How to: mage

[Ganen]

So, are you looking for some information on how to build your mage? wondering what role he should take? what magic schools? maybe even if its worth taking more than one? hopefuly this thread will help with that.
Let's start by having a description of what the different caster skills have going for them and giving them a rating, where 3 stars means it is the best at that purpose and 1 that it is terrible for it, of how good they are for different purposes:

<Primordial>
Single target damage: * *
Area of Effect damage: *
Healing: none
Disables (CC): *
Buffs: * * *
Debuffs: *
Utility and cleanses: * * *

-has one strong Damage dealing spell (implosion), does damage comparable to the equivalent spell of the fire school, but at less aoe dmg (and it is also the only aoe the school does), you also acquire it later.
-Has a vital expert utility spell that identifies enchanted gear, and you should get this asap, and if you choose to go further into it, also offers a handy teleport spell to cut travel costs/time.
-multi purpose party buff/debuff removal
-the only debuff is an armor sunder that does not stack with warfare novice one.
Recommended for:
all solo mage builds at least to expert, and recommended getting it to grandmaster if building a pure support mage that isnt investing in a damage dealing school (either wind or fire) so that you can put in an implosion when you arnt required to cast anything else to support/heal the party


<Fire>
Single target damage: * * *
Area of Effect damage: * * *
Healing: none
Disables (CC): none
Buffs: *
Debuffs: none
Utility and cleanses: *

-best single target and aoe damage school in the game, no contest, it starts with already stronger damage spells and is the only school who gets stronger damage spells at grandmaster.
-has one strong pro-active anti status spell that is useful in many situations, along with some utility like torch fire.
-while it has an advantage in raw damage per turn over the other damage school (air) it has the disadvantage of costing more mana, again not a problem for a dedicated dmg dealer, but for builds that are intended to be a healer or general support, going with air or just primal is the better choice for mana efficiency.
Recommended for:
A mage that is going to be a primary damage dealer, and the only one worth going for it is the dwarf priest because the others cannot grandmaster fire.


<Air>
Single target damage: * *
Area of Effect damage: * * *
Healing: none
Disables (CC): *
Buffs: * *
Debuffs: none
Utility and cleanses: *

- damage dealing school, capable of high damage at less cost of mana
-can stack multiple aoe spells making it on par with fire for aoe damage dealing.
-has a single target pushback effect CC
-Has a buff that helps multiple hero types (perception) and hybrids especially and another that helps agaisnt archers.
-can cleanse feeblemind
Recommended for:
support human freemage builds that also intend to do strong damage and particularly aoe dmg.


<Water>
Single target damage: *
Area of Effect damage: * *
Healing: none
Disables (CC): * *
Buffs: * *
Debuffs: * *
Utility and cleanses: * *

-good aoe dmg (not great or the best but worth it)
-can remove sleep and paralysis effects
-aoe root spell
-only has one buff, but it is unique in that it adds flat damage mitigation, very useful for survival and saving healing mana/consumbles
-the spells have a passive debuff that reduces melee damage taken for enemies that have multiple strikes, very useful and practical
-the big minus is the very low damage
Recommended for:
Support build mages regardless of if its capable of getting grandmaster or just master, the passive debuff and water membrane (damage mitigation spell) alone give this great synergy with other support schools/spells like nature and holy or the darkness weakness debuff, and it also has 1 disable spell and at grandmaster one aoe pushback spell.


<Nature>
Single target damage: *
Area of Effect damage: *
Healing: * *
Disables (CC): *
Buffs: *
Debuffs: * *
Utility and cleanses: * *

-Best healing spell, its a novice spell that scales VERY well heals when cast and then during X turns after a smaller ammount and affects the whole party at a low cost of mana per healing.
-Has two very strong debuffs, one that lowers enemy evasion and the other that cuts down enemy armor by half.
- single target root spell
-armor buff
-can remove weakened and poison both very useful for many stages of the game.
-poison aoe dmg spells (low dmg but long term)
Recommended for:
Support-healing build mages regardless of if they can grandmaster into it or not, only Elven Druids can.


