god I hate how ollie

[Blazikenowen]

has her passives and all of them have negatives to them undead perm takes max hp each time you die ninjitsu you have to stand still etc and worst part is shes the only character who has this it legitimately makes her the weakest character currently I would say the only time shes good is when her main weapon awakens and thats if you manage to survive until it awakens level 4 was HELL with her and I imagine 2 and 3 would be to

[Rantzas]

Aki's bellydance also requires you to stand still to activate it

[Blazikenowen]

Originally posted by Rantzas:

Aki's bellydance also requires you to stand still to activate it

it activates pretty quickly though from what I remember and even then it doesn't have the even bigger negative of taking a while to set up for it to do its best thing

[DragonGuard]

Ollie does get her max hp back to full after 1min. She gets a significant attack boost if you do trigger Undead to help you survive that one minute. Ninjitsu is just fine. Keep an eye on the ninjitsu bar and release it for a strong attack, especially when full. 1 second isn't long, just don't use when you're super overwhelmed. I beat Stage 4 for first time with Ollie after losing with Moona at about 18min.

Anya literally has a skill that rewards you for standing still while getting swarmed. Which is definitely not what you would normally do in that situation but it's a very potent skill.

It makes sense that the longer it charges the bigger it's effect. I guess those kind of playstyles just aren't for you.

[Big Kusa Time]

Originally posted by Blazikenowen:

Originally posted by Rantzas:

Aki's bellydance also requires you to stand still to activate it

it activates pretty quickly though from what I remember and even then it doesn't have the even bigger negative of taking a while to set up for it to do its best thing

Aki's Bellydance takes WAY longer to build than Ollie's Ninjutsu because it has no cap to its damage. Both Bellydance and Ninjutsu take one second of not moving to trigger, same as Anya's nap.
Ollie's Undead passive reducing your max hp for 30 seconds is not a negative because the passive also increases your atk by a LOT for every point of max hp lost.

[Kitoshi]

My first stage 3 hard clear was with ollie, her tier 4 ninjutsu literally clears the screen like mobs are scrubs.

Her attacks are fine, finding that 1 second you can stand till provides that extra bit of risk vs huge reward. I think ollie is a breath of fresh air as a character where she has a bunch of negatives you can cleverly play around, is it a bit dangerous to do so? Most definitely. Is it a lot of fun? To me personally, hell yeah.

Also ollie moves so fast it's not even very hard to find a safe spot to unleash that screen clearing ninjutsu.

[Blazikenowen]

Originally posted by DragonGuard:

Ollie does get her max hp back to full after 1min. She gets a significant attack boost if you do trigger Undead to help you survive that one minute. Ninjitsu is just fine. Keep an eye on the ninjitsu bar and release it for a strong attack, especially when full. 1 second isn't long, just don't use when you're super overwhelmed. I beat Stage 4 for first time with Ollie after losing with Moona at about 18min.

Anya literally has a skill that rewards you for standing still while getting swarmed. Which is definitely not what you would normally do in that situation but it's a very potent skill.

It makes sense that the longer it charges the bigger it's effect. I guess those kind of playstyles just aren't for you.

I beat level 4 with ollie the issue though with ninjitsu isn't even the charge its that 1 second in most stages now will get you mauled also with undead it doesn't seem to me like you actually do get the max hp back after 2 undeads it ended up where it would of taken 2/3 hits to die luckily I had the watameals to off set it but yea I've played as each character and ollies playstyle isn't the issue its the passives that are for me as I said the negatives for me are the issue especially as its negatives are so heavy compared to the positives I straight up eliminated the simp skill as soon as It popped up and that's how I beat stage 4

[Blazikenowen]

Originally posted by Big Kusa Time:

Originally posted by Blazikenowen:

it activates pretty quickly though from what I remember and even then it doesn't have the even bigger negative of taking a while to set up for it to do its best thing

Aki's Bellydance takes WAY longer to build than Ollie's Ninjutsu because it has no cap to its damage. Both Bellydance and Ninjutsu take one second of not moving to trigger, same as Anya's nap.
Ollie's Undead passive reducing your max hp for 30 seconds is not a negative because the passive also increases your atk by a LOT for every point of max hp lost.

I mean just because a positive has a negative doesn't stop the negative being a negative unless it removes the first negative like ollies lose health regain health get buffed it IS a negative but it gets actually removed because you regain that health you lost

[Hurkyl]

Originally posted by Blazikenowen:

has her passives and all of them have negatives to them undead perm takes max hp each time you die

Not really. "Continue playing with half HP" is a lot better than "game over". It only seems negative when compared to a hypothetical "continue playing with full HP instead".

I guess things are different if your POV on the skill is more "I should intentionally die to get an ATK buff" rather than "This is a great insurance for keeping my runs going".

