I know it is stupid, but is there any multiplayer server that uses mostly infantry?

Or is there a way to properly fight one with tanks if you have no tanks or crappy ones.

[Mistfox]

A no tank deck is incredibly defensive in nature, as the old saying goes "Infantry are the lice that infest the folds of the Earth.". So a no tank deck is best used in built up or forested areas where you can spring a surprise on the enemy with your close range LAWs/RPGs. Or inversely, you can do the Chinese Human Wave style attack if you got enough points for it. A wall of infantry to draw enemy fire followed by IFVs armed with anti-tank missiles and GROM guns works fairly well if you got enough of them.

You'll need a lot of support for an infantry deck, mostly to drop smoke and force the enemy closer.

Think there was also a meme deck of a huge fleet of helicopter gunships gunning down everything in their path. Sure, you'll lose some but the numbers are often enough to mow down most opposition if they went too light on the AA guns.

[~WiFiEmoPurrletarianNekoGirl~]

Originally posted by Mistfox:

A no tank deck is incredibly defensive in nature, as the old saying goes "Infantry are the lice that infest the folds of the Earth.". So a no tank deck is best used in built up or forested areas where you can spring a surprise on the enemy with your close range LAWs/RPGs. Or inversely, you can do the Chinese Human Wave style attack if you got enough points for it. A wall of infantry to draw enemy fire followed by IFVs armed with anti-tank missiles and GROM guns works fairly well if you got enough of them.

You'll need a lot of support for an infantry deck, mostly to drop smoke and force the enemy closer.

Think there was also a meme deck of a huge fleet of helicopter gunships gunning down everything in their path. Sure, you'll lose some but the numbers are often enough to mow down most opposition if they went too light on the AA guns.

Some nations have many cheap helicopters making it viable to rush. But you'll need ATGM and AA helicopters alongside or you'll be ♥♥♥♥♥♥.

Like I said, I have a deck but it lacks in tanks and the faction itself does not have good tanks.

[Mistfox]

Originally posted by Perennial:

Like I said, I have a deck but it lacks in tanks and the faction itself does not have good tanks.

Let me guess. The Commonwealth. lol. Like I said, decks without good tanks are defensive in nature. Your tactics are hide and seek and attrition. Usually, these decks tend to also have better quality infantry than the other factions, so on a 1v1 infantry fight, you can expect to have a higher chance of winning.

[~WiFiEmoPurrletarianNekoGirl~]

Originally posted by Mistfox:

Originally posted by Perennial:

Like I said, I have a deck but it lacks in tanks and the faction itself does not have good tanks.

Let me guess. The Commonwealth. lol. Like I said, decks without good tanks are defensive in nature. Your tactics are hide and seek and attrition. Usually, these decks tend to also have better quality infantry than the other factions, so on a 1v1 infantry fight, you can expect to have a higher chance of winning.

That Commonwealth has tanks. I play Africa and France.

I found a fantastic opfor faction for mostly infantry and good tanks, but I rarely play blufor so this is why I ask.

[krasnyii]

Play the map Wonsan Harbour.

[~WiFiEmoPurrletarianNekoGirl~]

Originally posted by krasnyii:

Play the map Wonsan Harbour.

Looks like someone did not read much of the topic or other comments.
In all seriousness, this does not help.

[Groucho]

1) Not that i can think of, there's no server that impose any strict rules on tanks in general, so it's up to the player to decide if to field them or not

2) ATGM inf teams, Cluster Bombers, ATGM helos and planes, artillery, hell even place some regulars waiting in ambush can work. as for tank v tank combat, best hope is waiting for an opportunity, such has shooting the sides

[Dakota]

I also don't really care for tanks much in wargame so most of my decks revolve more around infantry usage and fire support vehicles. I'd recommend a moto or mech deck for this so your infantry quality and quantity is better, mech might be easier to start with as mechanized IFVs can provide excellent support and the ones equipped with ATGMs can help out a lot for dealing with tanks in more open areas.

