Opinion: can we all just agree that Lost is the best and most fun char in the game.

[Black Snake]

I have always been a fan of the lost since he received holy mantle. But in repentance, I personally believe he is the best and most fun char in the game.

Pros:

flight, and spectral tears allows you to navigate and fight in even the worst set up rooms. It completely removes the possibility of getting hurt on spikes and creep.

With the reworked red challenge rooms you now get even more items than before. He always has access.

replacing the D4 with the new 2-charge D6, lowers the chances drastically for getting useless and bad items. and if it deletes the item, oh well, you didn't want it anyways... that's why you were going to reroll it. It also makes you think harder about when to reroll.

With the eternal D6 and how devil deal items work with him, it is now a great choice to pick between angel or devil deal items. In rebirth it was stupid to not take all the devil deal items you can. But due to you now only allowed one and the ability to reroll the angel fight pedestal (+ the buff to angel deals in general) the choice is no longer one sided.

the perfection trinket is a Guarantee with the lost, now making certain b-c tier items that depended on luck A-S tier items. Also with perfection you are just getting more rewards in general, giving you more chances to have fun.

In defense of the two Cons:

He can only take two hits per room. While this can suck for new players, it does teach you to be more cautious. This over time just makes you a better player as you learn to dodge the enemies. Even the most OP run can be lost if you get careless. For people with hundreds of hours, this keeps things interesting. And until later floors it is not stupidly hard to only take one hit per room (excluding bosses).

MANY items are completely useless to him. Healing items and on hit items make you sad when you see them. But this has been addressed with the eternal d6. A two room item that gives you a very high chance of not losing the item when you reroll. Personally I think this item is even better than OG d6 due to its much faster cool down.



TLDR: with hundreds of hours in isaac I am glad to see the lost just keeps getting better and is now the best char in the game. He's come a long way from being a 1 hit death char that people dreaded playing. (I do know of tainted lost and his return to OG lost). but I would like to hear other peoples opinions.

[Rio]

Tainted cain is the worst. Unless you like 2-3 hour runs. Rips almost all the fun of randomness out of the game.

[orian34]

Originally posted by Sashie:

Tainted cain is the worst. Unless you like 2-3 hour runs. Rips almost all the fun of randomness out of the game.

That's... wrong? You can also play him as intended, and craft items as you go

[Rio]

Originally posted by orian34:

Originally posted by Sashie:

Tainted cain is the worst. Unless you like 2-3 hour runs. Rips almost all the fun of randomness out of the game.

That's... wrong? You can also play him as intended, and craft items as you go

You'll mostly get hp upgrades, magic fingers, etc. I f you don't learn what the often hard to craft damage ups are.

And if you aren't using any guide at all, why aren't you just playing regular cain? Or issac? Or any character really. Same randomness about, less busywork.

[orian34]

Originally posted by Sashie:

Originally posted by orian34:

That's... wrong? You can also play him as intended, and craft items as you go

You'll mostly get hp upgrades, magic fingers, etc. I f you don't learn what the often hard to craft damage ups are.

And if you aren't using any guide at all, why aren't you just playing regular cain? Or issac? Or any character really. Same randomness about, less busywork.

You don't need to craft every junk item when you reach max capacity, you know? You can just grab all the pickups, and if the result sucks, swap the low tier ones(often coins) for better ones.

He basically has a more controlled reroll ability, a good number of good items are easily made, so there's no risk of having only trash...

Why would I play him? Because he's different, and fun. Like most other characters

[Umega]

Originally posted by Sashie:

Originally posted by orian34:

That's... wrong? You can also play him as intended, and craft items as you go

You'll mostly get hp upgrades, magic fingers, etc. I f you don't learn what the often hard to craft damage ups are.

And if you aren't using any guide at all, why aren't you just playing regular cain? Or issac? Or any character really. Same randomness about, less busywork.

I understand your dislike for ""Cain"". He does seem like he is a lot of alt tabbing to check crafting recipes, but I appreciate him for being a character that is given a lot of option but still needs to work for it. You could also probably look up high quality collectibles to make sure use them in crafting recipes more, but I'm not sure how reliable this would be. I only played ""Cain"" to unlock planetariums because it is really luck driven whether or not you can unlock them. Same with stuff like Bag of Marbles and Huge Growth. I'm glad they made a character that can just get the items needed to unlock these things. I would also rather a boring character be too good rather than too bad.

[Rio]

Originally posted by Umega:

Originally posted by Sashie:

You'll mostly get hp upgrades, magic fingers, etc. I f you don't learn what the often hard to craft damage ups are.

And if you aren't using any guide at all, why aren't you just playing regular cain? Or issac? Or any character really. Same randomness about, less busywork.