[Dlanor]

Ollie is one of the strongest characters in the roster. It sounds like you just didn't read her skills.

Undead doesn't permanently take max hp, you gain the max hp back after 1 minute and it's not even a full negative, it converts that HP taken into bonus damage. Undead is unironically one of the strongest skills in the entire game, not only is it free revives but it's free revives that leave you invincible for 10 seconds and considerably boost your damage. Complaining it temporarily reduces max hp? On anyone else your run is over when your HP hits 0. Ollie is one of the best options for Hardcore because she doesn't die instantly if she gets hurt, she only dies is she gets hurt and then gets hurt again exactly 10-20 seconds later.

Ninjitsu making you stop moving for a second isn't a downside, it's a condition. She essentially has a 2nd Special move with 4 different powers. It's a single second, if you find yourself unable to stay safe for 1 second than upgrade your speed (which also makes Ninjitsu bar charge faster) or pic up weapons with knockback like Spider Cooking, Sausage, or Wamy Water so you can get the enemies away from you.

Her bag passive is also really good. It literally cannot kill you, only ping you for nonlethal damage and then heal it back a few seconds later, and the bags give aassive buff to haste and speed which are both important stats. It has great synergy with many things, like Full Meal doubles the heal so that every bag is a big net gain of HP.

Stop this immature mindset of "I don't like this character on day 1 so they are the weakest". Sometimes it's you not understanding that is the problem, and that is the case here.

[Hurkyl]

Originally posted by Totopo:

Stop this immature mindset of "I don't like this character on day 1 so they are the weakest". Sometimes it's you not understanding that is the problem, and that is the case here.

I think it's just actually the trend where some people are extremely averse to picking options with (apparent) negatives, without much regard to how good the positives are.

[Blazikenowen]

Originally posted by Totopo:

Ollie is one of the strongest characters in the roster. It sounds like you just didn't read her skills.

Undead doesn't permanently take max hp, you gain the max hp back after 1 minute and it's not even a full negative, it converts that HP taken into bonus damage. Undead is unironically one of the strongest skills in the entire game, not only is it free revives but it's free revives that leave you invincible for 10 seconds and considerably boost your damage. Complaining it temporarily reduces max hp? On anyone else your run is over when your HP hits 0. Ollie is one of the best options for Hardcore because she doesn't die instantly if she gets hurt, she only dies is she gets hurt and then gets hurt again exactly 10-20 seconds later.

Ninjitsu making you stop moving for a second isn't a downside, it's a condition. She essentially has a 2nd Special move with 4 different powers. It's a single second, if you find yourself unable to stay safe for 1 second than upgrade your speed (which also makes Ninjitsu bar charge faster) or pic up weapons with knockback like Spider Cooking, Sausage, or Wamy Water so you can get the enemies away from you.

Her bag passive is also really good. It literally cannot kill you, only ping you for nonlethal damage and then heal it back a few seconds later, and the bags give aassive buff to haste and speed which are both important stats. It has great synergy with many things, like Full Meal doubles the heal so that every bag is a big net gain of HP.

Stop this immature mindset of "I don't like this character on day 1 so they are the weakest". Sometimes it's you not understanding that is the problem, and that is the case here.

Its literally not even about day 1 I've played holocure since it first came out on itch I've seen goods and bads but the fact is ollie IS the weakest there is no other character with negatives in there passives also I DID read the skills and hell maybe its a bug but at no point for me has ollie regained her max hp and I had to offset it with the watameals

the ninjitsu making you stop IS a downside especially in level 4 maybe not level 1 where you have nothing to stop you gaining alot of distance but in stages where you can't just do that its 100% a downside sure its lightning and rocks are great but the charge isn't the issue to me its the stopping for abit it says for 1 second but feels longer then that and in that 1 second you can be mauled very easily

her simp passive sure it can't kill you by picking up the bags itself but the fact you lose hp is a issue especially with her being so slapped with things that already lower her hp it could easily be fixed but the amount it takes off you is to much sure it heals up all the damage which is in away a fix to the negative but considering how many bags slap down it ends up a issue in closed off areas like level 4

you want to claim its a immature mindset not liking a character day 1 because a person sees them as the weakest (which ollie currently is) but its more immature to have the opinion its an immature view especially when said person with that opinion is giving actual reasons why that character is the weakest also go ahead tell me which is apparently the weakest character currently to you because fact is ollie is the weakest sure if you manage to get her main weapon awakened quickly shes stronger but her start up is the weakest and you have to get lucky for her main weapon to be awakened quickly for her to even become good from the get go every other character at lvl 1 main weapon can easily kill the second wave of enemies in level 4 ollie cannot it takes at least 3/4/5 to do that and thats at full shop buffs at glevel 169 I've beaten level 4 with other characters at alot lower glevel including with korone gura ina sana mumei miko and haachama

[BlastBomb614]

try using Ollie plus hardcore, having one hp makes her abilities act weird. I wasn't trying to get hit but i was basically immortal as i could grab some merch every time i was hit and heal.

