THRONE AND LIBERTY

THRONE AND LIBERTY

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What the hell is wrong with this game...
So lets start at the basics...

Character creation with no ass or booba slider? Ehm, then it should not be called a character creation but face creation if I cant fully customize the body aswell cuz I hate to play as a stereotypical american big booba female...

Saving characters and using picture for face creation doesnt work (atleast it doesnt work for me)...

Controls feel weird... In games like FF14 and WoW I can move and cast spells like nothing and there are clear indicators for spells that need you to stand still but here it feels laggy AF... When I cast the fireball spell, my character staggers and then starts to move instead of cancelling the spell immediately and there is like 500 to 1000 ms delay in between the game recognizez that I actually want to move instead of casting. Dodge and block on the same button is the worst choice I have ever seen in a videogame... I want to block while moving so my character gets staggered yet again and then dashes in the direction my camera is facing instead of dashing where I want to dash... But what if I need to block instead of that? I need to actually stand still for 1 second in order to have the block recognized... Jumping off of a cliff often summons my wolf instead of an eagle which makes me fall to death or take fall damage. Fall damage is way too big and it doesnt take much to take fall damage and make you 10 HP. No sprint mechanic, just morphs which is a VERY BAD gameplay design. multiple tabs in multiple places that do multiple things... Crafting, enhancing, skills and all these common things should be put next to each other, not into their different tabs. Map and Quests feel so weird that I often feel lost and have no clue where to go and description is often so vague that IDK what to do and I can click as much as I want but the quest often doesnt even show on the map nor put an indicator on my map so I have no clue where to go and have to run around and hopefully I stumble across an enemy I have to kill. Skill cooldowns and followups are just bad overall. It doesnt take much effort to playtest every class to figure it out that you need to have atleast 1 simple combo of skills at the start in order to make gameplay feel smooth. No option for active combat... Its 2024 and they made an MMORPG like if it was 2005 again... Nobody is interested in hotbar spam, we need an MMORPG that is more like Nier Automata, Elden Ring or BDO... Not a brainless hotbar spam...

Story, I watched half of the first cut scene and since then I just skip cuz its boring... Why even bother making a story when its this bad?

Loads and loads of server lag... I often find myself running and then rubber banding 10 meters back which has never happened to me in BDO, FF14 or WoW ever and I was playing on servers with 200+ ping and no issues what so ever but in this game, even on low ping its rubberbanding like crazy.

No honor amongst teammates... Killstealers everywhere so I often go to do world event and find myself in a pickle cuz I see kids that already have lvl 50 characters and aggro 10+ enemies on them and none are left in the area after that...

Unreal engine 4 instead of Unreal engine 5... Like for real? They opted out for an engine from 2014... Which is a decade old engine and in the end the game looks like BDO (except hair, they look better in UE4 thanks to Nvidia)... So no Raytracing, No DLSS 3.5, no path tracing, no ray reconstruction, poorly optimized frame generation that actually hurts performance... Like sorry but why did they bother implementing UE 5.4 features into UE4???

Highest details and the game already looks dated AF thanks to being ran in UE4 and the render distance of players/enemies is comically low...

180 FPS with all on highest preset but in city or during dungeons or events, I barely get to 40 FPS... So once again, poor optimization due to VERY dated engine...


So at this point I think they should have delay the game for a year or two, port it into UE 5.4 and do open beta testing once every 3 months for a week to gather complaints and issues and tune the game before official release, then wipe all accounts and make everyone play a new character and those whom participated in one or more beta tests could be rewarded for help with development with in game goodies like premium currency to afford 1 or 2 full sets of skins and such... I cant really rate the game properly due to my anger about all those issues cuz the game has more cons than pros but if I should rate it as is, its a solid 3/10... If the mage class was separated into Fire, Ice, Lightning, Earth, Water then it could have been 5/10 but atleast the mage there is "somewhat" decent and despite all them issues, it actually has decent spells, but barely any damage... Also I did noticed, unlike other MMORPG's (except FF14 cuz that thing is banned there) this game has no visual indicator on whom did the most DPS in a dungeon run or in a party which makes build/gear optimization a pain in the ahh... So as of now, 3/10 and I would highly recommended them to shut down the game, refund people and work on it more or leave the game online, fix all of them major problems, removing P2W crap and putting 5 to 10 USD subscription from lvl 20 above so they would actually get more and more and more players that are looking for THE new MMORPG to waste thousands of hours on since WoW is just ancient videogame, FF14 is also very old and BDO is just P2W crap for nolifers...
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Showing 16-29 of 29 comments
とうきょう Oct 6, 2024 @ 10:39pm 
Originally posted by Stockwerk 13:
I thought TL might be fun for a few days until the New World Aeternum launch and inbetween playing the newest GW2 and Diablo 4 expansions... but nah...

