Ew generative AI🤢

[Dielen]

(tldr at the bottom, this is a big post)

I've played the demo for a bit to see how was the character creator (is not bad, but it needs some polish and maybe a strong modding comunity once it comes out) The problem is that, in order to personalize your clothes beyond changing the colors, there's only two options: either you upload your own texture (which is actually a nice option since it will allow for some really unique designs) or generative AI...

First of all, in order for the AI to work it needs to be fed thousands of designs (i say designs because is what this one is used for) with their respective data for it to mix and match them to "create" (it doesn't create sh*t, but whatever) an image based on the description given by the user. In an ideal world, the designs would have been bought from different artists at a rather high price (since you have to take into account not only the time and materials spent by the artist to create the piece, but the rights of not only that image but also whatever is created using that one as a component, since it's using the original artist's intelectual property) and also give them the credit for creating the originals, however at that point is easier and cheaper to hire one or two designers to create a few alternative patterns for each piece of clothing (which will always look better than the generated ones by a mile btw) However, if we look at how other similar programs have obtained their data, what probably happened is that the developers fed the AI data from google without the original artist knowledge, yet alone a fair pay. Which means that KRAFTON (a big company, although this wouldn't be ok even if this game was created by one person in their free time ) is using and benefiting (since the full game won't be free) from stolen artworks.

Secondly, the AI adds a lot of weight to an already heavy game, since it has not only the program but also the database for it to do it's work(that, or it forces you to be always online to recieve the data from the server, which is also stupid) This extra space needed becomes even worse when your computer doesn't have the extra specs to run this feature (I decided to try it to test it but my 2020 laptop doesn't have the hardware to make it work, for example), which makes it dead weight the moment you don't have an ultra high end computer (and judging by other posts, those might not be enough either)

I don't expect any kind of change, since companies tend to ignore integrity for a chance of more benefits and it looks like it's going to be a hit anyways. But I believe having a few default patterns alongside the opportunity of adding our own would have been a much wiser choice. I will not buy this game, and hopefully other people will see this post and not buy it either.

T.L.D.R: This game uses generative AI to create patterns in the character creator, which is bad because it steals the work of thousands of artists and also bloats the game with something that people can't even use if their computer isn't super potent (or just won't use). Having a few alternative designs would habe been better. Don't waste your money in this game

[Ace]

As much as I am absolutely against AI, you'd be surprise how long AI has existed in video games, even as long as early 2000s. In this sense, it's only using photos that THEY own or are free for use to generate unique patterns. therefore everything generated uses mechanics and features that are in the game. it can't just take random photos off the internet archives because that'd be a giant lawsuit for them. it's also not going to be available to a lot of people because you have to have certain specs in your computer build for it to work. my partner's computer is a completely customized gaming and streaming computer and I can't even use it because some of his specs aren't compatible.

[Willow]

I love the ai feature. It's super fun to come up with designs. AI is the future, so people need to get used to the idea.

[Jay]

omg, get over it

[Maddy]

You do good, look the last few posts, these people are already defeding something it's not even out yet. This community will be toxic as hell just you wait.
(Also, ♥♥♥♥ AI, these AIs are just theft)

[ADMNtek]

if you don't like it don't use it simple as that.

[ArchangelQ_Q]

womp womp

[MEandKD]

Artists have been "stealing" from other artists forever.
AI using reference data from an artists portfolio is no different than a person using reference photos to learn, copy, or even trace.
There will still be a place for Original artists, AI is just the next tool in a long line of tools that artists have been given to create from the beginning of time.

[GorishiDan]

Originally posted by MEandKD:

Artists have been "stealing" from other artists forever.
AI using reference data from an artists portfolio is no different than a person using reference photos to learn, copy, or even trace.
There will still be a place for Original artists, AI is just the next tool in a long line of tools that artists have been given to create from the beginning of time.

It's fine when humans with "soul" and "emotions" steal for referencing but when AI does it people lose their marbles cuz machine bad

[Serqonion]

Saying AI is stolen artwork is calling every single artist in the world who references another artist in their own work thieves. It's called inspiration. AI just doesn't have "emotion" like inspiration, but it's exactly the same thing.

[MUXTER]

You can upload your own textures locally, if you blind why bother to play this game?

