Party Build

[Blackdeath]

So I just started the game and created my party. Would be good to get some comments from the seasoned players on my party.

C.L.A.S.S.I.C

Leader
2 1 3 4 2 10 6
Skills: Assault, Leadership, Perception, Kiss ♥♥♥, Computer Science, Demolition

Sniper/Medic
2 1 8 4 2 10 1
Skills: Sniper, Smart ♥♥♥, Weapon Smithing, Field Medic, Surgeon,

Thief
4 8 5 4 2 4 1
Skills: Assault, Alarm, Lockpicking, Safe cracking

Main Carry
4 1 6 6 6 4 1
Skills: Assault, Blunt, Energy, Toaster Repair

I know that I have 3 guys with assault, but my carry has blunt weapons so she can melee for a while, and conserve ammo. I've read all the guides about luck being a dump stat..but I'm sure it has its uses somehow...hopefully she gives me better loot.

What do you guys think?

[Dufflebags]

You're going to be strained on ammo early game with that many assaults. And your skills will also be weak early on since they spread so thin. I prefer to pick 3 skills max to start per character, that way you can dump a little extra into whatever weapon preferrence you have.

But I'm sure it will all work out fine regardless.

[kifchan]

you should read this http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=280383300
luck totaly useless, also sniper with 2 coordination realy?

[Blackdeath]

Thanks for the tips/guide guys..will tweak around. 2 Coordination seems entirely viable the guide itself puts coordination at 2. I think CI is more important for a sniper as he/she arguably is able to keep sniping everyone to bits before getting pummelled close range.

The guide on melee is making me rethink my melee build though...will look into it further

[Gregorovitch]

I'm no seasoned expert but a couple of observations:

1. As dufflebags says, you got one at least too many assualt rifles. You''l want Angie early game and she uses one too so you'll be in real trouble for ammo. AR's are the best weapons but not enough ammo for everyone to use them. You melee has too many weapons IMO. Melee is *very* useful as is because a) it doesn't cost ammo and b) closing down enemy shooters interferes with their shooting.

2. Your siniper needs a lot more coordination or s/he won't hit ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. Not sure sniper is best weapons match for medic.

3. What you don't know starting the game is that the skill checks have a very steep difficulty curve meaning to be effective you have to pump it up harder than you might think. Even if you save scum. Three high skills is worth a lot more at the end of the day than five or six mediocre ones.

4. This is particularly true of the three @$$s. No % chances with these and often no second chances. You either have the required, say, level 6 Smart @$$ or you don't and the curve for this is surpisingly steep through the game. It is very easy to invest a load of points in them and actually get diddly squat out of it. However they are *very* useful in certain situations. Just utterly useless if you don't have the required level. If you go for them you got to really go for them and sacrifice combat ability upgrades.

5. Related to this is one of the big weaknesses of the game's design IMO. Your additional three party members will all have certain skills already and in many cases these will be significatly better than your four core charatcers. The problem is first time you don't know where they are, when you can get them or what their skill sets are. This makes choosing skills (outside weapons skills) very difficult and almost guarantees duplication and waste. There are two approaches to this. One is to look up the main recuitable NPCs and plan around that. I personally don't think there'a any shame in it becasue i think this is a flaw. The other is to significantly narrow the number of skills you start with for your core party to those that are really necessary, but of course how do you know what skills are really necessary?. It's very difficult to discuss this without spoilers. All i will say is this: you must have someone who has the minumum requirement at least stitch up a wounded ranger and get them back on their feet before they croak. You must have someone with at least some Perception to at least see traps, locks and hidden goodie caches. I think you prety much have to have someone that can do locks and safes or you will lose too many free med kits and ammo. You absolutely must have a weaponsmith.

6. I would go through my characters and double check their Combat Initiative scores. I'm looking especially at your thief here, but the others as well. CI is incredibly important. More awareness and more speed - more CI. That theif would be massively more effective in battle id she was a less lucky some of the time but a lot more aware and faster all of the time for example.

[Sai Kyouji]

your thief and main carry are both misses with that low int

Dont think that 2 10 ints will net you enough skills. Coordinations dont help as much as skill points in weapon skills do.

that 8 luck : / down the road you will dread it. You want solid growth (CON from str and sp from int), not unsure statistic like coordination and luck. Unless you're a rookie or seasoned player, in which case, it doesnt really matter because the game would be pretty easy.

You've got 6 char right, tho. That would be enough to recruit you enough npcs to fill the slots. Dont let anyone tell you otherwise.
Look at this companion list and build your party around
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lZ4lpL4E5PXa1mFAnGaW--TEmCUbX_RUnGCXwutd4ms/htmlview?sle=true# (SPOILER!)

