Why Free-to-Play Players Struggle in Throne and Liberty(250+ hours)

[jijigakuri]

After completing daily co-op dungeons in just 30 minutes, I feel that no other event offers worthwhile rewards. Even after the reward update patch, it’s still not enough. I've attended nearly all the world boss events, but I’ve only received a purple item once. The Sauroma night event is dominated by whale zerg players, making it nearly impossible to farm any chests there. At some point, you hit a wall, and it feels like you need to invest at least $100 just to meet the bar for a good build.

Some players have gotten lucky, earning good gear and selling it for a significant amount of lucent, but it's as rare as winning the lottery. Every PvP event is controlled by one large guild, leaving no content for smaller guilds. I check the player count every day, and it’s easy to see why people are leaving. Pay-to-win players progress rapidly, while free-to-play players struggle to catch up, unable to grind due to restrictions.

For free-to-play players, Throne and Liberty becomes boring over time because the game doesn’t reward them in any meaningful way. The imbalance between pay-to-win and free-to-play players makes progression frustrating, limiting the overall enjoyment and engagement for non-paying players.

[jijigakuri]

Originally posted by Skillo:

Originally posted by jijigakuri:

If you don't see the difference between F2P and P2W, you're just delusional. While P2W players are already above 3200 gear score — and not just a regular 3200, but with the most optimal build for their weapon combination and maxed traits — F2P players are still trying to get their fourth or fifth item from the optimal build. They also need to get the best traits for these items. And I'm not even talking about F2P players who got lucky and hit the jackpot.

You need at least 15,000 Lucent to get a decent build, and if you want a top-tier build, you'll need at least 30,000 Lucent. Most F2P players will never be able to accumulate that much. Every week, new items are added, so P2W players keep upgrading to better builds while F2P players are held back by countless game restrictions that make it hard to farm what they need.

So if, by "skill difference," you mean being rich in real life is a skill, then I agree with you, kid.

So your point is that f2p can't afford to get max traited on week 3? The same gear that will last all the way to tier 2 release, months away? Think about what you are saying for minute. You want to spend zero cash and afford to skip the progression entirely for free

While P2W players can buy anything in one go, F2P players can't farm to their heart's content. That's exactly what I'm talking about. F2P players are restricted in what they can farm, and most events aren't even worth their time. Take, for example, the Peace Boss, which is a very boring event — 500 players practically insta-kill the boss, and it's less likely for F2P players to get items because they contribute less damage, meaning they have a lower chance of getting rewards.

There are a lot of events, but they're all trivial and boring. It's not fun doing them, and the rewards are so bad that you don't feel like it's worth the effort. And I'm not even against buying items with real money; I also use real money to buy some stuff. But what I'm really against is restricting my ability to grind and adding gacha systems that make it even more of a nightmare to farm what I need.

This game is designed to push you toward becoming P2W by restricting F2P players as much as possible while rewarding P2W players as much as possible. That's all.

[Skillo]

Originally posted by SkFy:

Originally posted by Skillo:

Thats literally the design that everyone expected it to be. it is like that with lost ark, it is like that with Throne. Whales spend money to max out faster and the rest has to follow a linear path towards the same goal. Seems like you were poorly informed before starting playing, or are you implying that the entire game should become something entirely new cause you are unhappy?

Or i expected it to be like any other mmorpg ncsoft made where there is enough to actually do and you're not limited to 3 dungeons a day and 50 mobs in open world dungeons?
Normally i can make up for the diff with hard work, that's impossible if the game doesn't let you farm.

And dont' even feel like responding to people like you tbh ;)
People like you are what's destroying online gaming..
There's no reason for any of these things to exist, except to F over the people playing this game.. if they don't want people to play, they shouldn't be surprised if they leave.

And then act like an elitist a-hole calling everyone who didn't get to play other regions noob or bad, or saying it's a "skill issue"
Most of the people you're s... talking are probably a million times more skilled than the clowns defending p2w.

How about you teach people instead of being an a-hole if you know it all so well?
But nah, all you people can do is call people who didn't have a 6 year degree in throne and liberty gameplay tactics names :D

I guess the right thing to do is mindlessly agree with every complaint and beg devs to shape the game around these same people. The people who will never be happy reagardless and will leave in a month anyway. But yes they are the ones who know better.

Its also funny to talk about teaching people when the majority of posts are people talking about how everything is bad as an absolute truth instead of asking how to improve. And ironically, i often answer the few genuine questions. But since you are too busy checking doomposts you won't see them

[Boink]

Litograph Events
World Bosses (guaranteed Litograph currency)
Abyssals
Abyssal Tokens contracts
Dimension
Litograph Books
Guild World Boss
Mystic orbs

Grinding regular mobs.

If you focus on PvP yes you will struggle hard as free to play.