You mentioned you play south africa and france though, which are excellent moto nations. France especially is top tier, legion 90 make short work of any tanks that get in range and the milan F3s are amazing ATGMs.

South africa is very speed focused with its rooikats (do you count those as tanks?) and the ratel 20s, you generally can outplay the enemy by using your speed to get into flanking positions or to hit and run. The buccaneers are also excellent AT planes when upvetted, I'd recommend 2 cards upvetted if you're worried about enemy tanks. They are somewhat lacking in infantry based ATGMs, with the milan 1s as your best option, though the bokkop 90 have amazing AT capability for line infantry. SA does run into some issues against medium tank spam, like just lots of M1s and M1IPs can be an issue with their high armor for relatively low cost, similar deal with soviet BTR-Ts and BMP-Ts, as it isn't so easy to just get cost effective kills on them with AT planes and their armor means your infantry ATGMs do little damage to them and the rooikats will have trouble against their armor unless they're in large hit and run groups, but will likely also take losses themselves unless you get the enemy tanks to waste shots before they come in or otherwise panic them.

[~WiFiEmoPurrletarianNekoGirl~]

Originally posted by Dakota:

I also don't really care for tanks much in wargame so most of my decks revolve more around infantry usage and fire support vehicles. I'd recommend a moto or mech deck for this so your infantry quality and quantity is better, mech might be easier to start with as mechanized IFVs can provide excellent support and the ones equipped with ATGMs can help out a lot for dealing with tanks in more open areas.

You mentioned you play south africa and france though, which are excellent moto nations. France especially is top tier, legion 90 make short work of any tanks that get in range and the milan F3s are amazing ATGMs.

South africa is very speed focused with its rooikats (do you count those as tanks?) and the ratel 20s, you generally can outplay the enemy by using your speed to get into flanking positions or to hit and run. The buccaneers are also excellent AT planes when upvetted, I'd recommend 2 cards upvetted if you're worried about enemy tanks. They are somewhat lacking in infantry based ATGMs, with the milan 1s as your best option, though the bokkop 90 have amazing AT capability for line infantry. SA does run into some issues against medium tank spam, like just lots of M1s and M1IPs can be an issue with their high armor for relatively low cost, similar deal with soviet BTR-Ts and BMP-Ts, as it isn't so easy to just get cost effective kills on them with AT planes and their armor means your infantry ATGMs do little damage to them and the rooikats will have trouble against their armor unless they're in large hit and run groups, but will likely also take losses themselves unless you get the enemy tanks to waste shots before they come in or otherwise panic them.

Thank you. I found the best option for Africa to be the anti-tank rifle, good for mechanized infantry and infantry.

France I have been successful with so far. I'd say I have the most issue with South Africa. During MP games some people tank or air spam which is really difficult to prevent. I just eventually get low on points and cannot do anything. Even using the ratels, which is actually the only "tank" I use in SA becasue the actual tank cannot hit anything. Tanks still just overcome me rather quickly.

Africa ATGM plane is a really good plane, but I have issues (unsurprisingly) with it being shot down. I am not much of an air user.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by Perennial:

Originally posted by Dakota:

I also don't really care for tanks much in wargame so most of my decks revolve more around infantry usage and fire support vehicles. I'd recommend a moto or mech deck for this so your infantry quality and quantity is better, mech might be easier to start with as mechanized IFVs can provide excellent support and the ones equipped with ATGMs can help out a lot for dealing with tanks in more open areas.

You mentioned you play south africa and france though, which are excellent moto nations. France especially is top tier, legion 90 make short work of any tanks that get in range and the milan F3s are amazing ATGMs.

