Difference Between Kickstarter Backers and Steam Customers

[Serris]

Some people are suggesting that there is no difference between Kickstarter backers and Steam customers in terms of how they should be treated. Not in the sense that Steam customers should be able to get this beta in Steam for the same price that Kickstarter backers would now be able to get this beta, which is exactly what's happening, but in the sense that Kickstarter backers should not be given consideration and that the beta should be priced at like $20 or whatever (some suggest lower, like $5-10. One guy looked forward to getting it "for 50 cents" in a theoretical Humble bundle.)

That's utterly untrue. There's a crucial difference between Kickstarter backers and Steam users who are now considering buying the game. Without Kickstarter backers, this game would not exist.

Right now, on Steam, you get to browse at your leisure, watch videos on Youtube (which will only grow more plentiful as more beta users upload them), look at screenshots, read reviews from other users, and enjoy a wide range of data that will inform and shape your decision of whether or not to plunk down $25 for this game (Yes, it costs $60 on Steam. $25 only gets you a measly Steam (or GOG I believe) activation code, and who can be bothered to copy and paste something from an email?). The reason why a potential customer gets to peruse all that feedback and make an informed decision is because of the Kickstarter backers.

The Backers didn't have any of that when they put down their money. They had words on a page, a pitch video, interviews with developers, concept art, and promises of rewards to incentivize donations. Backers put down money because they believed in the idea and they wanted it to be real, and they were actually willing to put their money where their mouths were. No, Kickstarter didn't provide 100% of the funding for the game's budget, but it kickstarted it. It gave it the spark to get going in a real way. Having a working model showing real customer interest (with real money, not just saying yes on some survey) is a big deal in securing financing. It means you can say, "You're wrong." if some publisher suit tells you that nobody would buy this eccentric game if it was made, and that's huge.

Of those original backers, about 10000 backers, roughly 1 in 6 of the people that contributed, put in between $55 and $250 a piece. There were a few hundred that put in more that also were included, but these were the people that paid for a tier including early access. Beta access. The ability to play this sooner than it was released, to get into it because that was how enthusiastic they were. There was not an obligation or an expectation or a commitment being applied to actively hunt bugs, though steps were taken to receive players that volunteered to. They got to play the game early, and they chipped in for it. You may disagree. You may think every single PC game ever made for forever and ever now HAS to take the Minecraft model of slow development, cheap early price, and gradual price increases as time goes on. You're entirely justified in your right to an opinion as a potential customer.

But saying that NOBODY pays money for early access, that your way is the only way and everything else consists of idiots and evil, vampiric devs, is not right. It's ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. Suggesting that "that was then and this is now," that who cares what the backers paid, $60 is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ and ♥♥♥♥ you, basically condemning inXile for not giving their backers the middle finger by backing out of what they promised (they're evil because they didn't lie to their supporters? Are you people serious?) is ridiculous. Again, without the backers, none of us would be here at all. Saying they should be thrown under the bus for YOU is ignorant selfishness, callous and greedy.

Kickstarter Backers paid $15+ for it, and thousands, including me with my boxed copy, didn't pay at a level that gave Beta access. Now you can pay $25 for the same minimum deal: A copy of the game, DRM free or Steam, whatever you want. Or, you can pay $60 to the Kickstarter Backer's $55 for early access.

A $10 bump or a $5 bump. That's what we're talking about here. Everything else is putting individual desires first and ignoring differences of opinion.

[Echo]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Serris:

But saying that NOBODY pays money for early access, that your way is the only way and everything else consists of idiots and evil, vampiric devs, is not right.

I agree that it is not right. But it is also not entirely wrong.

For example, there was a single offer on Kickstarter for some project (I honestly forget which one) that asked for $2,000 payment. And someone did it. Thus, it would be wrong to say that NOBODY pays $2,000 for a game. Because, clearly, someone did. So should be all pay $2,000 for games now? The argument is just as idiotic as suggesting that because very few people did it, now EVERYONE should.

And when I say "very few people did it", I do mean "very few people did it". Because in the grand scheme of things, 14,000 backers or so is NOTHING. It's peanuts. Even if they paid $250 each. When there's hundreds of thousands, or perhaps even millions of people out there who would buy it, right now, at a more reasonable price more in line with what other indie titles of similar scope charge (competitive pricing).

This, and only this, is what bothers me. They're being very upright and righeous towards 14k backers. And potentially pissing off millions of potential buyers. People who would pay today, right now, just not $60. And these same people might NOT pay even $5 if the game releases 6 months from now. Why? For me personally? Elder Scrolls Online, Wildstar, etc. Any one of those has potential to hook me long-term. By which time this game will be old, and price-reduced. As in, next time I look at this game, it could be 12-18 months from now, and the game could be by then on sale for $5. And that's what developers would get from me, maybe. Instead of virtually guaranteed (but more reasonable) purchase right now. Because right now I'm free and kinda bored.