<Holy>
Single target damage: *
Area of Effect damage: *
Healing: * * *
Disables (CC): none
Buffs: * *
Debuffs: none
Utility and cleanses: * *

-best healing school
-has a proactive shield that absorbs dmg before it is inflicted and actual healing is required
-strong single target heal and party heal
-ressurection spell
-very little damage, it is not even worth casting unless you dont have anything else that can damage targets.
Recommended for:
Healer focus builds shoul go master or if possible grandmaster, balanced support builds only need expert if they have nature too , ressurection spell is master but you usually dont have people dying in fights if you do you can just rezz at church, unless it is a boss, in that case it would be good to have it but... I dont think its worth it just for that.


<Darkness>
Single target damage: *
Area of Effect damage: none
Healing: *
Disables (CC): * * *
Buffs: none
Debuffs: * * *
Utility and cleanses: * * *

-can purge enemy buffs
-strongest disables/CC in the game, one is a expert lvl permanent sleep, the other is a X turns duration fear effect
-strongest debuffs in the game, one is a grandmaster lvl weakness effect that reduces damage enemy dmg the other is a debuff the causes dmg everytime the party attacks them each time they hit, for example a master dagger build hero will proc 6X the dmg effect per turn.
-Drain life for fun dmg/healing, not very good but... usable
-detect secrets spell for dungeons, and night vision spell
Recommended for:
heavy support mage or solo support mages.


So what schools to pick? what has good synergy with what?
well if you are building a solo mage, that means that you are going to be stuck with the support role, that leaves out fire, the dedicated damage dealing mana draining school.
anything that enhances your party, and weakens the enemy is good and yet since you are solo mage you may want to consider a school that can dish out some dmg too.
you should only focus on 3 skills to get to grandmaster or 4 to get to master and use remaining points to get other useful expert skills, like Mysticism to increase your mana, and Endurance to increase your hp pool and help you stay alive in warrior mode before tanks are actually able to defend you every turn
so for support you'll want one 2 or even 3 of the following: nature, water, darkness, on of those is not only a great support school but also a healer one, so that is pretty much a no brainer -> nature and you'll want it maxed out in any build because it will boost the best heal and also add on great debuffs to armor and evasion and armor buff to your party.
you will want to get holy to expert, but not further, the party heal and rezz are NOT really a requirement unless you want to make a dedicated strong healer, you just need the strong single target heal and the novice damage shield.
after that you choose what other role to fill, strong buffs/debuffs? take darkness grandmaster and/or frost master, if you instead prefer some damage capacity, get primordial to grandmaster if you want the strongest single target nuke or air grandmaster for mana efficient single target nuke and strong aoe.
Pure Support:
Human Freemage
-Grandmaster Darkness
-Master nature
-Master Water
-Expert Primordial
-Expert Holy
+whatever else you can where you want it

Damage and Support:
Human Freemage
-Grandmaster Magic Focus
-Grandmaster Air
-Expert Nature
-Expert holy
-Expert Primordial
+whatever else you can and want(recommend master nature but since you wanted a damage focus supporter not as required as pure support)

Support and Damage:
Human freemage
-Grandmaster Primordial
-Grandmaster Darkness
-Master Nature
-Expert Holy
+whatever else you can and want

Healer Support:
Elven Druid
-Grandmaster Water
-Grandmaster Nature
-Master Holy
-Master Primordial
+whatever else you can and want

Now that you know good effective ways to build a lone support mage, what about multiple mages? well the logical choice for a potential second mage is to have the Pure support mage described above and then get the awesome mage that you cannot (or should not) do in a group that only has one mage, and that is the pure nuker