Instantly feels like a cheap pay2win korea grinder, just in a very pretty dress.

And i've played enough games of that kind, if i would play a korea MMO again it would be returning to Black Desert cuz BDO beats Throne and Liberty in every aspect.

There are just way better MMOs on the market and in november we all be playing Path OF Exile 2 anyways, so why get into this...

GW2 Janthir Wilds right now
D4 Vessel of Hatred October 8th
New World Aeternum October 15th
Path of Exile 2 November 15th

that is my schedule, TL is not worth it.

Game will be "dead" or only played by pay2win whales in a few month just like Lost Ark anyways.
Yep, true that. The enjoyment I had from BDO cant even be compared to Throne and Liberty... Mainly due to TL being outdated in every single aspect... TL could have been better if it had WoW graphics but active combat cuz in current decade, having active combat is what brings people in... And also P2W is a thing that was a hit of the past that failed and to me it seems like every single gaming company looks at Fortnite and wants to have the same success or just goes for the first 1 - 3 months of initial $$$ drop and cash that in to later abandon the game...

Old engine is not a major issue but being Free to play and pay to win is an issue and despite being pay to win, not having active combat is a huge downside cuz people are not used to hotbar spam anymore and we want skill over spam... I am honestly also thinking about going back to BDO sooner or later, I want to see what Blue Protocol will be like (another severly censored amazon games studios release) but I did play the Japanese version of Blue Protocol and despite it being JP locked, it had more active people that TL has right now... Strange right how an anime MMORPG with semi-active combat system, cute characters and interesting story has more players than TL... Also it was better optimized and actually held 60 FPS in intense combat and densely populated areas....
Crystxl420 Oct 10, 2024 @ 6:31pm 
Everything he said was 100% valid and this entire comment section is bs
Darkrayne Oct 10, 2024 @ 6:36pm 
Originally posted by とうきょう:
So lets start at the basics...

Character creation with no ass or booba slider?

I also stopped reading right there.
とうきょう Oct 11, 2024 @ 9:40am 
Originally posted by Darkrayne:
Originally posted by とうきょう:
So lets start at the basics...

Character creation with no ass or booba slider?

I also stopped reading right there.
Then get a life... Aint my fault that you dont care about character creation in an MMORPG which at its core is about making your own character... Its like if you couldnt put a beard on a male character or long hair on a male character or make male character buffed into oblivion.... Same thing, literally...
Yazdigerd IV Oct 17, 2024 @ 8:30pm 
Originally posted by とうきょう:
Originally posted by Darkrayne:

I also stopped reading right there.
Then get a life... Aint my fault that you dont care about character creation in an MMORPG which at its core is about making your own character... Its like if you couldnt put a beard on a male character or long hair on a male character or make male character buffed into oblivion.... Same thing, literally...

I _sort of_ agree, but we have BDO for that. The fact that even after the devs hacked on the Easy Face Maker, which is a very cool idea, it is still not functioning for me. I've seen it work for streamers, and it looks fun, but the fact that they cannot seem to sort out file access permissions, or whatever else is the issue, for my vanilla M$ PC with modern hardware and Win11, is pretty annoying.
Guyver Oct 18, 2024 @ 2:35am 
Originally posted by EvilHare:
Your topic became invalid when I read the complaint about no rear or boob slider.

Moot
Funny how everyone seems to ignore this comment lol
Originally posted by とうきょう:
in city or during dungeons or events, I barely get to 40 FPS...
City and Dungeons require more CPU usage than GPU. If you're "barely getting 40fps" in those areas, it's your CPU being very dated or not great. Turn down "player count" and "effect quality" to Low.

I get 60fps solid in towns and 6-player dungeons (i5-13600k).

Also in your settings, there's a setting that shows your own skill animations only. Turn this on. It will help with performance on low-end or dated CPUs.
bliznots Oct 18, 2024 @ 3:55am 
Originally posted by Stockwerk 13:
I thought TL might be fun for a few days until the New World Aeternum launch and inbetween playing the newest GW2 and Diablo 4 expansions... but nah...

Instantly feels like a cheap pay2win korea grinder, just in a very pretty dress.

And i've played enough games of that kind, if i would play a korea MMO again it would be returning to Black Desert cuz BDO beats Throne and Liberty in every aspect.

There are just way better MMOs on the market and in november we all be playing Path OF Exile 2 anyways, so why get into this...

GW2 Janthir Wilds right now
D4 Vessel of Hatred October 8th
New World Aeternum October 15th
Path of Exile 2 November 15th

that is my schedule, TL is not worth it.

Game will be "dead" or only played by pay2win whales in a few month just like Lost Ark anyways.
What about booba and ass sliders?
thalx Oct 18, 2024 @ 4:25am 
You seem to have no idea how long such a project takes and how much effort is involved. And you also don't seem to do any research before you make a claim. Everything you write is nonsense, but I'll pick out two things.