[The Acidpiss]

don't have a sniper as a medic either, your medic needs to be in close prox to other chars

[Sai Kyouji]

Originally posted by The Acidpiss:

don't have a sniper as a medic either, your medic needs to be in close prox to other chars

It really wouldnt matter that much cuz enemies tend to sprint to you anyways. To begin with, sniper rifle is a miss that should only be used to not waste ammunition. It's really is not worth putting a char so far back. My sniper medic (8 int) has an smg for close combat, btw.

Dont look down on SMG (their dmg per AP is frightening)

[Coup d' oeil]

Originally posted by The Acidpiss:

don't have a sniper as a medic either, your medic needs to be in close prox to other chars

I agree. Mine has a SMG and decent armor. Need to be able to mix it up and take some damage if you are helping someone. Working so far.

My sniper is a brawler. Run up on em and get your jaw broke. I should of went blunt for the crit. But thats for my next run. Live and learn

[The Asciiman]

Definatley switch one of the Assault rifle users for SMGs. enough ammo and totally worth it in damage. Two characters with 10 INT is too many. Keep it at one for 8 and the other at four or five(five = +1 Action Point). Simply put, imagine growth long term. Skill points will get there in the end.

Also keep in mind, that you want speed and awareness for everyone as these abilities determine how often you get to act in a turn. More actions means you determine more of the battles.

And find someone else, NPC's that offer you skills in things you don't have or to take the stress off of your leader or your theif character.

Sniper for medic is fine. You'll be able to advance that sniper if needed.

[swordfish]

Toaster Repair, Alarm. and Perception are waste of points.
Perception: to see if something is trapped, all u have to do is to use Demolition to see if the object is trapped or not. Also, there are not that much of mines, and u could just avoid them by trial and error.
Toast repair: if u fix them, u will get useless junk.
Alarm, I did not really have to use it at all.
And, for computer science: It is very important, but the Dr. that joins u in AG has it already high. So, u do not have to invest in it with ur first 4 characters.

[The Asciiman]

No, no, no.

You skip perception, and not only are you eating land mines but you are missing hidden caches of items all over the world. And considering the OP wants to have more than one AR user, he'll need those caches of items to buy more AR ammo, or there goes another stream of resources.

As for Alarm, yeah, you could live without it. But toaster repair, is risky. You get some great laughs and if you hold onto those items you get some of the most powerful loot in the game at the end.

[swordfish]

Originally posted by The Asciiman:

No, no, no.

You skip perception, and not only are you eating land mines but you are missing hidden caches of items all over the world. And considering the OP wants to have more than one AR user, he'll need those caches of items to buy more AR ammo, or there goes another stream of resources.

As for Alarm, yeah, you could live without it. But toaster repair, is risky. You get some great laughs and if you hold onto those items you get some of the most powerful loot in the game at the end.

ur mean sand-covered stuff in the ground?? with one Perc, and seeing a lot of them

[Gamefever]

When you finally realize that Looting dead bodies is a better way to getting items you will wish you never took loot skills.

Only skill that matters to make a dead body is main weapon skill. Looting anything else can involve up to 3 skills which must be at max to be effective. Comparing that to just one maxed weapon skill? Which is better....?
Dropping Loot skills affords you points for a backup weapon and even a social skill on a Ranger......Your non-com followers pick up the rest if your so inclined.


Honestly Ammo conservation and a total focus on a main weapon go hand in hand. Not bothering to loot every cache leads to shorter game times.

Want better fighter's make better fighter's. You can have level 4 in a weapon at start. Why not?

Spoilers Follow,

Make Combat Rangers
Make Combat Rangers
Make Combat Rangers

All Skills are pretty much all in or wasted skill.

[IdealPoint]

There is a lot of bad advice in this thread. 5 INT doesn't give an additional AP unless that makes (SPD +STR +INT)/4 a whole number. And it's still a bad idea, because 5 INT doesn't do anything else for you in that case, whereas putting the point in STR or SPD will provide a benefit. You most definitely don't need 10 INT on all of your rangers. Combat initiative has been over hyped lately. As long as you have 10 CI or more and enough AP to make effective use of your weapons (as in enough to shoot them twice, or headshot, or burst, etc) you will be fine. Strength has a pretty big impact on melee weapons, despite people saying otherwise. You don't have to make all combat rangers, though it doesn't hurt to start out that way and later try again once you decide what you need. Of course, the best advice is to try the game out, maybe read a guide, and see how you want to play.

[SIlverblade-T-E]

I do seem to get better items with my good Luck/Charisma/Int leadership/faceman guy opening things, hello Bren Gun early on :)
maybe flukes though *shrug*