Damage dealer mage:
Dwarf Runepriest
-Grandmaster Magic Focus
-Grandmaster Fire
-Expert Holy (for off healing in bad situations)
+whatever else you want (make him an off healer by going grandmaster holy, or grandmaster nature and expert holy, or a more tanky pure dmg dealer by getting some shield skill and endurance etc)

what about 3?
well you can and should take a druid dedicated healer and maybe instead of pure support human freemage take the damage variants instead
early game will be pretty hard, but lets just say the combo of nature's armor, water membrane dmg mitigation and darkness weakness, doesnt leave much room for threats.
oh and you will also be addicted to pots, and waste alot of money... and get chiken p... ah no nvm you wont get that.

what about 4?
oh gawd... plz no shammy... thats not a mage... take a crusader instead at least he gets intercept.


oh and always remember, all magic shools get much stronger by getting them to master as the amount of magic stat bonus they receive gets much larger, this greatly affects things like damage they do, how many turns their status effects last, how intense the buff or debuff is etc.


ps:was going to check typos but this post is way too long and I can smell my dinner burning, GL&HF reading my typos, and playing Legacy I guess.

[polyakoviv]

cool! as for me- 2 mages are ideal to have in the party- runepriest+freemage

[beeda2004]

i using crusader like a healer and free mage like a pure single and aoe dmg, chain lighting for two tousand is nice:-)

[polyakoviv]

so what about magic/spirit, does it look like 2:1 is ok (like 80 magic 40 spirit) or should we focus more on manapool? the thing is - you can always buy manapots and smth like 250-300 manapoints seem to look sufficient around 20 lvl so you can focus more on the magic which gives you spellpower

[Ganen]

depending on setup I even sacrifice vitality to get extra spellpower on both support and damage dealers IF they are packing grandmaster lvl on their spell schools, with heavy magic stat and grandmaster you can get pretty high buff magnitudes and duration helping reduce the amount of turns used to refresh stuff and instead cast more dmg spells or heals.

generally tho, on the lone mage I start off 1:2:1 magic-spirit-vitality and keep magic and spirit even, later, at around lvls 10 or so I go 2:1:1.
if I know I will have the points to invest in endurance and/or mysticism (by making very specialized builds) I even go 3 points into magic and rotate the other point between spirit and vitality.

[Zankor]

I don't personally like the orc shaman but I believe he is worth mentioning, his class ability has a lot of potential to provide a lot of mana in tough fights.

[Ganen]

Originally posted by DariosOrvas:

I don't personally like the orc shaman but I believe he is worth mentioning, his class ability has a lot of potential to provide a lot of mana in tough fights.

true but he isnt really a normal mage, I mean sure druid can use armor and weapons, runepriest shield and weapons, but they cant go above expert and have the typical caster skills, they are grandmaster is 2 schools have masters in mysticism and magic focus, the shammy is clearly more akin to a hybrid that devides his focus between magic and melee.

[Bad Player]

The shaman can also grandmaster nature spells. My shaman goes with nature and two handed maces. When not healing, he is dbuffing stone armor or bashing out crits (100% stuns - mace master)

[NewYears1978]

I thought the key was spam spell + mana potion..glad you wrote this guide! Haha :)

In all seriousness, great guide and write up. +1

[Ganen]

Originally posted by NewYears1978:

I thought the key was spam spell + mana potion..glad you wrote this guide! Haha :)

In all seriousness, great guide and write up. +1

thanks :) hope it helps people choose their maejix

[Volkira]

I specialized my Mage in GM Air,GM Dark,GM focus,Gm Mysticism
Lightening strike and chain lightening awesome against the elementals,used Dark's sleep mid game as crowd control and Sunder was used constantly.
Sunder in unison with the Runepriest fire rune was a great combo,throw poison cloud in too and the mages Storm spell nothing would get close to my melee guys with these 4 Aoe spells running at the same time end game.
My Rune priest was used as full time healer and buffer.He was GM Earth,GM light,Gm Focus,GM Mysticism and master expert fire.Celestial Armor,regen,stone skin were his job to keep active in rotation plus the occasional poison cloud.