South africa is very speed focused with its rooikats (do you count those as tanks?) and the ratel 20s, you generally can outplay the enemy by using your speed to get into flanking positions or to hit and run. The buccaneers are also excellent AT planes when upvetted, I'd recommend 2 cards upvetted if you're worried about enemy tanks. They are somewhat lacking in infantry based ATGMs, with the milan 1s as your best option, though the bokkop 90 have amazing AT capability for line infantry. SA does run into some issues against medium tank spam, like just lots of M1s and M1IPs can be an issue with their high armor for relatively low cost, similar deal with soviet BTR-Ts and BMP-Ts, as it isn't so easy to just get cost effective kills on them with AT planes and their armor means your infantry ATGMs do little damage to them and the rooikats will have trouble against their armor unless they're in large hit and run groups, but will likely also take losses themselves unless you get the enemy tanks to waste shots before they come in or otherwise panic them.

Thank you. I found the best option for Africa to be the anti-tank rifle, good for mechanized infantry and infantry.

France I have been successful with so far. I'd say I have the most issue with South Africa. During MP games some people tank or air spam which is really difficult to prevent. I just eventually get low on points and cannot do anything. Even using the ratels, which is actually the only "tank" I use in SA becasue the actual tank cannot hit anything. Tanks still just overcome me rather quickly.

Africa ATGM plane is a really good plane, but I have issues (unsurprisingly) with it being shot down. I am not much of an air user.

The SA tanks tend to have pretty high accuracy ratings outside of their cheapest options. The olifant MK1B is a solid choice if you want a good gun and some armor, but the Rooikats are also both rather accurate, with the rooikat 105 having an outright better gun for cheaper, so may as well use that most of the time.

They also have extremely good anti air in their support tab, I'd recommend making heavy use of that to prevent enemy air from dominating, the IR cactus options can help a lot against SEAD users too, and all the AA missiles are great vs helicopters. The buccaneers are cheap enough that if an enemy loses an ASF to your AA while shooting one down then it's a terrible trade for them, especially if they also lost an expensive tank in the process.

The ratel cannot really be used in the way that a tank is, it lacks armor and range, what you'd want to do with those is have them act as close up fire support for infantry, have them probe around backlines, and if you really need to you can overwhelm lone tanks with a group of 3 or 4 of them sometimes if you can get around to their sides at close range.

Using large amounts of medium tanks is a common counter to SA due to the lack of good ATGMs and many SA players going moto, which leaves them without many high end tanks of their own. Rooikats are good if they can outnumber enemy tanks but will struggle with a larger group of incoming tanks. Your best bet to avoid folding under such an attack would be to have a good amount of bokkop 90, or really any of their 23 AP launcher options spread throughout treelines and buildings in the way of the incoming tank push, try to force forest fights where possible so that your ratel 20s can be put to good use.

[~WiFiEmoPurrletarianNekoGirl~]

Originally posted by Dakota:

Originally posted by Perennial:

Thank you. I found the best option for Africa to be the anti-tank rifle, good for mechanized infantry and infantry.

France I have been successful with so far. I'd say I have the most issue with South Africa. During MP games some people tank or air spam which is really difficult to prevent. I just eventually get low on points and cannot do anything. Even using the ratels, which is actually the only "tank" I use in SA becasue the actual tank cannot hit anything. Tanks still just overcome me rather quickly.

Africa ATGM plane is a really good plane, but I have issues (unsurprisingly) with it being shot down. I am not much of an air user.

The SA tanks tend to have pretty high accuracy ratings outside of their cheapest options. The olifant MK1B is a solid choice if you want a good gun and some armor, but the Rooikats are also both rather accurate, with the rooikat 105 having an outright better gun for cheaper, so may as well use that most of the time.

They also have extremely good anti air in their support tab, I'd recommend making heavy use of that to prevent enemy air from dominating, the IR cactus options can help a lot against SEAD users too, and all the AA missiles are great vs helicopters. The buccaneers are cheap enough that if an enemy loses an ASF to your AA while shooting one down then it's a terrible trade for them, especially if they also lost an expensive tank in the process.

The ratel cannot really be used in the way that a tank is, it lacks armor and range, what you'd want to do with those is have them act as close up fire support for infantry, have them probe around backlines, and if you really need to you can overwhelm lone tanks with a group of 3 or 4 of them sometimes if you can get around to their sides at close range.

