Fundamental problems of the combat system (CURRENT PLAYTEST BUILD)

[zhelezovskiy88]

1. Precise strikes are absolutely impossible. You just swing your weapon left and right hoping for a lucky hit. This matters less if your enemy has light (or none) armor. But good luck trying to actually HIT any weak spots when fighting enemies in half/full plate. Thus rondel daggers and other piercing weapons are currently useless against well armored opponents. Even finishing off a downed opponent is very hard with some weapons.
The AI (most of the time) is able to precisely attack you with any given weapon.

2. The only thing that matters is the "damaging surface of the weapon". Weapons with the largest damaging surfaces are the most effective currently. Try longswords/zweihanders and the spiked goedentag (or smth like that). You'll see the difference. These weapons are absolutely obliterating everyone, even full plate won't save your opponents (or you LOL). No precise hits needed.

3. Long weapons with small "damaging surface" (bills, spears etc.) are currently much less effective because you cannot land a precise hit OR estimate the distance to the opponent, because of the camera angle.
The AI for the obvious reasons does not have such difficulties, and it is quite effective with long weapons.

4. Berserker zombie AI. AI opponents just keep hit-spamming you indefinitely. Wounded opponents do not become less aggressive, never try to keep their distance or take defensive postures. OFFENCE ONLY.
In general, the AI goes full BLACK KNIGHT on you:) TIS BUT A SCRATCH!!! COME ON, YOU PANSY!!!!

5. I guess the lock on feature is supposed to help with the precision problem but I am not sure if it even works currently. Can't see the difference. In fact I turn it off because it constrains camera movement.

Despite all these problems, I must say that I like the game very much and hope that the devs will not abandon the project and keep improving it.

[male_07]

After a 100 hours of playing the playtest:
1: Skill issue. After some practice you can easily jab a halfsword trough an enemy's neck while deflecting any polearm or axe attacks. And finishing off is not hard either.
2: True. Also long polearms go into this. Spears, billhooks etc. because you have a ton of distance advantage. Thats mostly why i dont play much of tiers 4-5. The billhooks are easy to parry though. Only the spiked goedentag keeps me stressed, but in most cases, parrying it with a half sword grab and closing distance rapidly is very effective. The only weapon its not effective with is the long candlestick, because it knocks you out at the lightest touch.
3: Once again skill issue.
4: I dunno, they sometimes have a charging mode, and sometimes try to keep distance.
5: Holding the mouse button constraints mouse movement, not the lock on. Crank it up all the way and hold down the mouse button. This way the camera will always be on the enemy which makes it easy to go around and dodge in circles, while having constant control of the weapon to either parry an attack or strike with precision.
PS: Skill issue is not used as an offensive term

[male_07]

And here are some clips that will prove my points:

1: You CAN be precise with weapons to hit enemy weak points in the armor.
https://steamusercontent-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/31057903952560855/7C276B061F0035BC1F629155576DF708556F8296/

2: You CAN fight off the "Overpowered" spiky goedendag and have an advantage over an opponent with a large damaging surface.
https://steamusercontent-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/31057903952569649/7A117880C501AE5DFE782B064BC578B6CC91B86B/

3: This clip proves both points that a billhook is actually pretty usable with a bit of practice, and that the ai is not a zombie berserker. It also shows how the lock on feature works and why its usefull.
https://steamusercontent-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/31057903952582680/030D23AA319C54170EF83F53DBA5EBC8393C1693/

All these clips will only last about 2 days before getting outdated and they are ♥♥♥♥ because of reasons. The steam recorder is great for sharing vids with friends, but sharing them anywhere else is a pain.

[qandleS]

before the play test demo there was infinite horde roguelike mode (which i preferred) version in which point 1 n 2 didnt exist. i remember halberds and polearms being much more effective, they used to hit fast and hard, it was very satisfying where as in this version you can barely swing them, probably has to do with how the devs tweaked the physics systems but im not entirely sure. as for precise striking i feel like it was easier due to having a crosshair and the bone snapping option. i think the devs are experimenting at the moment and testing things out.