[Eddie Dexx]

lol, just stop playing games if you're so against AI. The very backbone of games is AI. How stupid can one be? Besides, for generative AI, it's been there since the 80's. What is known as procedural generation, the earliest form av generative AI.

But it is so typical people with absolute ZERO knowledge in computer science, and who thinks Terminator and Matrix are reality, always panicking about this. These are pure fiction.

[The Seraph of Tomorrow]

Gotta love these posts, am I right?

"the designs would have been bought from different artists at a rather high price"

You know why the price is rather high? You can ask Walt Disney the same thing. Once blood is in the water that a business is commissioning for a project the people jack their rates up no differently than when contractors bid for government money. Something that normally goes for 400$ now becomes 2k or 3k once they learn you are commissioning for a business.

While if you can afford to have staff of artists full time for a project that is great, but not every business can afford that so they have to commission or contract hire artists. So sometimes you will end up dealing with some very scummy people and hope that you might get lucky that a few of them are decent to work with. Yea, and you might say for every commissioner who has been burned so has an artist. Which is why A.I. programs became popular, so companies can pay artists for the content they want and not have to deal with the head ache for the filler content that would cost an absurd amount otherwise which can be done with A.I.

This is the same trite garbage that falls out of the mouths of anyone when innovation threatens the existing system. Instead of becoming better or learning new tools, they'd rather things remain the same. Luddites is too kind of a term.

Don't get me wrong, I get it for artists who used a site (not reading the ToS) which basically allowed the platform to sell their data without offering payment beyond use of their distribution platform and all of its services that help the artist get noticed. Though in any other market if you sign a dotted line without reading the terms it is on you to take it to court, and it is on you to solve the problem for yourself. Not to morally grand stand about a choice that people are making fully aware of the consequences.

Now why am I so passionate in my response? Because I can see things from both sides instead of being a self-righteous fool. I know artists who do not put their work on certain platforms because it means their work will be used in A.I. programs. Thus keep a private portfolio, or for a few of the professionals they do not care because their work is in high demand so their career is not threatened by these programs. Heck, people are starting careers editing or improving on A.I. designs because instead of being artists they can sell their skills as editors due to this new A.I. market.

It is just how technology evolves.

I don't use A.I. in my company project only because the legal grounds are still a bit less stable than I would like, so I will wait until the technology is a bit older (more normalized). I still commission and contract who I can, and you could not begin to imagine how frustrating of an experience it is being on the other side. Try running or starting a business, it is not as easy as you think.

Heck, imagine having to spend every day dealing with people and the only way you can know if someone is good or scum is through trial and error. Anyone can tell you, when dealing with people you are looking for a needle in a haystack and there is a hell of a lot of hay to sort through.

Also lets be real, the people who cry the loudest are not pushing out work that competes in the professional market. Most of them are opportunists hoping they can get some sort of payout, despite using platforms (that is not free, as it is a business) under the conditions they have agreed too. The other half of the people who complain are just self righteous and get offended on other peoples behalf because it's a way of virtue signaling.

[fallenj]

I stopped half way through that post, really long. AI art is the new medium, get used to it, its not going to go away. It changes the base image to the point where it shouldn't look like the original, its not plagiarizing anything. Not only that but, actual artists, will use AI art, real photos, or whatever. As reference, change the photo to look like line art to use in backgrounds so on.

One of the CK3 artists show cased how he used ai art and painted over it / used it as a reference (been a while don't remember which one).

If you read the rules though for this company, anything that is made in the game including stuff submitted becomes property of the company and can be reused or subject to ai learning.

The ai part of the game is in the character creator, not the actual game. So i can imagine the ai creates a jpeg or png file of the texture and the game uses that. Guessing the file would be stored on your computer but it could be a cloud system...maybe.

[Aeroprincess87]

Originally posted by Maddy:

You do good, look the last few posts, these people are already defeding something it's not even out yet. This community will be toxic as hell just you wait.
(Also, ♥♥♥♥ AI, these AIs are just theft)

Yep, the stans of Krafton are no different than the ones who constantly defend EA's shady business practices. Probably the same people. They just moved from one game to another. Another reason to avoid this game and company like the plague.

[Ēarendel]

Generative AI is the future. It will make replay and content value infinite for a dime on a dollar.