[Dlanor]

Originally posted by Blazikenowen:

Its literally not even about day 1 I've played holocure since it first came out on itch I've seen goods and bads but the fact is ollie IS the weakest there is no other character with negatives in there passives also I DID read the skills and hell maybe its a bug but at no point for me has ollie regained her max hp and I had to offset it with the watameals

the ninjitsu making you stop IS a downside especially in level 4 maybe not level 1 where you have nothing to stop you gaining alot of distance but in stages where you can't just do that its 100% a downside sure its lightning and rocks are great but the charge isn't the issue to me its the stopping for abit it says for 1 second but feels longer then that and in that 1 second you can be mauled very easily

her simp passive sure it can't kill you by picking up the bags itself but the fact you lose hp is a issue especially with her being so slapped with things that already lower her hp it could easily be fixed but the amount it takes off you is to much sure it heals up all the damage which is in away a fix to the negative but considering how many bags slap down it ends up a issue in closed off areas like level 4

you want to claim its a immature mindset not liking a character day 1 because a person sees them as the weakest (which ollie currently is) but its more immature to have the opinion its an immature view especially when said person with that opinion is giving actual reasons why that character is the weakest also go ahead tell me which is apparently the weakest character currently to you because fact is ollie is the weakest sure if you manage to get her main weapon awakened quickly shes stronger but her start up is the weakest and you have to get lucky for her main weapon to be awakened quickly for her to even become good from the get go every other character at lvl 1 main weapon can easily kill the second wave of enemies in level 4 ollie cannot it takes at least 3/4/5 to do that and thats at full shop buffs at glevel 169 I've beaten level 4 with other characters at alot lower glevel including with korone gura ina sana mumei miko and haachama

Ollie has only existed in the game for 1 day. You are judging her on day 1, that's a fact.

You just really don't understand how numbers work if you think "+100 -10" is worse than "+50". It's not worse, 90 is a lot bigger than 50. Ollie is not worse than everyone else just because there's a minus sign in her equation, because her end result is stronger and results in more possible situations for synergy.

Ollie wasn't regaining her max HP for you because you didn't read her skills properly and you still don't understand them. You regain if you go a minute without dying again. It's a skill issue, you were not good enough to survive a single minute so you did not get the max HP back.

If you're getting mauled in 1 second of standing still it is also a skill issue or knowledge issue. Follow the advice I already gave you in my last post about this and it will stop happening, I use Ollie's Ninjitsu successfully even on the hardest stage in the game. Make something like Broken Dreams and the enemies that approach you will slow down a lot, or make something like Absolute Wall and it will bounce enemies back. Again it comes back to immaturity, you messed up and instead of saying "I need to learn how to stay safe for 1 second" you blame the game and say "that felt like a lot longer than 1 second". The game has a timer on screen at all times, it's a 1 second effect.

Ollie's bags are not an issue. Stop touching the enemies and they will stop killing you. The bags can give you 50% speed and haste at 100% uptime, if you're getting hit enough to die and then die again it's because you are not dodging correctly or picking upgrades that you shouldn't. You have no excuse to be getting hit constantly with 50% bonus speed built into the character, she is great at dodging.

It's not immature to dislike the character, it's immature to try to make an objective statement (they are the weakest) based on your own lack of understanding and feelings. Balance does not care about your feelings. 90 is bigger than 50. All of your "reasons" you think she is weakest are that you did not read her skills properly or that you misplay a lot. A mature person will say "I lost as Ollie, so maybe I am not good at playing Ollie", an immature person will say "I lost as Ollie, so she must be the weakest". You are allowed to not like playing as Ollie, but it's a roster of 38, you don't need to like every character. You need to admit to yourself that you not liking something does not mean it is the problem, sometimes you are the problem and that is part of life.

[Luna Dialup]

all this talk about passives with downsides just makes me think about how many characters have skills that literally don't do anything at all to enemies that aren't in range.

anyway isn't it kinda craaaazy how seemingly counter-intuitive and chaotic ollie's skills are. i wonder if it has anything to do with what kind of person she is,

[Wanginator]

Are you one of the folks who's been playing for a while already before the Steam release, and if so, did you go straight to the new stage? That might have something to do with it as well. I unlocked Ollie and Reine and went straight to Stage 4 and promptly got stomped. If you want a fair comparison you should probably take her back to Stage 1, or at least one of the earlier stages.