So, in pleasing that 14k, no matter how correct they are, they're gouging their own potential profits in a pretty significant way.

A much smarter play, at least for me, would be to offer those few KS guys who paid through the nose something else in return for their investment. It's not like the devs are not doing this anyway. They're already reconciling between buyers who paid $55 for early access, and buyers who paid $250 for early access plus some other miscellanea. They could just as easily give early access at $25 price point (or $30 or even $35 if hype is big enough) and give come more junk to the people who paid $55+ by way of apology. And reap the financial benefits, here and now.

But hey, that's just me.

[Luky]

Other kickstarter projects are offering beta acces only for 15-25$.

[General Plastro]

Just to note: i didint backed Wasteland 2 on KS, but i did so for Tex Murphy, Project Eternity and the new Jagged Alliance.

With that said, you also have to remember that in kickstarter your DONATING for the game, it is not expected (and shouldnt be) of you to get the better end of the deal, i sank over 150 USD on Eternity alone and i dont care about its final price being less than 20 if the devs want it to.

Also, assuming a "backer elitist" atitude really... and i mean really hurts the community as a whole, while you have been rather polite, i sense a bit of rage in your post.

All in all, i really think Wasteland 2 should be priced at 60USD even at launch, with all the sea of ♥♥♥♥♥♥ games that keeps coming out, Wasteland 2 more than deserves the 60 dollars milestone.

[Pvtchaos]

Walls of text make bad arguments.

Keep it simple

[Serris]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Pvtchaos:

Walls of text make bad arguments.

Keep it simple

Lazy ignorance makes bad retorts.

You're not worth engaging with.

[Scrubwave]

tl;dr there wouldn't even be beta if not for kickstarter backers.

[Serris]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Sabbathi:

People who would pay today, right now, just not $60.

They don't have to. It's $25.

[Serris]

Początkowo opublikowane przez 161Sherlock:

Other kickstarter projects are offering beta acces only for 15-25$.

That was a decision they made. I love them. I haven't paid anything like $60 for beta access on the Kickstarters I backed. The only ones I get beta to are the ones in that range. But this isn't one of them, that's just how it was done.

[Pvtchaos]

Its not 25, right now on steam its 60....

[Luky]

25$ for full game later, or 60$ for buggy unfinished crap now :-D

[Seimalau]

Początkowo opublikowane przez General Plastro:

All in all, i really think Wasteland 2 should be priced at 60USD even at launch, with all the sea of ♥♥♥♥♥♥ games that keeps coming out, Wasteland 2 more than deserves the 60 dollars milestone.

Hear hear. Games of such quality deserve to be offered at a high price.

I just like to weigh in my opinion that Kickstarters put their money in with only the faith of seeing this game completed. They have no idea if its a quality end product or if it would be anything but another failed pipe dream. I guess you could call it a gamble not unlike investing in a startup company or any other financial endeavour.

[Ekaros]

You have to also consider that this game will be much larger in it's scope that some other projects. So those prices aren't direclty comparable. I can't remember what was the price for beta add-on when it was available...

[Two Clicks]

Nice monologue.... personally I dont want early acces and I dont want to beta it. Im in enough of those.

Im quite happy to wait, then see and play this game at formal release. If its the right price for me.

I congratulate the kickstarters on their passion acknowleding that they have played a major part in getting the title made but, Im just happy to wait for a completed and fully q/a'd title so I can actually enjoy it.

Some games Id be happy to get early access (only a few mind), but this wouldnt be one of them.

[Serris]

Początkowo opublikowane przez General Plastro:

Just to note: i didint backed Wasteland 2 on KS, but i did so for Tex Murphy, Project Eternity and the new Jagged Alliance.

With that said, you also have to remember that in kickstarter your DONATING for the game, it is not expected (and shouldnt be) of you to get the better end of the deal.

I totally agree, 100%.

Początkowo opublikowane przez General Plastro:

Also, assuming a "backer elitist" atitude really... and i mean really hurts the community as a whole, while you have been rather polite, i sense a bit of rage in your post.

Backer elitist? How am I suggesting elitism? I'm not asking for a special forum badge or title or some BS like that. I'm not asking for a backer only gun or backer only cheat code or something. I'm suggesting that commitments to backers should be honored, and pointing out that backers are not consumers for specific reasons, one of which being there would be nothing to consume without the exact kind of donation that you yourself are describing. I'm not enraged, but I am irritated, and I see no reason to not say what I mean. I'm not here to win hearts or minds, I don't think anybody changes their mind about anything on a Steam forum unless they want to. I just wanted to speak my mind in one spot, engage a little, get bored, and leave.

[Luky]

And how you guys justify that in EU we have to pay 55€ for this, how many $ is it? 70? 75? Do you see the scam? Other Steam game's pricing is much more fair, this is not.