Using large amounts of medium tanks is a common counter to SA due to the lack of good ATGMs and many SA players going moto, which leaves them without many high end tanks of their own. Rooikats are good if they can outnumber enemy tanks but will struggle with a larger group of incoming tanks. Your best bet to avoid folding under such an attack would be to have a good amount of bokkop 90, or really any of their 23 AP launcher options spread throughout treelines and buildings in the way of the incoming tank push, try to force forest fights where possible so that your ratel 20s can be put to good use.

Thank you, any idea on how to properly use their ATGM plane? Without being shot down.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by Perennial:

Originally posted by Dakota:

The SA tanks tend to have pretty high accuracy ratings outside of their cheapest options. The olifant MK1B is a solid choice if you want a good gun and some armor, but the Rooikats are also both rather accurate, with the rooikat 105 having an outright better gun for cheaper, so may as well use that most of the time.

They also have extremely good anti air in their support tab, I'd recommend making heavy use of that to prevent enemy air from dominating, the IR cactus options can help a lot against SEAD users too, and all the AA missiles are great vs helicopters. The buccaneers are cheap enough that if an enemy loses an ASF to your AA while shooting one down then it's a terrible trade for them, especially if they also lost an expensive tank in the process.

The ratel cannot really be used in the way that a tank is, it lacks armor and range, what you'd want to do with those is have them act as close up fire support for infantry, have them probe around backlines, and if you really need to you can overwhelm lone tanks with a group of 3 or 4 of them sometimes if you can get around to their sides at close range.

Using large amounts of medium tanks is a common counter to SA due to the lack of good ATGMs and many SA players going moto, which leaves them without many high end tanks of their own. Rooikats are good if they can outnumber enemy tanks but will struggle with a larger group of incoming tanks. Your best bet to avoid folding under such an attack would be to have a good amount of bokkop 90, or really any of their 23 AP launcher options spread throughout treelines and buildings in the way of the incoming tank push, try to force forest fights where possible so that your ratel 20s can be put to good use.

Thank you, any idea on how to properly use their ATGM plane? Without being shot down.

Don't fly it over AA, but just saying that is too obvious and not helpful enough as it doesn't explain how not to do so. Given it's not particularly fast and the ECM on it is terrible it'll likely be shot down if it flies over any air defenses, and the enemy might call out an ASF too.

If the enemy calls out an ASF you could bring in one of your own as SA has some amazingly good ASF, or you could have AA out and pull the ATGM plane over your AA net to try to bait in the enemy ASF, even a couple cactus could do the trick but a couple of the high end rooikat AA missile pieces would be much easier to do the job with as long as the enemy didn't bring out SEAD with their ASF.

If the issue is the enemy having AA of their own then the answer becomes a bit harder. SA does have SEAD of their own, but it's terribly inaccurate, it's a great plane for using like a rocket plane and heli hunter, but it can be rather inconsistent if you need AA dead, but even just sending one out may cause an opponent to turn their radars off for the time it takes you to kill their tanks, and even with their radars off, if you see their position you can fire pos it with the SA sead plane since it's HE. Though not all AA has radars, and those can be a great danger to you, for dealing with those you'd mostly need to fire on the tanks mostly if they're overextending in a push or if you've gotten enough infantry and light vehicles around to take out AA in backlines and feel secure in sending a plane over. You could even try sending an empty transport helicopter over to probe before sending in an ATGM plane, IR missiles commonly will have higher anti heli range than anti plane range with the exception of a couple of the radarless heavy SAMs found on yugo, netherlands, and denmark.

[~WiFiEmoPurrletarianNekoGirl~]

Originally posted by Dakota:

Originally posted by Perennial:

Thank you, any idea on how to properly use their ATGM plane? Without being shot down.

Don't fly it over AA, but just saying that is too obvious and not helpful enough as it doesn't explain how not to do so. Given it's not particularly fast and the ECM on it is terrible it'll likely be shot down if it flies over any air defenses, and the enemy might call out an ASF too.