Originally posted by とうきょう:
...
Unreal engine 4 instead of Unreal engine 5... Like for real? They opted out for an engine from 2014... Which is a decade old engine and in the end the game looks like BDO (except hair, they look better in UE4 thanks to Nvidia)... So no Raytracing, No DLSS 3.5, no path tracing, no ray reconstruction, poorly optimized frame generation that actually hurts performance... Like sorry but why did they bother implementing UE 5.4 features into UE4???
The game has been in development since around 2011, I think there was a first beta around 2014 and a redesign in 2017. The choice back then wasn't an “outdated” engine, but the most modern one at the time. In an ongoing project, no engine change is carried out unless there are compelling technical or financial reasons.

Originally posted by とうきょう:
...
poorly optimized frame generation that actually hurts performance... Like sorry but why did they bother implementing UE 5.4 features into UE4???
Frame Generation is not a UE5.4 feature but a feature of NVIDIA and to a limited extent of AMD.



Originally posted by とうきょう:
180 FPS with all on highest preset but in city or during dungeons or events, I barely get to 40 FPS... So once again, poor optimization due to VERY dated engine...
So? I play in 4K, HDR, everything on epic and never had less than 180fps, especially not in the dungeons. In the beta there was a large scale castle siege with thousands of people, even then I had a stable 160. In the cities or in the wilderness, 240 is no problem. Besides, I have settled now with 120 fps as a limit in T&L, otherwise my GPU would burn up power unnecessarily. It's not a shooter after all.
Boink Oct 18, 2024 @ 4:27am 
I am patiently waiting for an MMO to revolutionize the entire industry by adding foot sliders.
とうきょう Oct 18, 2024 @ 10:02am 
Originally posted by thalx:
You seem to have no idea how long such a project takes and how much effort is involved. And you also don't seem to do any research before you make a claim. Everything you write is nonsense, but I'll pick out two things.

Originally posted by とうきょう:
...
Unreal engine 4 instead of Unreal engine 5... Like for real? They opted out for an engine from 2014... Which is a decade old engine and in the end the game looks like BDO (except hair, they look better in UE4 thanks to Nvidia)... So no Raytracing, No DLSS 3.5, no path tracing, no ray reconstruction, poorly optimized frame generation that actually hurts performance... Like sorry but why did they bother implementing UE 5.4 features into UE4???
The game has been in development since around 2011, I think there was a first beta around 2014 and a redesign in 2017. The choice back then wasn't an “outdated” engine, but the most modern one at the time. In an ongoing project, no engine change is carried out unless there are compelling technical or financial reasons.

Originally posted by とうきょう:
...
poorly optimized frame generation that actually hurts performance... Like sorry but why did they bother implementing UE 5.4 features into UE4???
Frame Generation is not a UE5.4 feature but a feature of NVIDIA and to a limited extent of AMD.



Originally posted by とうきょう:
180 FPS with all on highest preset but in city or during dungeons or events, I barely get to 40 FPS... So once again, poor optimization due to VERY dated engine...
So? I play in 4K, HDR, everything on epic and never had less than 180fps, especially not in the dungeons. In the beta there was a large scale castle siege with thousands of people, even then I had a stable 160. In the cities or in the wilderness, 240 is no problem. Besides, I have settled now with 120 fps as a limit in T&L, otherwise my GPU would burn up power unnecessarily. It's not a shooter after all.

Except that you have no idea how technology works and how long a game takes to make... But that is understandable cuz you either know how to make games, hence you know that its pretty easy, or you dont know how to make games hence that is why you say "you dont know how long such project can take"... I do know how long, for an MMORPG of this small scale, its about year and a half with limited dev team to 20 people. Frame Generation is indeed UE 5.4 feature by default, the fact that they implemented it into UE 4 (other devs implement it into other games too) but these devs implemented it poorly, then no wonder its the way it is.

The fact that the game was in development in 2011 doesnt change the fact that it was released in 2024, its still out of date, poorly optimized and laggy AF and I dont care what you say, the game might be running at 180 FPS on all low for you at 720p resolution cuz aint no way a game that is as unoptimized as this one can actually run good... I have 4060Ti and 13 gen i5 and I can run Cyberpunk fully maxxed out, DLSS on quality, Frame gen turned on, RTX set on psycho with Path Tracing at 1080p and the game holds stable 60 FPS with minor jumps above 70 but I still cap it at 60 to ensure more stable FPS... So that being said, unless you are running dual RTX 4090 and 14th gen i9, all watercooled and overclocked to oblivion, you aint getting nowhere near those FPS.