[SkFy]

Originally posted by Boink:

Litograph Events
World Bosses (guaranteed Litograph currency)
Abyssals
Abyssal Tokens contracts
Dimension
Litograph Books
Guild World Boss
Mystic orbs

Grinding regular mobs.

If you focus on PvP yes you will struggle hard as free to play.

That's literally an hour worth of content.

[SkFy]

Originally posted by Skillo:

Originally posted by SkFy:

Or i expected it to be like any other mmorpg ncsoft made where there is enough to actually do and you're not limited to 3 dungeons a day and 50 mobs in open world dungeons?
Normally i can make up for the diff with hard work, that's impossible if the game doesn't let you farm.

And dont' even feel like responding to people like you tbh ;)
People like you are what's destroying online gaming..
There's no reason for any of these things to exist, except to F over the people playing this game.. if they don't want people to play, they shouldn't be surprised if they leave.

And then act like an elitist a-hole calling everyone who didn't get to play other regions noob or bad, or saying it's a "skill issue"
Most of the people you're s... talking are probably a million times more skilled than the clowns defending p2w.

How about you teach people instead of being an a-hole if you know it all so well?
But nah, all you people can do is call people who didn't have a 6 year degree in throne and liberty gameplay tactics names :D

I guess the right thing to do is mindlessly agree with every complaint and beg devs to shape the game around these same people. The people who will never be happy reagardless and will leave in a month anyway. But yes they are the ones who know better.

Its also funny to talk about teaching people when the majority of posts are people talking about how everything is bad as an absolute truth instead of asking how to improve. And ironically, i often answer the few genuine questions. But since you are too busy checking doomposts you won't see them :SoniiSalute:

Dude i played ncsoft games for years and years..
GW2, about 1 year..
Lineage 2, many years..
Aion, many years..
BNS, many years..
They never had to restrict a game this bad that there was literally nothing to do except an hour worth of content...

And the people saying things are bad, can at least explain WHAT IS BAD.
You can't explain anything, all you can do is pretend like everyone is dumb and doesn't know what to do, but you obviously don't know either or you would tell them..
Tell us about the great content we're just missing and don't know about.
Or the traits we can easily farm which makes us thousands of lucents to catch up with the whales?

You literally just making ... up to not have to admit the blatant p2w and struggles for f2p players.

[jijigakuri]

Originally posted by Skillo:

Originally posted by SkFy:

Or i expected it to be like any other mmorpg ncsoft made where there is enough to actually do and you're not limited to 3 dungeons a day and 50 mobs in open world dungeons?
Normally i can make up for the diff with hard work, that's impossible if the game doesn't let you farm.

And dont' even feel like responding to people like you tbh ;)
People like you are what's destroying online gaming..
There's no reason for any of these things to exist, except to F over the people playing this game.. if they don't want people to play, they shouldn't be surprised if they leave.

And then act like an elitist a-hole calling everyone who didn't get to play other regions noob or bad, or saying it's a "skill issue"
Most of the people you're s... talking are probably a million times more skilled than the clowns defending p2w.

How about you teach people instead of being an a-hole if you know it all so well?
But nah, all you people can do is call people who didn't have a 6 year degree in throne and liberty gameplay tactics names :D

I guess the right thing to do is mindlessly agree with every complaint and beg devs to shape the game around these same people. The people who will never be happy reagardless and will leave in a month anyway. But yes they are the ones who know better.

Its also funny to talk about teaching people when the majority of posts are people talking about how everything is bad as an absolute truth instead of asking how to improve. And ironically, i often answer the few genuine questions. But since you are too busy checking doomposts you won't see them :SoniiSalute:

I never said the game is bad. If it were, I wouldn't have spent over 250 hours on it. I've enjoyed it a lot, but what I'm saying in this discussion is simply the truth. I never asked to restrict P2W players, because sometimes I want to skip things too, and I'm willing to pay since I don't always have much time to play. But when I do have time, I don't want to be restricted in my ability to farm, nor do I want to be stuck with a super gacha system. Every time I kill a co-op boss and open a chest, it feels like I'm in a casino.

What I really want is for them to remove these restrictions and the gacha system so that putting time into the game is as rewarding as spending money.

[Skillo]

Originally posted by SkFy:

Originally posted by Skillo:

I guess the right thing to do is mindlessly agree with every complaint and beg devs to shape the game around these same people. The people who will never be happy reagardless and will leave in a month anyway. But yes they are the ones who know better.

Its also funny to talk about teaching people when the majority of posts are people talking about how everything is bad as an absolute truth instead of asking how to improve. And ironically, i often answer the few genuine questions. But since you are too busy checking doomposts you won't see them

Dude i played ncsoft games for years and years..
GW2, about 1 year..
Lineage 2, many years..
Aion, many years..
BNS, many years..
They never had to restrict a game this bad that there was literally nothing to do except an hour worth of content...

