My take on "Thief" (2014) (or, "Should I get it?")

[Uber Goober]

There have undoubtedly been, and will be, several people wondering whether or not this game is worth buying. I'm going to just explain how *I* personally see it with my own opinion, and hopefully that helps you make up your mind.

First, you need to understand where I'm coming from and what I value in a game.

To me, all video games are a form of entertainment, like TV, but as the player it's up to you to drive the story forward, so both the failures, and the successes, hit home a lot more than sitting on the couch watching some overpaid actor say stupid crap. For me, story in a game is EVERYTHING. Even moderately bad gameplay can, in my opinion, be made up for with a dynamite story.

So that brings me to the subject of Theif's storyline.

In my personal opinion, *having never played previous Thief games*, I found the story quite enthralling and interesting. It's extremely mysterious and leaves many unanswered questions, even after beating the game. But I think that's part of the point - you're going to have to fill in some of those gaps on your own with context from the game. However, from the beginning all the way to the end, the story is pretty congruent with itself and coherent. There are a few things here and there I wasn't real clear about (it didn't help that I played a chapter or two while hammered, haha), but overall it kicks ass.

Now, gameplay.

This is a stealth game, but you definitely have the option to engage in combat with guards. I did on several occasions, sometimes because I was lazy and didn't want to stealth, and other times because I worked myself into a corner and that was my only way out.

I played the game with an XBox 360 controller attached to my PC, which worked out great. The shock feedback when you're looking for hidden switches or picking locks is actually very useful. That said, I doubt that playing with a keyboard would be a problem, if that's what you've got.

What I liked was the ability to "zoom in" on a target from a distance, grab a bow and arrow, and shoot an enemy target. I also liked that gaurds will respond to seeing dead bodies by freaking out, then going to look for you. You can also extinguish flames (torches, fire pits, etc.) with water arrows to make it easier to sneak past an area unseen.

I'm not some one who ever goes for achievements, it's just not my thing. That said, if you like achievements, there are some pretty challenging ones available. Also, if you're looking for a stealth challenge, try to "ghost" your way through the whole game without killing anyone. Personally, I don't find that appealing, but if you do you'll have a great time. There are tons of walkthroughs for that on YouTube already.

So, should you get the game? It depends.

Get the game if you:
- Value a story with suspense and plot twists above all else.
- Are OK with some ambiguity in that story.
- Enjoy stealth gameplay.
- Like a fair challenge. This game isn't unpossible, but they don't hand things to you on a silver platter, either.
- Have patience and like to study your enemy, your surroundings, and find ways to exploit them and the environment instead of going all "run and gun" against everything. Not *every* obstacle should be overpowered.

Avoid it if you:
- Feel that gameplay is more important than story (not that the gameplay is bad, quite the contrary)
- Are an FPS-obsessed tweaker without patience or attention span
- Do not like thinking tactically, about angles, points of ingress and egress, and exploring (and exploiting) your environment for tactical advantages.
- Prefer the "Rambo style" "run-and-gun" approach to accomplishing goals. It's not that kind of game. You could play it that way, but it would be kind of stupid, harder than necessary, and a lot less fun than intended.
- Have nightmares easily (seriously, there's a few scenes with some fairly freaky stuff)
- Have very strong preconceived notions of what a "Thief" game should be. I'd recommend talking to others who've played original Thief games as well as this and get their opinion first, as I've heard lots of old school Thief fans weren't too happy with this title (though I just don't see why, it rocks)
- Have problems with ambiguity and the feeling of an "unfinished" ending. You have to really think through what you saw in the ending and put the clues together to really get it. You won't have an immediate feeling of closure or catharsis at the end. It takes some thinking.

I put my money where my mouth is on this one by purchasing the game for a friend here on steam as a gift. It's pretty darn good. I recommend it :)

[RedRevReyn]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Fallen Phoenix:

I didn't find anything "cliche" about it at all.

How much you like or dislike a story is subjective, so I can't argue with you there I'll leave my comment on that much as you've said. I respectfully disagree that it's a good story.

However, you can't tell me it's NOT cliched:

The reluctant anti-hero must fight against the evil empire(that's evil because it's evil), and get's betrayed by the revolutionary who ends up being the antagonist. The guy even literally says "We're not so different, you and I" at one point.

