Reaper Entering tne inner Region - Danse Macarbe ending

[GrimGuvna]

As per the topic title, occured in a game last night.

I drew Danse Macarbe as a hidden ending and was able to send The Reaper to another player who was also in the inner region.

Appareently this is not possible as per the Reaper rules about being unable to enter the inner region.

This rule was discussed and resolved by velhart in the FFG forums from a confirmation from john Goonenough.

[Puppy Cat Underfoot]

I think in order to make this ending work, the Reaper's rules need to be bent. Otherwise if there is more than one player in the Inner Region, you'd have un-eliminatable players.

[caboos15]

The danse macabre card says "if a character is on the crown of command and no other characters are present, he must send the grim reaper to visit any character in any region"

Best way to look at it is when you roll a 5 with the reaper you are just telling the reaper where to go. When you are on the crown of command you have the power to actually move the reaper to where you want him to be which includes the inner region.
Hope this helps :)

[ToothlessNightFury]

According to the normal rules for the Reaper he cannot enter the Inner Region. However when using the Danse Macabre Ending, you follow the rules on the Ending card and disregard the normal rules for the Reaper (In any instance where a special ability or effect is at a variance with the basic rules, the special ability or effect always overrides the rules). So when a character is alone on the Crown, he can send the Reaper to a player in any Region, including the Inner Region as stated on the Danse Macabre Ending!

[ToothlessNightFury]

Originally posted by Artaterxes:

Then we should send the Reaper to the Inner Region on a roll of 5 as well, regardless of ending.

No. This is not stated on the Danse Macabre Ending!

[Artaterxes]

Just ignore me. Danse Macabre says "any" Region. I didn't see that word. Deleting above posts..

[GrimGuvna]

Originally posted by talismanamsilat:

According to the normal rules for the Reaper he cannot enter the Inner Region. However when using the Danse Macabre Ending, you follow the rules on the Ending card and disregard the normal rules for the Reaper (In any instance where a special ability or effect is at a variance with the basic rules, the special ability or effect always overrides the rules). So when a character is alone on the Crown, he can send the Reaper to a player in any Region, including the Inner Region as stated on the Danse Macabre Ending!

Personally I agree with he idea that ol repo man should go into the inner region from the Danse macarbe ending, It would have been impossible for me to win otherwise as I also held all the talismans in the game and the other player could have just hung around in the inner region going back and forth.

However, we also now have to consider the "Can vs Cannot" perspective which is on the same page of the main Talisman rules as the paragraph about special abilities overiding the basic rules. So which one trumps the other:

The fact that The Danse Macarbe Ending can overide the can vs Cannot aspect of the grim Reaper entering the Inner Region OR

The fact that the Reaper CANNOT enter the inner region being more absolute than the fact that the Danse Macarbe insinuates that the Reaper Can.

*wibble*

[sanityismyvanity]

The first line of Can vs. Cannot answers your question:

"In any instance where a card’s effect indicates that a character cannot perform an action or use an ability (such as casting a Spell or using an Object), the character cannot do so."

The key being that Can vs. Cannot only affects Cards, not Rules. Since the movement limitation imposed on the Grim Reaper forbidding him from crossing the Portal of Power is in the Rules, Can vs. Cannot does not apply. Special Ability vs. Rules does, of course.

[GrimGuvna]

Bang on!

Well spotted :)

[GrimGuvna]

Apologies to Mr Goodenough if he read this noticed that I accidentedly spelt his name in my initial post as John Goonenough.

Doh! :)

[ToothlessNightFury]

He's a Goonie!

[Bahzur]

If anyone knows the trading card game Magic, its the same:
The rules apply, until the text on a card says otherwise.

[Luke]

Just had this same situation come up last night. I should have jotted down the details, because I don't remember perfectly clearly... but I seem to remember that the Reaper was able to be sent after characters in the Inner Region (but not the one on the crown) when someone rolled a 5.

This shouldn't be, should it? Even if the Danse Macabre ending over-rides the exisitng 'no reaper in the inner region' rule, it shouldn't apply on the roll of 5.

I might have remembered incorrectly... Can anyone verify or contradict?

[Puppy Cat Underfoot]

If it's not the person on the crown, then you're right, they shouldn't be able to send the Reaper to the Inner Region. Only the character on the crown is allowed to do that.