Telefragging

[JPlanas98]

This one word can pretty much sum up the entirety of Repentance because that's all the enemies and bosses consist of. I'm tired of losing health or dying because I keep getting hit by attacks that I don't have a chance to react to.

[76561198196139970]

play in normal and practice with the lost

[♡バニラ♡]

afaik the only enemy that can telefrag you is Delirium, but he's AB+

[11clock]

The only issue I have had with enemy attacks, which is an issue I have always had since flash Isaac, is the total lack of warning signs for brimstone laser attacks. Highlight areas that are about to be hit by brimstone, please. I know that there are audio tells, but oftentimes that isn't enough.

[HeraldOfOpera]

Originally posted by 11clock:

The only issue I have had with enemy attacks, which is an issue I have always had since flash Isaac, is the total lack of warning signs for brimstone laser attacks. Highlight areas that are about to be hit by brimstone, please. I know that there are audio tells, but oftentimes that isn't enough.

This is only really a problem for The Adversary; he technically has a unique visual cue like everyone else who's not The Bloat, but his own darkness will often obscure it and its homing properties mean that even your proposed solution won't really work.

[brapgf]

lmao i was hoping they’d fix that for repentance. that sucks to hear

[11clock]

Originally posted by HeraldOfOpera:

Originally posted by 11clock:

The only issue I have had with enemy attacks, which is an issue I have always had since flash Isaac, is the total lack of warning signs for brimstone laser attacks. Highlight areas that are about to be hit by brimstone, please. I know that there are audio tells, but oftentimes that isn't enough.

This is only really a problem for The Adversary; he technically has a unique visual cue like everyone else who's not The Bloat, but his own darkness will often obscure it and its homing properties mean that even your proposed solution won't really work.

It's a problem for:

-Mega Satan.
-Mother switching to phase 2.
-The Beast's screen-sized brimstone.
-Reap Creep Phase 3.
-Pretty much every other boss that uses brimstone. Even the Haunt has this problem.

I guarantee you will get hit by all of these the first time you encounter them. Sure, if you remember in future encounters you can dodge them, but you have no warning that the audio cue or animation means "giant f--- you laser" until it's too late. This can be fixed by having the area about to be hit "glow." Actually I noticed that a certain enemy in the Mausoleum already does this.

[jayhena]

Originally posted by 11clock:

Originally posted by HeraldOfOpera:

This is only really a problem for The Adversary; he technically has a unique visual cue like everyone else who's not The Bloat, but his own darkness will often obscure it and its homing properties mean that even your proposed solution won't really work.

It's a problem for:

-Mega Satan.
-Mother switching to phase 2.
-The Beast's screen-sized brimstone.
-Reap Creep Phase 3.
-Pretty much every other boss that uses brimstone. Even the Haunt has this problem.

I guarantee you will get hit by all of these the first time you encounter them. Sure, if you remember in future encounters you can dodge them, but you have no warning that the audio cue or animation means "giant f--- you laser" until it's too late. This can be fixed by having the area about to be hit "glow." Actually I noticed that a certain enemy in the Mausoleum already does this.

even if you're at the bottom of the screen, you can see mega satan putting his hands to the side, meaning he's do a mega blast, obviously, if you don't know, it doesn't mean ♥♥♥♥, but atleast there's a tell even if you don't don't see him

[<:)]

Originally posted by 11clock:

Originally posted by HeraldOfOpera:

This is only really a problem for The Adversary; he technically has a unique visual cue like everyone else who's not The Bloat, but his own darkness will often obscure it and its homing properties mean that even your proposed solution won't really work.

It's a problem for:

-Mega Satan.
-Mother switching to phase 2.
-The Beast's screen-sized brimstone.
-Reap Creep Phase 3.
-Pretty much every other boss that uses brimstone. Even the Haunt has this problem.

I guarantee you will get hit by all of these the first time you encounter them. Sure, if you remember in future encounters you can dodge them, but you have no warning that the audio cue or animation means "giant f--- you laser" until it's too late. This can be fixed by having the area about to be hit "glow." Actually I noticed that a certain enemy in the Mausoleum already does this.

The Beast only does his laser after he sucks in fire, and it's always in the same location at the bottom of the screen, and the timing is always the same. Still sucks that if your final fire ring space is at the bottom, and you don't have high speed, you are forced to take at least one hit.

[11clock]

Originally posted by <:):

Originally posted by 11clock:

It's a problem for:

-Mega Satan.
-Mother switching to phase 2.
-The Beast's screen-sized brimstone.
-Reap Creep Phase 3.
-Pretty much every other boss that uses brimstone. Even the Haunt has this problem.

I guarantee you will get hit by all of these the first time you encounter them. Sure, if you remember in future encounters you can dodge them, but you have no warning that the audio cue or animation means "giant f--- you laser" until it's too late. This can be fixed by having the area about to be hit "glow." Actually I noticed that a certain enemy in the Mausoleum already does this.