Also, what you need to realize is that more FPS doesnt mean higher GPU usage xD more FPS means higher CPU usage... But sure, you seem to know nothing about technology, you think that FPS are tied to GPU which is false (to some extent they are, but GPU will render desired frames regardless, its up to the CPU to take the frames, so if your CPU is bad and GPU is overpowered, the GPU will barely work. As in my case, I get balanced output at about 80% usage on both CPU and GPU in 98% of games that I play with few exceptions like Cyberpunk that has them run at 100% or Overwatch that has GPU run at 30%). So what you need to realize, tech influencers talk crap about computers for the most part and just try to influence you into thinking what is right (hence why they are called influencers) but you also need to realize that they are paid, like LTT for example is paid by AMD currently and a few other sponsors, but mostly AMD so that is why you often hear then saying how good AMD is and whatnot (which we all know it aint)...

So please, dont lie about your frames cuz nobody cares. Literally everyone I talked to with normal gaming rig had issues with this game and I did talk to people that had 13th gen i9 and RTX 4080 and such, same issue... Massive frame drops all across the board and nothing was stable...

And back to the game, if you start making a game, there should be a deadline cuz your game can become irrelevant before it gets released and here we have a prime example of such a thing. 2011 game released in 2024 running on 2014 game engine where barely 2024 tech can keep the game at stable FPS (10 ish frame drops are fine, if your game drops 10+ frames or even 50+ framed and in most cases for this game even 100 frames at certain situations, it is poorly optimized). Sooo that being said, the game should have been released in between 2012 to 2014, they came to the market a decade too late where people are not looking for a nicer looking WoW clone (in gameplay stile with that hotbar spam) but instead we are looking for something new... Imagine if WoW was released and it followed the same path as RuneScape.... Can you imagine how angry people would become if it came out like that? Nah, you cant cuz you are the type of person that doesnt care how game came out and you just have to defend it...

So Imma wrap this up here... The graphics look "fine" and the game is "fine" but the gameplay mechanics are 2 decades out of date, massive FPS drops are also bad, censorship is even worse and the fact that its called an MMORPG but you cant fully modify your characters body (ass/booba sliders on female body are basically the same thing as beards/muscles on male body, imagine if that was also removed due to censorship) and then you turn around and you can barely do anything cuz queue for the dungeon you want to run is over an hour long and still no tank or support.... Guilds are overly racist for the most part (atleast on US servers), game is dead on asian servers and EU servers are something in between dead and barely running... I really wanted to like this game, I really did, but sadly I cant and I wont... Time to throw this behind me and keep waiting for something really new.
Frost Oct 18, 2024 @ 10:09am 
Originally posted by EvilHare:
Your topic became invalid when I read the complaint about no rear or boob slider.

Moot
It was actually the only real justified complaint, the rest was nonsense
Frost Oct 18, 2024 @ 10:11am 
Originally posted by Stockwerk 13:
I thought TL might be fun for a few days until the New World Aeternum launch and inbetween playing the newest GW2 and Diablo 4 expansions... but nah...

Instantly feels like a cheap pay2win korea grinder, just in a very pretty dress.

And i've played enough games of that kind, if i would play a korea MMO again it would be returning to Black Desert cuz BDO beats Throne and Liberty in every aspect.

There are just way better MMOs on the market and in november we all be playing Path OF Exile 2 anyways, so why get into this...

GW2 Janthir Wilds right now
D4 Vessel of Hatred October 8th
New World Aeternum October 15th
Path of Exile 2 November 15th

that is my schedule, TL is not worth it.

Game will be "dead" or only played by pay2win whales in a few month just like Lost Ark anyways.
The only thing worth playing in that list is PoE2. You can't be serious about New World and D4.
GW2 is great but it's like 10 years old
とうきょう Oct 18, 2024 @ 10:22am 
Originally posted by Frost:
Originally posted by Stockwerk 13:
I thought TL might be fun for a few days until the New World Aeternum launch and inbetween playing the newest GW2 and Diablo 4 expansions... but nah...

Instantly feels like a cheap pay2win korea grinder, just in a very pretty dress.

And i've played enough games of that kind, if i would play a korea MMO again it would be returning to Black Desert cuz BDO beats Throne and Liberty in every aspect.

There are just way better MMOs on the market and in november we all be playing Path OF Exile 2 anyways, so why get into this...

GW2 Janthir Wilds right now
D4 Vessel of Hatred October 8th
New World Aeternum October 15th
Path of Exile 2 November 15th

that is my schedule, TL is not worth it.

Game will be "dead" or only played by pay2win whales in a few month just like Lost Ark anyways.
The only thing worth playing in that list is PoE2. You can't be serious about New World and D4.
GW2 is great but it's like 10 years old
Well, if you wanna socialize, have fun, find friends and play the game, WoW and FF14 are the way (for me atleast). I might give PoE2 a shot but its not really my style cuz I was never into games that were similar to Diablo. And NGL, but I have never played GW2.
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Date Posted: Oct 6, 2024 @ 6:55am
Posts: 29