If the enemy calls out an ASF you could bring in one of your own as SA has some amazingly good ASF, or you could have AA out and pull the ATGM plane over your AA net to try to bait in the enemy ASF, even a couple cactus could do the trick but a couple of the high end rooikat AA missile pieces would be much easier to do the job with as long as the enemy didn't bring out SEAD with their ASF.

If the issue is the enemy having AA of their own then the answer becomes a bit harder. SA does have SEAD of their own, but it's terribly inaccurate, it's a great plane for using like a rocket plane and heli hunter, but it can be rather inconsistent if you need AA dead, but even just sending one out may cause an opponent to turn their radars off for the time it takes you to kill their tanks, and even with their radars off, if you see their position you can fire pos it with the SA sead plane since it's HE. Though not all AA has radars, and those can be a great danger to you, for dealing with those you'd mostly need to fire on the tanks mostly if they're overextending in a push or if you've gotten enough infantry and light vehicles around to take out AA in backlines and feel secure in sending a plane over. You could even try sending an empty transport helicopter over to probe before sending in an ATGM plane, IR missiles commonly will have higher anti heli range than anti plane range with the exception of a couple of the radarless heavy SAMs found on yugo, netherlands, and denmark.

Thanks.

[PzJaheger]

Originally posted by Dakota:

Originally posted by Perennial:

Thank you, any idea on how to properly use their ATGM plane? Without being shot down.

Don't fly it over AA, but just saying that is too obvious and not helpful enough as it doesn't explain how not to do so. Given it's not particularly fast and the ECM on it is terrible it'll likely be shot down if it flies over any air defenses, and the enemy might call out an ASF too.

If the enemy calls out an ASF you could bring in one of your own as SA has some amazingly good ASF, or you could have AA out and pull the ATGM plane over your AA net to try to bait in the enemy ASF, even a couple cactus could do the trick but a couple of the high end rooikat AA missile pieces would be much easier to do the job with as long as the enemy didn't bring out SEAD with their ASF.

If the issue is the enemy having AA of their own then the answer becomes a bit harder. SA does have SEAD of their own, but it's terribly inaccurate, it's a great plane for using like a rocket plane and heli hunter, but it can be rather inconsistent if you need AA dead, but even just sending one out may cause an opponent to turn their radars off for the time it takes you to kill their tanks, and even with their radars off, if you see their position you can fire pos it with the SA sead plane since it's HE. Though not all AA has radars, and those can be a great danger to you, for dealing with those you'd mostly need to fire on the tanks mostly if they're overextending in a push or if you've gotten enough infantry and light vehicles around to take out AA in backlines and feel secure in sending a plane over. You could even try sending an empty transport helicopter over to probe before sending in an ATGM plane, IR missiles commonly will have higher anti heli range than anti plane range with the exception of a couple of the radarless heavy SAMs found on yugo, netherlands, and denmark.

That's why you send out SEAD with an AT plane and air cover to make a dilemma

[Mistfox]

Originally posted by PzJaheger:

That's why you send out SEAD with an AT plane and air cover to make a dilemma

^. This. So this.

If you are playing an infantry heavy deck and want to duel with tanks, remember that your Milans have an incredible range, outranging most tank guns, so an open field advantage is best. What you need to do is to have a lot of resupply on hand to keep the missiles flying. And after you do. RUN! The obvious counter to an annoying ATGM team is either artillery or a napalm airstrike, so once you open fire, know that it's coming.

Infantry that are not ATGMs on the other hand need to suck the enemy in closer, so like what was mentioned already, forests and buildings. Preferably buildings since infantry can move very fast in buildings while being as slow as turtles in forests. If a tank unit rushes your infantry line in a forest, pull the unit directly in from of it back. You want the flanking infantry to hit the tanks in the sides. Worst case? Set the whole forest on fire with some Lifebuoys. Tanks really don't do well in fire. Chances are high the Sapper team will die but the tanks are not going to come out unharmed too. Or you can use Vampires. So as you can see, SA deck is mostly to suck someone in then make them pay for it.