Surviving Black Hawk Down on Netflix

[gmanfly6]

After watching the docuseries on Netflix, this is pretty disappointing. This seems more focused on reenacting the movie rather than the true story. There's so much wrong with the campaign. They filmed in Morocco, the real Bakara market is mostly single story buildings. The progression of events is wrong. Why is there no solo? Idk I wish the devs did a little more research and tried to bring this closer to what actually happened.

[phil762]

theres solo

[Ace]

phil762 původně napsal:

theres solo

Yeah, you just go co-op > start with nobody in the room. You'll get a warning, and then if you say "yes" just make sure you lock in as either medic or support because you're going to need either a bunch of ammo, or a bunch of medkits. Can't really have both though.

Either way, ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS use single shot rifles. Car-15 is probably the best gun to take for any character except for the sniper, and you'll be begging for an acog the entire way because they defaulted the CAR-15 zoom to 1X so it's more of a clear sightline than an actual scope.

[Necramonium™]

The docu is also kinda disappointing, they mainly focused on "Americans bad!" and made it seems like General Adid was some kind of freedom fight, but he was nothing but a war lord that murdered and starved 1.5 million people to death. Even the Somali soldiers they interviewed made it seem like they won.

[Ace]

Necramonium™ původně napsal:

The docu is also kinda disappointing, they mainly focused on "Americans bad!" and made it seems like General Adid was some kind of freedom fight, but he was nothing but a war lord that murdered and starved 1.5 million people to death. Even the Somali soldiers they interviewed made it seem like they won.

That's because in a way, they did win.

Google "Somalia Syndrome". Because of the bad PR of losing what was effectively a handful of men (compared to hundreds of Somalians), America went "WAR BAD!" and the western forces more or less pulled back and out because losing 18 people was enough to make people freak out. According to most sources, we lost 18 men and had 80+ wounded, whereas they lost between 300 and 700, with some stating the number of killed was lower but that there were more wounded. Numbers are fuzzy on that side because of politics.

[Necramonium™]

Ace původně napsal:

Necramonium™ původně napsal:

The docu is also kinda disappointing, they mainly focused on "Americans bad!" and made it seems like General Adid was some kind of freedom fight, but he was nothing but a war lord that murdered and starved 1.5 million people to death. Even the Somali soldiers they interviewed made it seem like they won.

That's because in a way, they did win.

Google "Somalia Syndrome". Because of the bad PR of losing what was effectively a handful of men compared to hundreds of Somalians, America went "WAR BAD!" and the western forces more or less pulled back and out.

not if you look at the casualties and losses statistics. But even if the US lost, the Somali's lost anyway with their country still in war up to today.

[Gonzo850]

Necramonium™ původně napsal:

not if you look at the casualties and losses statistics. But even if the US lost, the Somali's lost anyway with their country still in war up to today.

The operation was a failure. Most operations that have a movie based on them are a failure in some way. When an operation goes as planned, civilians usually don't know a thing about it. It gets mentioned in the news and everybody forgets about it.

[Ace]

Necramonium™ původně napsal:

Ace původně napsal:

That's because in a way, they did win.

Google "Somalia Syndrome". Because of the bad PR of losing what was effectively a handful of men compared to hundreds of Somalians, America went "WAR BAD!" and the western forces more or less pulled back and out.

not if you look at the casualties and losses statistics. But even if the US lost, the Somali's lost anyway with their country still in war up to today.

Right, but "winning a battle" (In terms of numbers) does not win the war.

If the entire country is losing it's mind over 18 soldiers dead, enough to make the west back out? Then yeah, to the Somali people, that was a "win". They've even stated that they felt like it was a win, despite their numerical loses.

Because sadly, throwing people at a problem until it goes away is kind of how most countries operate. America is really no different, I mean just look at D-day. We pretty much fed men into a meatgrinder until it clogged up. When you've got little in the way of technology to create a buffer, then losses like that become "Acceptable" if it makes the problem "go away."

Despite how you might feel about the outcome, to the Somali people "The threat was repelled." because that's how they felt about Americans on their soil, with (admittedly) good reason after some of the raids we preformed.

It was a hugely scuffed situation all around, and both sides did things they REALLY shouldn't have (Murdering ~80~ people in cold blood because they MIGHT have ties to something bigger ((Americans)) or dragging the dead Americans through the streets ((Somali)). Or even shooting crowds of Civilians who were protesting ((UNOSOM)).)

But from a political standpoint, we played chicken, and at the first sight of blood, we backed down. That, to most people, is a "win". It's not necessarily about "I killed X of you, you only killed Y of me, I win."

It's not Team Deathmatch rules. There's a lot more to war than just numerics.

Not to mention the whole reason the army was there was supposed to be for "Humanitarian aid"....That TOTALLY worked out.

[gmanfly6]

Ace původně napsal:

phil762 původně napsal:

theres solo

Yeah, you just go co-op > start with nobody in the room. You'll get a warning, and then if you say "yes" just make sure you lock in as either medic or support because you're going to need either a bunch of ammo, or a bunch of medkits. Can't really have both though.

Either way, ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS use single shot rifles. Car-15 is probably the best gun to take for any character except for the sniper, and you'll be begging for an acog the entire way because they defaulted the CAR-15 zoom to 1X so it's more of a clear sightline than an actual scope.

The ACOG wasn't issued yet in 1993. Even the picatinny rail on the carrying handle is anachronistic. It was developed after Black Hawk Down. So was the Aimpoint Comp M2, but that's what they used for the film. Regardless, it should be closer to 4 MOA instead of 2 MOA and is correctly non-magnified.

If they wanted to for max realism they would have went with Aimpoint 3000s or Aimpoint 5000s atop a Colt 723 with the A1 style carrying handle. The movie featured 727s / XM4s though. Which were also around but period photos seem to show Delta using the 723 more.

[gmanfly6]

phil762 původně napsal:

theres solo

Yeah with an excessive number of bad guys and zero help from AI teammates. You're at a markedly disadvantage.

[gmanfly6]

Necramonium™ původně napsal:

The docu is also kinda disappointing, they mainly focused on "Americans bad!" and made it seems like General Adid was some kind of freedom fight, but he was nothing but a war lord that murdered and starved 1.5 million people to death. Even the Somali soldiers they interviewed made it seem like they won.

I actually appreciated the Somali perspective. The Abdi house bombing seems to be what turned the populace against the U.S.

Not really depicted in the movie nor the 2003 game, but a critical element to the story.