I understand your dislike for ""Cain"". He does seem like he is a lot of alt tabbing to check crafting recipes, but I appreciate him for being a character that is given a lot of option but still needs to work for it. You could also probably look up high quality collectibles to make sure use them in crafting recipes more, but I'm not sure how reliable this would be. I only played ""Cain"" to unlock planetariums because it is really luck driven whether or not you can unlock them. Same with stuff like Bag of Marbles and Huge Growth. I'm glad they made a character that can just get the items needed to unlock these things. I would also rather a boring character be too good rather than too bad.

We unlocked planets with him too. And 4 steam sales in greedier. Then you can make the clicker....

[Umega]

Originally posted by Sashie:

Originally posted by Umega:

I understand your dislike for ""Cain"". He does seem like he is a lot of alt tabbing to check crafting recipes, but I appreciate him for being a character that is given a lot of option but still needs to work for it. You could also probably look up high quality collectibles to make sure use them in crafting recipes more, but I'm not sure how reliable this would be. I only played ""Cain"" to unlock planetariums because it is really luck driven whether or not you can unlock them. Same with stuff like Bag of Marbles and Huge Growth. I'm glad they made a character that can just get the items needed to unlock these things. I would also rather a boring character be too good rather than too bad.

We unlocked planets with him too. And 4 steam sales in greedier. Then you can make the clicker....

That is very valid, and that is a good point, and I don't like to encourage this kind of thinking, but I want to ask a question. Literally who cares about Greedier mode? The mode feels like it is supposed to be broken for the most part. I guess this strategy could work in normal play too maybe but with the nerf to restock I am not sure how far you will go without reroll machines.

[HeraldOfOpera]

Originally posted by Umega:

Originally posted by Sashie:

We unlocked planets with him too. And 4 steam sales in greedier. Then you can make the clicker....

That is very valid, and that is a good point, and I don't like to encourage this kind of thinking, but I want to ask a question. Literally who cares about Greedier mode? The mode feels like it is supposed to be broken for the most part. I guess this strategy could work in normal play too maybe but with the nerf to restock I am not sure how far you will go without reroll machines.

Literally the majority of non-coop-baby Hard Mode unlocks are actually Greedier mode unlocks, by a wide margin. (There are literally two that aren't, three if you count unlocking Godhead before downloading AB+ to make Greedier part of its requirements).

[Umega]

Originally posted by HeraldOfOpera:

Originally posted by Umega:

That is very valid, and that is a good point, and I don't like to encourage this kind of thinking, but I want to ask a question. Literally who cares about Greedier mode? The mode feels like it is supposed to be broken for the most part. I guess this strategy could work in normal play too maybe but with the nerf to restock I am not sure how far you will go without reroll machines.

Literally the majority of non-coop-baby Hard Mode unlocks are actually Greedier mode unlocks, by a wide margin. (There are literally two that aren't, three if you count unlocking Godhead before downloading AB+ to make Greedier part of its requirements).

Yeah I know Greedier mode has a lot of cool unlocks. I wasn't saying "Who plays Greedier mode?" I was more saying "Who cares if you can break Greedier mode easily?" Its a grindy mode where I find the most fun just breaking stuff. There isn't a whole lot of variety and it gets old fast, but you need to play it as every character anyway so might as well try to get it over with as fast as possible. Also, are you just saying unlocks that you need to be in hard mode to get because yeah a lot of them are co-op baby stuff that most people probably won't care about. Pretty sure you still need to do it if you are going for 100%.

[weiss]

i have to fixx something here.

He can only take two hits per room. While this can suck for new players, it does teach you to be more cautious. This over time just makes you a better player as you learn to dodge the enemies. Even the most OP run can be lost if you get careless. For people with hundreds of hours, this keeps things interesting. And until later floors it is not stupidly hard to only take one hit per room (excluding bosses).

1st. he cant even take a hit in a room except you paid the needed amount of cent to the donation mashine. and 2nd. he can only take ONE hit per room given the fact you donated enough because the 2nd hit would kill you (if you dont have other defensive items other then holy mantle)

[Black Snake]

Originally posted by Chiro:

i have to fixx something here.

He can only take two hits per room. While this can suck for new players, it does teach you to be more cautious. This over time just makes you a better player as you learn to dodge the enemies. Even the most OP run can be lost if you get careless. For people with hundreds of hours, this keeps things interesting. And until later floors it is not stupidly hard to only take one hit per room (excluding bosses).

1st. he cant even take a hit in a room except you paid the needed amount of cent to the donation mashine. and 2nd. he can only take ONE hit per room given the fact you donated enough because the 2nd hit would kill you (if you dont have other defensive items other then holy mantle)

I am counting once you donate. I'm comparing him to every other fully unlocked char. Isaac with his d6, maggy with her full health pill, etc.

[Ink]

Hes literally just an OP original The Lost, anyone who did good before Lost got buffed insanely will LOVE Tainted Lost. Yeah its 1 hit, but so wasnt the Lost nearly forever. The fact he gets a way better offensive pool is better than defensive. Chances of you getting Gnawed Leaf+not sissy long legs but something good, is very rare now.