And the people saying things are bad, can at least explain WHAT IS BAD.
You can't explain anything, all you can do is pretend like everyone is dumb and doesn't know what to do, but you obviously don't know either or you would tell them..
Tell us about the great content we're just missing and don't know about.
Or the traits we can easily farm which makes us thousands of lucents to catch up with the whales?

You played a lot of outdated games that don't work anymore, is that supposed to mean something? And i described what exactly anyone can do to see which GUARANTEED rewards are worth lucent. Are you even reading?

"Theres a lot guaranteed rewards in the game. Weekly contracts and abyss coins being one of them. Pity crafting being another.
---
You can literally pricecheck gear from selectors and see which ones are worth good lucent, the process takes less than 5 minutes."

What more do you want my guy, me to log in in your account and play for you?

[Boink]

Originally posted by SkFy:

That's literally an hour worth of content.

I grind regular mobs at night time and during rain... that is not 1 hour worth.

You can keep farming regular mobs or just for solent in Abyssals if you run out of tokes.

There is crafting if you are into that.

[SkFy]

Originally posted by Skillo:

Originally posted by SkFy:

Dude i played ncsoft games for years and years..
GW2, about 1 year..
Lineage 2, many years..
Aion, many years..
BNS, many years..
They never had to restrict a game this bad that there was literally nothing to do except an hour worth of content...

And the people saying things are bad, can at least explain WHAT IS BAD.
You can't explain anything, all you can do is pretend like everyone is dumb and doesn't know what to do, but you obviously don't know either or you would tell them..
Tell us about the great content we're just missing and don't know about.
Or the traits we can easily farm which makes us thousands of lucents to catch up with the whales?

You played a lot of outdated games that don't work anymore, is that supposed to mean something? And i described what exactly anyone can do to see which GUARANTEED rewards are worth lucent, its the second reply of this thread. Are you even reading?

Maybe the games weren't outdated at the time i started playing them?
You really that dense bruh? I'm 36... i been playing games like this for a long time.
And it NEVER been this bad.

And 1 item a week, 1 item each few days... and big chance you won't get a trait that's useful.. so you either can try to sell it as lithograph which isn't wroth much either and takes a lot of mats, or try to sell the trait regardless if it's not worth much..

1 of the items i made with the system, i still needed..
1 item, i got lucky with skill damage boost trait..
And everything else, was just useless...

[p00se2]

Originally posted by SkFy:

Originally posted by Boink:

Litograph Events
World Bosses (guaranteed Litograph currency)
Abyssals
Abyssal Tokens contracts
Dimension
Litograph Books
Guild World Boss
Mystic orbs

Grinding regular mobs.

If you focus on PvP yes you will struggle hard as free to play.

That's literally an hour worth of content.

no worries mate

posting on the forums gonna keep you busy for years to come

[SkFy]

Originally posted by Boink:

Originally posted by SkFy:

That's literally an hour worth of content.

I grind regular mobs at night time and during rain... that is not 1 hour worth.

You can keep farming regular mobs or just for solent in Abyssals if you run out of tokes.

There is crafting if you are into that.

Crafting you need lucent..
Solent is useless.
Farming regular mobs for what? the 0,0001% droprate on items?
Or the contract scrolls 1 each hour, which if you complete it gives 50 tokens which allows 1 open world dungeon mob extra to be killed?:S

And my fishing is lvl 16, cooking 16, gathering 15...
Not like i'm not already doing these things, but it's BORING it's no end game content like you would expect from an ncsoft mmorpg lol.

Even that system is terrible, fishing only catches the same damn fish regardless what rod you use, what bait you use.. the only thing that matters is fresh or salty water.. and each have only a few diff fish..

Other mats you have to farm to cook, the droprates are just sad.

[Skillo]

Originally posted by SkFy:

Originally posted by Skillo:

You played a lot of outdated games that don't work anymore, is that supposed to mean something? And i described what exactly anyone can do to see which GUARANTEED rewards are worth lucent, its the second reply of this thread. Are you even reading?

Maybe the games weren't outdated at the time i started playing them?
You really that dense bruh? I'm 36... i been playing games like this for a long time.
And it NEVER been this bad.

And 1 item a week, 1 item each few days... and big chance you won't get a trait that's useful.. so you either can try to sell it as lithograph which isn't wroth much either and takes a lot of mats, or try to sell the trait regardless if it's not worth much..

1 of the items i made with the system, i still needed..
1 item, i got lucky with skill damage boost trait..
And everything else, was just useless...

You completely ignored the "that don't work anymore" part. If you think that old mmos would still be sustainable to this day i got nothing to tell you.