[𝕊𝕋𝕌ℝ𝕄-𝕂𝔸𝕋]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von RedRevReyn:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Fallen Phoenix:

I didn't find anything "cliche" about it at all.

How much you like or dislike a story is subjective, so I can't argue with you there I'll leave my comment on that much as you've said. I respectfully disagree that it's a good story.

However, you can't tell me it's NOT cliched:

The reluctant anti-hero must fight against the evil empire(that's evil because it's evil), and get's betrayed by the revolutionary who ends up being the antagonist. The guy even literally says "We're not so different, you and I" at one point.

Kinda like the original story really...

>.>

[RedRevReyn]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von KL Master Dan StormCats:

Kinda like the original story really...

There were some fairly weak points in the originals storyline, mostly in The Metal Age with

Karras wanting to kill all organic life mostly because he was nuts and Garrett actually giving a ♥♥♥♥ about Victoria. And in the Dark Project the whole "help Constantine, get betrayed by him later" thing was also fairly cliched but I thought it was handled well(or at least better than in this).

[Morgan]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von KL Master Dan StormCats:

Forgive my potential ignorance, but have you played Thief: The Dark Project, and Thief: The Metal Age? edit: (yes I have just noticed you mention you haven't)

You could shoot water arrows at torches from the very start of this game. And a controller is NOT suitable for ANY PC game in my humble yet ZEALOUS opinion. UGHH! *sprays disinfectant all over room*

I am really really apprehensive about getting this game, but darn it - it's THIEF!!! I played Thief from the very beginning man....watched the twin towers fall WHILST PLAYING THIEF...

bunked off college, AND work even, TO PLAY IT! :3

I am a very serious gamer, who, when playing the Thief games absolutely HAS to play it on the maximum difficulty, and does NOT kill ANYONE. Can yuo tell me if it is still true to the original, because I have seen some pretty damming reviews on this. Garrett is not even in it, WTF? Thief IS GARRETT!

I just don't know if I can stomach this new generation BS, I just don't know...if it isn't anything like the original games, I'm just not interested...

I’m a big fan of the old Thief games and I’m really enjoying this one. To quickly address two of your concerns. Garrett is still the protagonist and so far I’ve not killed anyone. I think a lot of the people who don’t like the game are recalling an idealised version of Thief born of nostalgia. For example the AI is this game (which is fine of master difficulty if you ask me) is taking a lot of stick even though it’s very similar to what we saw I the old games. The game was taking a beating in some quarters long before it was released and a lot of people are simply too bias to ever be happy.

- I’m about half way through and as an old Taffer here’s my take on it so far.

- The atmosphere is great

- Gameplay and style are true to the originals is most respects. (No swimming and a limited rope arrow though)

- Graphic are great

- The sound is a little disappointing

- The contextual jumping isn’t as bad as it could have been but it could still have been a bit better

- Maps still offer multiple paths and exploration but are broken down into sections that don’t allowed you to back track to earlier areas. (That’s by far my biggest gripe about the game)
Some lore changes due to it being a reboot

To conclude. It’s not perfect, but in my opinion it’s good. It feels like a Thief game to me. It still feels like it’s just Garrett, a set of tools and the shadows.

[Nicze]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von KL Master Dan StormCats:

I am a very serious gamer, who, when playing the Thief games absolutely HAS to play it on the maximum difficulty, and does NOT kill ANYONE. Can yuo tell me if it is still true to the original, because I have seen some pretty damming reviews on this.

I play on Master difficulty with all the custom difficulty stuff turned on except for Iron Man, chapter saves and no upgrades and I'm having a blast. I try to not raise any suspicions at all and then I spend an hour trying to cross a brightly lit street just in front of a guard, with my reduced movement speed. And I did it, ha! Then I found out I could just walk through windows nearby but eh, I had fun. I haven't played previous Thief games (but I already bought all of them!) and I'm fairly new to stealth games (only played original Deus Ex before) so take my opinion as you will. I haven't raised a single suspicion in the main missions but I didn't get all the loot, so I'm not sure if you can do that, though I'm fairly sure you can do it without killing or knocking out anyone.

[RedRevReyn]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Morgan:

For example the AI is this game (which is fine of master difficulty if you ask me) is taking a lot of stick even though it’s very similar to what we saw I the old games.

