Does 3-Player Co-op Still Work in this Game? And Can It Still Work Without Hamachi/Tunngle?

[ibowser123]

So, this is a bit of a long question/problem--I present it as such partially because of some interesting observations, partially so as to reduce the length of any troubleshooting, and partially because I sort of have several questions within questions.

In the most basic sense, what I'm wondering is this: does 3-player co-op still work on this game, as of 2020? And if so, does it work without using Hamachi, Tunngle, or another VPN/LAN simulator?

I've been reading across the internet about this game and its many multiplayer bugs, so I'm well aware of save files corrupting, syncronizations failing between levels, and other issues like that. I know 4-player co-op once worked with the game, but it does not currently work with this version of the game (due to Newdark breaking it, I think, maybe?). I also have played the multiplayer multiple times with one other person without Hamachi and had no major issues, so I assume my problem does not have to do with my portforwarding skills or anything, seeing as I've gotten it working before (albeit with only one other person in the game). Lastly, I know that in the past people on Steam have asked about if 3-player co-op still works, but the most up to date post I found was from 2013 or so, hence why--in light of the breakdown 4-player co-op experienced--it seemed worth asking again.

All that said, I post this because I have not encountered anyone describing the particular problem I am facing.

I hosted a server for the game (through standard portforwarding), and each of my two friends were able to connect to the lobby individually ("lobby" here meaning the screen before the first cutscene, where each player's name and ip is shown). They could not, however, appear in the lobby at the same time. If I hosted and Bob joined first, then Jim could not join the lobby. Jim would be left with the words "joining game" or "establishing connection" at the top of the screen, no matter for how long we waited. In the same manner, if I hosted and Jim joined first, then Bob would not be able to join--facing relatively the same result, albeit with sometimes an temporary game freeze for him (rather than always showing "joining game" or "establishing connection").

What's interesting about this is that in the lobby itself, the player count number would go up. When the third person tried to connect, the number would change to 3, but his name and ip address would never show up. Occasionally, the third person would actually make it to the lobby screen, but they would only be able to see my name or the name of the other friend--never his own name. Hoping this was just a graphical glitch, we attempted to start the game and see the first cutscene, but upon doing so only the two people with names actually listed in the lobby would proceed onward. The third person would then have any number of things happen to him, including joining a random lobby with my name and ip address listed despite the fact that I was not hosting a lobby at that point.

I also know that this is not merely a visual or graphical issue because I did find that if I ran a second instance of the game on my computer and had that instance join in as the third player (using the external ip address, at that), its name and ip address would appear correctly in the lobby. I even tried having the second instance of the game join as the fourth player in the hopes that it might somehow bump my friend in the "third player" slot into the actual lobby, but this did not work either. Instead, the second instance would merely join the lobby correctly, with its name appearing, and my other friend would still be left "joining game." (This also means that I cannot easily troubleshoot or mess around with the issue, as having four instances of the game all running on one computer presents no issues, with all four names appearing in the lobby, even if the external ip is used.) It is only when my friends attempt to join together that there appears to be an issue.

To provide some additional notes, I will clarify that we have not yet tried using a VPN/LAN simulator (Hamachi, presumably, is the recommended one, but people have mentioned Tunngle as well), although I've even heard someone say that co-op seems to actually function better when done through this method. Typically, though, I prefer to do straight portforwarding, so I just wanted to go ahead and ask if there are any known issues in playing 3-player co-op via standard portforwarding. (Additionally, I assume Hamachi and Tunngle will shut down eventually, and I would hope at least 3-player co-op would still be possible after that.)

If 3-player co-op doesn't work at all (whether through hamachi or standard portforwarding), is this by chance due to a bug which was introduced at some point, and if so, is there any older version of the game on Steam which I might be able to downgrade my copy to? (I'm pretty sure it's possible to "unupdate"/downgrade games on Steam if you know the correct update ID and so on, so I'm wondering if there might be a specific version which people can vouch that 3-player co-op works on, assuming it is currently broken.)

I know this was a bit long to get through, so thanks for taking the time to read it and potentially provide any feedback.



INTERESTING SIDE NOTE: In messing around with running four instances of the game on the same computer, I did discover that I could start a server and have them all actually join the game/server. I never bothered testing if all four could actually make it all the way through training and into the main game, but they all made it into the tram section where you can first move around. This at least confirms that the four-player co-op as a "running server" seemingly works--possibly meaning the lack of four actual players over four different computers being possible has to do with a bug in connections and synchronization rather than the game literally not being able to handle it any longer.

[ps47.3dfx]

a very short answer to your very long question is yes, 3 player MP works, but actually completing the game with all 3 players would be nothing short of a miracle.

[phillippi2]

It might be best to wait until System Shock 2: Enhanced Edition comes out. It's a source port to Nightdive's KEX engine. They've said that they are focusing on solving the issues with multiplayer for that version.

[KDM 16AAB]

Somehow I get the impression System Shock 2 won't fit to well with the KEX Engine

[ibowser123]

Thank you, everyone, for the various answers to my question.
I was able to get 3-player multiplayer working through using Hamachi, although I have had no luck at 3-player multi with regular port-forwarding. With Hamachi the third person was able to easily join the lobby right away, and everything else worked just fine. Aside from a single synchronization issue--which we were expecting and had been using multiple save files to help prevent--no further problems have cropped up yet (although we're admittedly still in the med bay section).

It's still sad that multiplayer seems so broken without using a LAN simulator like Hamachi, but I suppose it makes some sense.

Also, yeah, I'm very curious how long it will be before SS2's remaster actually comes out, considering all the leftover pieces they'll have to mess with to get it running in KEX.

[ZylonBane]

I'm always amazed that people put so much effort into getting multiplayer working for a game that's so unsuited for it.

[Sikobae]

Originally posted by ZylonBane:

getting multiplayer working for a game that's so unsuited for it.

Play HeXen or Diablo coop and it will make sense why people like Shock 2 coop.

[ZylonBane]

Really, I didn't realize Hexen and Diablo were survival horror games built around player isolation as a core concept.

FFS, think before you post.

[ibowser123]

Is it unsuited to the extent that the game is built as a single-player survival horror game focused on isolation? Of course.

However, I find that unsuitability partially what makes the game so appealing as a multiplayer game. I fully recognize that it will be janky and broken and all over the place, but that's part of the fun (to the extent that it is humorous and not to the extent that it breaks the game). The RPG gameplay still works either way, the main character looks ridiculous when seen in multiplayer, the physics are humorously janky, and the multi-person item layout in no way works with the risks of the gameplay. Yet, all this creates a humorous, enjoyable experience I could have in few--if any--other games (the closest perhaps being Garry's Mod, and even that cannot provide the exact same experience as SS2, because it is not SS2).

If nothing else, the desire to play multiplayer comes from a love of System Shock 2 as a game, and a desire to share it with friends.

Of course, I have already made sure to play through the game by myself in single-player, to first understand the proper atmosphere the game provides.

[Quambas]

Yup, still works, and it's very neat. Takes some setup though.