Shadow harvester gloves are worth a ton of lucent with any trait. Clasp is worth a lot of lucent on any trait, altho i can go from good to insanely good. Dimensional rings are worth a ton of lucent aswell. And no, lithographs do not "cost a lot of resources" unless its weapons. And thats only cause rubrix is expensive, while acessory and armor gems are almost worthless.

It takes epic mats which you earn daily selectors from a level 10 guild, gems that if its not a weapon cost less than 50 lucent, and ink which you can earn weekly from contract shop. Does that sound complicated to the "ive played all ncsoft games" guy?

[jijigakuri]

Originally posted by Skillo:

Originally posted by SkFy:

Maybe the games weren't outdated at the time i started playing them?
You really that dense bruh? I'm 36... i been playing games like this for a long time.
And it NEVER been this bad.

And 1 item a week, 1 item each few days... and big chance you won't get a trait that's useful.. so you either can try to sell it as lithograph which isn't wroth much either and takes a lot of mats, or try to sell the trait regardless if it's not worth much..

1 of the items i made with the system, i still needed..
1 item, i got lucky with skill damage boost trait..
And everything else, was just useless...

You completely ignored the "that don't work anymore" part. If you think that old mmos would still be sustainable to this day i got nothing to tell you.

Shadow harvester gloves are worth a ton of lucent with any trait. Clasp is worth a lot of lucent on any trait, altho i can go from good to insanely good. Dimensional rings are worth a ton of lucent aswell. And no, lithographs do not "cost a lot of resources" unless its weapons. And thats only cause rubrix is expensive, while acessory and armor gems are almost worthless.

It takes epic mats which you earn daily selectors from a level 10 guild, gems that if its not a weapon cost less than 50 lucent, and ink which you can earn weekly from contract shop. Does that sound complicated to the "ive played all ncsoft games" guy?

Kid, I’ve never met anyone who actually liked gacha systems or time restrictions in any game. I don’t even understand what you’re defending so hard—do they pay you for that?
It’s just a marketing tactic to push you into becoming a P2W player, so it’s normal that none of us like it. When we have time to play, it feels really abusive that the game restricts our freedom to grind, all so they can make more money.

Of course, they need to make profit, but there are better ways to do that. Add XP boosters or item drop chance boosters for real money—I'm fine with that. Just let F2P players have the freedom to play how they want without these heavy restrictions. That’s all.

[SkFy]

Originally posted by Skillo:

Originally posted by SkFy:

Maybe the games weren't outdated at the time i started playing them?
You really that dense bruh? I'm 36... i been playing games like this for a long time.
And it NEVER been this bad.

And 1 item a week, 1 item each few days... and big chance you won't get a trait that's useful.. so you either can try to sell it as lithograph which isn't wroth much either and takes a lot of mats, or try to sell the trait regardless if it's not worth much..

1 of the items i made with the system, i still needed..
1 item, i got lucky with skill damage boost trait..
And everything else, was just useless...

You completely ignored the "that don't work anymore" part. If you think that old mmos would still be sustainable to this day i got nothing to tell you.

Shadow harvester gloves are worth a ton of lucent with any trait. Clasp is worth a lot of lucent on any trait, altho i can go from good to insanely good. Dimensional rings are worth a ton of lucent aswell. And no, lithographs do not "cost a lot of resources" unless its weapons. And thats only cause rubrix is expensive, while acessory and armor gems are almost worthless.

It takes epic mats which you earn daily selectors from a level 10 guild, gems that if its not a weapon cost less than 50 lucent, and ink which you can earn weekly from contract shop. Does that sound complicated to the "ive played all ncsoft games" guy?

Yes, old mmorpgs sure do still work.
It's the endless p2w that killed these games, or ncsoft not addressing issues with cheaters for over a year.. not having enough content rofl.. or not being limited.
Nobody asked to be restricted in the games they are playing.. literally NOBODY.

And i don't have a level 10 guild, i don't wanna be forced to play in a guild.
But how you gonna get Shadow harvester gloves then?
They don't even sell lithographs for them, so all you can do is try to farm it in a dungeon, an you probably gotta be focusing on items you need before trying to farm things that are just worth lucent..
Beside that, the drop chance in these dungeons are atrocious all they giving me is 3 blues a day.....
And ofc it has a 3 runs a day limit.

If you use your mats for the petty system, and you get max mana you also still only have 300 lucent and for this you need days of work...

Meanwhile gl hf upgrading your traits with 300lucent..

[p00se2]

Originally posted by SkFy:

Meanwhile gl hf upgrading your traits with 300lucent..

meanwhile you too will be able to sell the same and other traits for the same 300 lucent and more ( and less )




made 2nd char on NA east
7k lucent in 2 days because they whale like mad compared to EU

prior knowledge argument sounds fine and all but its very shallow

doesnt take much to do some research and read the market