The Beast only does his laser after he sucks in fire, and it's always in the same location at the bottom of the screen, and the timing is always the same. Still sucks that if your final fire ring space is at the bottom, and you don't have high speed, you are forced to take at least one hit.

The problem is that you don’t even know that the Beast will even do a laser after sucking up the fire until after you were hit by it for the first time or seen a YouTube video of the fight beforehand. If you are fighting the Beast blind, you will be hit by the laser. If the area glowed red or something, that would be a good indicator for the player to move out of the way.

[<:)]

Originally posted by 11clock:

Originally posted by <:):

The Beast only does his laser after he sucks in fire, and it's always in the same location at the bottom of the screen, and the timing is always the same. Still sucks that if your final fire ring space is at the bottom, and you don't have high speed, you are forced to take at least one hit.

The problem is that you don’t even know that the Beast will even do a laser after sucking up the fire until after you were hit by it for the first time or seen a YouTube video of the fight beforehand. If you are fighting the Beast blind, you will be hit by the laser. If the area glowed red or something, that would be a good indicator for the player to move out of the way.

That applies to every boss you've never fought. They might have a 'tell' but you don't know what they're doing until you've seen it.

[Crimson]

Originally posted by 11clock:

Originally posted by HeraldOfOpera:

This is only really a problem for The Adversary; he technically has a unique visual cue like everyone else who's not The Bloat, but his own darkness will often obscure it and its homing properties mean that even your proposed solution won't really work.

It's a problem for:

-Mega Satan.
-Mother switching to phase 2.
-The Beast's screen-sized brimstone.
-Reap Creep Phase 3.
-Pretty much every other boss that uses brimstone. Even the Haunt has this problem.

I guarantee you will get hit by all of these the first time you encounter them. Sure, if you remember in future encounters you can dodge them, but you have no warning that the audio cue or animation means "giant f--- you laser" until it's too late. This can be fixed by having the area about to be hit "glow." Actually I noticed that a certain enemy in the Mausoleum already does this.

Mother always does a brimstone when shes about to switch, theres more than enough time imo to avoid the blast

[11clock]

Originally posted by <:):

Originally posted by 11clock:

The problem is that you don’t even know that the Beast will even do a laser after sucking up the fire until after you were hit by it for the first time or seen a YouTube video of the fight beforehand. If you are fighting the Beast blind, you will be hit by the laser. If the area glowed red or something, that would be a good indicator for the player to move out of the way.

That applies to every boss you've never fought. They might have a 'tell' but you don't know what they're doing until you've seen it.

There is a difference. With projectile or charging attacks, you see it coming and can react to it. Brimstone, on the other hand, is a hit scan attack. Unlike projectiles or charging, the effect is instant.

Originally posted by The Ashen Witch:

Originally posted by 11clock:

It's a problem for:

-Mega Satan.
-Mother switching to phase 2.
-The Beast's screen-sized brimstone.
-Reap Creep Phase 3.
-Pretty much every other boss that uses brimstone. Even the Haunt has this problem.

I guarantee you will get hit by all of these the first time you encounter them. Sure, if you remember in future encounters you can dodge them, but you have no warning that the audio cue or animation means "giant f--- you laser" until it's too late. This can be fixed by having the area about to be hit "glow." Actually I noticed that a certain enemy in the Mausoleum already does this.

Mother always does a brimstone when shes about to switch, theres more than enough time imo to avoid the blast

As I said with the Beast, you don’t know that she will do a brimstone down the middle when you first fight the boss. Sure you will know for all future encounters, but the first time when you don’t know about the brimstone it feels like a cheap hit. Compare that to her phase two attack where yellow glowing lines indicate where she will shoot projectiles. A similar thing could be applied to the brimstone.

[Geordie Watson]

the first time encountering mother and the beast's brimstone attacks felt like cheap deaths.
nothing to show what was happening, everything else in those fights is pretty fair in comparison and you could react based on what the game's thrown at you so far.
the double height screens for mega-satan and mother are a problem in their own right though, as you can't react to what you can't see.

[Geordie Watson]

the delirium fight is genuinely terribly designed and i had hoped it'd have been reworked to some extent for repentance, but nope.

[orian34]

Delirium is the only case of telefragging that really needs to be fixed, otherwise most of those brimstone examples are quite scripted in a way you can avoid them.

Exceptions being bloat and adversary chest room.

But I completely agree that sometimes, you just can't afford to read the boss due to the room being too busy. Like boss rush, or the lamb fight, or simply dogma. Because you know about the attacks, doesn't mean you can predict them at all times.

I lost my tainted lost run against the lamb because he spawned his laser on me while I was scurrying away due to the body splashing lots of tears.

I had no real tells due to the room being busy with effects, and I feel like it wasn't fair.
Now that they've shown us it's possible to have a proper tell (the brimstone heads in gehenna, fireballs in beast fight), I feel like we should have it for most of those instant brim attacks.