[male_07]

Originally posted by ϟ NOW ϟ:

before the play test demo there was infinite horde roguelike mode (which i preferred) version in which point 1 n 2 didnt exist. i remember halberds and polearms being much more effective, they used to hit fast and hard, it was very satisfying where as in this version you can barely swing them, probably has to do with how the devs tweaked the physics systems but im not entirely sure. as for precise striking i feel like it was easier due to having a crosshair and the bone snapping option. i think the devs are experimenting at the moment and testing things out.

There was a bigger issue back then. It didnt actually feel like a proper fighting system. I remember beating the game by just grabbing 2 peasant billhooks and wiggling them around a bit. So most of the points he made are actual skill problems than anything. You need training to use a sword irl, then why do you not need training to use a sword in a realistic game? Polearms feel much better in the playtest because they feel heavy and clunky, as in demo its just sticks with sharp stuff on them. The gameplay doesnt compare and you need actual skill to use weapons in the playtest.

[Swamp Fox]

If you prefer the demo you prefer simplicity over complexity and this is probably not your game. Please don't ruin it for those of us who have waited for exactly this.

[male_07]

Originally posted by Swamp Fox:

If you prefer the demo you prefer simplicity over complexity and this is probably not your game. Please don't ruin it for those of us who have waited for exactly this.

Based.

[zhelezovskiy88]

Well, I expected a lot of "git guud" attitude. Nevertheless the problems persist.
It is just a game, a piece of electronic entertainment. An average player should not spend unspecified amounts of time to practice BASIC gameplay functions (like precise strikes), like some no-lifers do. Especially when these functions are fundamentally flawed.

Please guys, dont become like Exanima community. I.e. a bunch of elitist git-gooders who like to sniff each others farts. The game is complex as it is alright, but it doesnt have to be overly complex. No-lifers with weeks of spare time compose only a small percentage of the PC gaming society.

[male_07]

Originally posted by zhelezovskiy88:

Well, I expected a lot of "git guud" attitude. Nevertheless the problems persist.
It is just a game, a piece of electronic entertainment. An average player should not spend unspecified amounts of time to practice BASIC gameplay functions (like precise strikes), like some no-lifers do. Especially when these functions are fundamentally flawed.

Please guys, dont become like Exanima community. I.e. a bunch of elitist git-gooders who like to sniff each others farts. The game is complex as it is alright, but it doesnt have to be overly complex. No-lifers with weeks of spare time compose only a small percentage of the PC gaming society.

This is a (not super accurate) simulator. Guess what other good games make you have to learn some stuff before you play? My summer car (car assembly), kerbal space program (aerodynamics, plane and spacecraft construction, basic planetary physics, basic rocket science knowledge etc.) countless vehicle simulators like il2 sturmovik, DCS World, microsoft flight simulator, driving simulators. Half sword isnt even a complicated game. Its like learning to rocket jump and market garden in tf2 or learning to parry everything in ultrakill. You dont complain on forums about it. You just get better.

[zzzzz]

Being precise could be improved by making the sensitivity slider exaggerated in both directions for better control for very high or very low DPI's.

I for instance have a pretty "extremely high" dpi, but still enjoy the game with combined 200hrs b/t the demo and play test, but 100% can see new ppl picking it up with crazy DPI not feeling any control in their attacks.

[zhelezovskiy88]

Originally posted by zzzzz:

Being precise could be improved by making the sensitivity slider exaggerated in both directions for better control for very high or very low DPI's.

I for instance have a pretty "extremely high" dpi, but still enjoy the game with combined 200hrs b/t the demo and play test, but 100% can see new ppl picking it up with crazy DPI not feeling any control in their attacks.

That was actually a good advice. Thank you. Lowering mouse sensivity really helps. Thanks!
Now I can be more "precise". It is still far from perfect, but much better. Short piercing weapons are still useless IMO, if you are playing higher than Tier 0.

[twexod]

sounds like skill issue tbh

[male_07]

Originally posted by twexod:

sounds like skill issue tbh

Yes it most likely is.