Plus 2 x duel wielding Bladedancers made for a good group.Hope expansions allows the group to develop further.

[Ganen]

Originally posted by Volkira:

I specialized my Mage in GM Air,GM Dark,GM focus,Gm Mysticism
Lightening strike and chain lightening awesome against the elementals,used Dark's sleep mid game as crowd control and Sunder was used constantly.
Sunder in unison with the Runepriest fire rune was a great combo,throw poison cloud in too and the mages Storm spell nothing would get close to my melee guys with these 4 Aoe spells running at the same time end game.
My Rune priest was used as full time healer and buffer.He was GM Earth,GM light,Gm Focus,GM Mysticism and master expert fire.Celestial Armor,regen,stone skin were his job to keep active in rotation plus the occasional poison cloud.

Plus 2 x duel wielding Bladedancers made for a good group.Hope expansions allows the group to develop further.

you mean master mysticism :p cant grandmaster air and mysticism :p
I imagine that 2X dual wielders, especially if one uses daggers would have made agony completely shred anyone affected by it :)

[polyakoviv]

what about hp? what do you guys think how many hp should a mage have at 20-30 lvl?

[Ganen]

also depends on setup, do you have a decent tank to take the punch for you? if so you dont really need more than about 150 at lvl 20 or so, if not you should def have more than that particularly if he is the sole mage.

regardless of setup you may want to drop 2 points into vit one every 3 levels or so in the early game where tanks cant really tank for he party properly yet, and after that one point every level is recommended.

this is also dependant on how much investment you have from endurance skill points and gear ofc.

[Fubeca150]

After finishing the game, I'd say that my freemage was gimp compared to my Runepriest. There were just so many creatures that either resisted air damage flat out or weren't very affected by it. But fire worked well on just about everything, even when my free mage used it.

In the end-game, I ended up just casting fire and heal spells with my free mage (didn't want to waste my rune priest's turn casting heal when his fire damage was so effective). And you get groups clustering around you a lot. In MM6-8, Sparks was king. It just wasn't very impressive compared to the fire spells in MMX.

Overall, I was very disappointed by the magic in this game. Anything I tried other than fire just seemed lackluster or ineffective. And on top of that, my elf Hunter ended up consistently doing more damage than my Merc thanks to daggers and dual wield. Point-blank shot (Warden) was useful with the Mage Killer bow equipped.

[Ganen]

Originally posted by Jason:

After finishing the game, I'd say that my freemage was gimp compared to my Runepriest. There were just so many creatures that either resisted air damage flat out or weren't very affected by it. But fire worked well on just about everything, even when my free mage used it.

In the end-game, I ended up just casting fire and heal spells with my free mage (didn't want to waste my rune priest's turn casting heal when his fire damage was so effective). And you get groups clustering around you a lot. In MM6-8, Sparks was king. It just wasn't very impressive compared to the fire spells in MMX.

Overall, I was very disappointed by the magic in this game. Anything I tried other than fire just seemed lackluster or ineffective. And on top of that, my elf Hunter ended up consistently doing more damage than my Merc thanks to daggers and dual wield. Point-blank shot (Warden) was useful with the Mage Killer bow equipped.

there are a a few enemy types with some resistance to air, but overall you prly feel that air was weak because, well it IS weak in damage in relation to fire, but much more mana per damage effective as spells costs less.
air also allows to chain aoe spells like storm+cyclone and the like, while fire is a on turn nuke kind of deal.

like my guide says, fire is a superior damage school ideal ofr builds you want up front dmg and dont care about sacrificing mana pool, mana efficiency and pots/money to get it, but usually a bad idea for support mages that are required to cast others things and need to be conservative.

other schools are obviously much weaker damage wise, but offer vary powerful bonuses instead, like enemy debuffs and party buffs or disables/cc.



all in all I see rpg's with much more serious balance issues but they are far from being great too