I was quite skeptical about this at first, but I agree. However, I would like to point out that really isn't something in the game's favor. Congratulations EM, with all of the technical advances we've made in 15 years, you've managed to progress AI behavior no where.

Edit: I'm really curious what it would have been like to play with the AI they "dumbed down," unless that was some sort of PR statement or something.

[Morgan]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von RedRevReyn:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Morgan:

For example the AI is this game (which is fine of master difficulty if you ask me) is taking a lot of stick even though it’s very similar to what we saw I the old games.

I was quite skeptical about this at first, but I agree. However, I would like to point out that really isn't something in the game's favor. Congratulations EM, with all of the technical advances we've made in 15 years, you've managed to progress AI behavior no where.

The problem with AI in stealth games though is that if it’s too realistic then the game becomes unplayable.

[RedRevReyn]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Morgan:

The problem with AI in stealth games though is that if it’s too realistic then the game becomes unplayable.

Yeah, it is a fine line they have to walk, so my initial post there was probably a little too harsh.

[𝕊𝕋𝕌ℝ𝕄-𝕂𝔸𝕋]

I am worried about.......''checkpoints''

*sprays disinfectant again*

Can you even save the game? At a point that YOU decide? Or do you have to do it all over again from the last checkpoint? (this is consoly and I do not like it) no offence to consolers, but this is meant to be a PC game. I am worried that the devs have just made it too - arcade game? due to platform merging sales benefits (F.F.S, game producers, games are for the PLAYER NOT FOR SALES!)

no derail intended...

[RedRevReyn]

Yeah, you can save at points you want, but there's also checkpoints.

Edit: You can not save, or at least quick save, if the guards are alerted enough to start looking for you though. Something I thought was a little weird, but I get it.

[𝕊𝕋𝕌ℝ𝕄-𝕂𝔸𝕋]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Morgan:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von RedRevReyn:

I was quite skeptical about this at first, but I agree. However, I would like to point out that really isn't something in the game's favor. Congratulations EM, with all of the technical advances we've made in 15 years, you've managed to progress AI behavior no where.

The problem with AI in stealth games though is that if it’s too realistic then the game becomes unplayable.

....FOR KIDS.

>.>

[Morgan]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von KL Master Dan StormCats:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Morgan:

The problem with AI in stealth games though is that if it’s too realistic then the game becomes unplayable.

....FOR KIDS.

>.>

LOL, no. Think about trying to play the old Thief games with realistic AI.

[DFH01]

For [KL] Master Dan [StormCats] Your Khajiit ♥♥♥♥♥cat skills wont help you here dan. Also if money is no object then buy it Dan, or wait for the sales, that can only be your call, but personally i really like the game.

[𝕊𝕋𝕌ℝ𝕄-𝕂𝔸𝕋]

I ranted at this remake so hard....But have calmed down since. I will wait and see more footage first as it appears.

Khajiit needs his caramel coffee break now, Stealing is thirsty work! :3

[Bad Whippet]

I played Thief Deadly Shadows right up (repeatedly) until last year. I think some people are only remembering the best bits without remembering the not-so-good in that game.

New Thief absolutely improves on many elements from that game. The city maps are a lot bigger, there are even more choices for access routes, more secrets, more spoils. The stealth is better. There was no suspicion meter at all - you were either caught or not caught, and the sound mechanics didn't even work in Thief 3 (the moss arrows were a waste of time other than to help out the Pagans). The only similarity to rope arrows in Thief 3 were the climbing gloves, and I cannot believe for one minute any Thief 3 player cannot remember how infuritating it was to discover that you actually couldn't use them at all on most walls, and could only use them part way up walls (somewhat inexplicably unable to reach ledges that would have been in easy reach).

Re: Garrett's clockwork eye (mentioned further up), he always had that so no, there would be no explanation in this game, and there lies the reason (I think) why the original factions were dropped. They'd need too much explanation and would only give even more reasons for people to remark on how they weren't accurately represented, or where continuity was broken. It's just easier to drop it and introduce similarities that work equally for players new to the franchise.

I suspect the 'linear' argument comes from people doing what the games tells them to - which is easy to do (I played Chapter 3 like that and only managed to loot 21% of the level). It's the same in Dishonored. If you follow the objectives literally, you miss out two-thirds of the game. I've restarted twice and have been surprised just how many other routes and hidden locations there are than I discovered previously.