Siberian Frontiers

[MasterYi]

1: Do they behave like normal colonies as in the Natives have a chance to rise up and destroy your colony progress?

2: If I let the Natives live, do they add Development to my finished colony?

3: Will the Culture and Religion be Muscovite/Russian ONLY IF the Native population is below 1000? (If so, is it worth sacrificing dev for more unity?)

I am wondering if I should exterminate them or not.

[bri]

1) Only if troops enter the province (yours or others')

2) yes

3) will always be your primary culture/religion barring a random event that changes it (can happen in cases involving use by a custom nation)

That said, in the specific case of Russia they are, IMO, very over-rated. I personally will take expansion ideas and spend the ducats rather than diplo mana for those colonies most of the time, there are always vassal annexations I can use the mana on instead.

[MasterYi]

Originally posted by bri:

1)
3) will always be your primary culture/religion barring a random event that changes it (can happen in cases involving use by a custom nation)

Cuz I searched and on Reddit it said on Patch 1.32 colonisation is weird, it will only be ur religion and culture if colonisers outnumber the natives

[Malvastor]

Originally posted by MasterYi:

Originally posted by bri:

1)
3) will always be your primary culture/religion barring a random event that changes it (can happen in cases involving use by a custom nation)

Cuz I searched and on Reddit it said on Patch 1.32 colonisation is weird, it will only be ur religion and culture if colonisers outnumber the natives

Maybe they're talking about this[eu4.paradoxwikis.com]?

[grotaclas]

Originally posted by bri:

3) will always be your primary culture/religion barring a random event that changes it

This is not true anymore in the current version. The wiki which was linked above explains the details.

[bri]

Originally posted by grotaclas:

Originally posted by bri:

3) will always be your primary culture/religion barring a random event that changes it

This is not true anymore in the current version. The wiki which was linked above explains the details.

Seriously? They nerfed the near useless Siberian Frontiers too? Does their anti-Russia bias know no bounds? All the more reason to stay on 1.30 I guess...

[Marquoz]

Originally posted by bri:

That said, in the specific case of Russia they are, IMO, very over-rated. I personally will take expansion ideas and spend the ducats rather than diplo mana for those colonies most of the time, there are always vassal annexations I can use the mana on instead.

Agreed. Any mechanism that substitutes monarch points (which are precious and relatively hard to come by) for cash (which you can generate in enormous quantities if you know what you're doing) is a bad trade. Janissaries are awful for the same reason that Siberian Frontiers are awful. There are pretty much always better uses for the points.

[grotaclas]

Originally posted by bri:

Originally posted by grotaclas:

This is not true anymore in the current version. The wiki which was linked above explains the details.

Seriously? They nerfed the near useless Siberian Frontiers too? Does their anti-Russia bias know no bounds?

I don't think that his was an intentional Russia nerf. It is just a side effect of the changes to how culture+religion is decided when colonizing trade company provinces. IIRC a developer thought that the original intention of the code didn't match what the code was actually doing and tried to fix it in 1.31(or one of the later 1.31 patches). And then players posted bugreports about the changed behavior and that there are tooltips which don't match new the behavior and the developers made more adjustments because of that. I tried to follow the discussions in the bugreports, but I don't remember the details and I think the developers themselves were not always sure how it actually worked in the game.

[MasterYi]

Is this a bug? I clearly remember only establishing frontiers for 2 provinces but when it finished I suddenly discovered I have colonised much more than 2.

Did get provinces adjacent/that are part of the state to my colony for free?

I only need to colonise one and all nearby provinces gets auto colonised without spending diplo?

[bri]

Originally posted by MasterYi:

Is this a bug? I clearly remember only establishing frontiers for 2 provinces but when it finished I suddenly discovered I have colonised much more than 2.

Did get provinces adjacent/that are part of the state to my colony for free?

I only need to colonise one and all nearby provinces gets auto colonised without spending diplo?

No, you should be having to click on and pay the diplo for every province.

Originally posted by grotaclas:

Originally posted by bri:

Seriously? They nerfed the near useless Siberian Frontiers too? Does their anti-Russia bias know no bounds?

I don't think that his was an intentional Russia nerf. It is just a side effect of the changes to how culture+religion is decided when colonizing trade company provinces.

How would it not be an intentional thing? In previous versions it was set so that clicking the Siberian Frontier button immediately changed the culture and religion of the province to match your primary and now it doesn't do that. That's a code change that had to be made so someone did it intentionally.

[grotaclas]

Originally posted by bri:

Originally posted by grotaclas:

I don't think that his was an intentional Russia nerf. It is just a side effect of the changes to how culture+religion is decided when colonizing trade company provinces.

How would it not be an intentional thing? In previous versions it was set so that clicking the Siberian Frontier button immediately changed the culture and religion of the province to match your primary and now it doesn't do that. That's a code change that had to be made so someone did it intentionally.

I'm saying that it wasn't a code change specifically for Russia. It was a code change for colonies in general which also happened to affect siberian frontiers.

[bri]

Originally posted by grotaclas:

Originally posted by bri:

How would it not be an intentional thing? In previous versions it was set so that clicking the Siberian Frontier button immediately changed the culture and religion of the province to match your primary and now it doesn't do that. That's a code change that had to be made so someone did it intentionally.

I'm saying that it wasn't a code change specifically for Russia. It was a code change for colonies in general which also happened to affect siberian frontiers.

But Siberian Frontiers didn't work on the "normal" colony rules so changing those shouldn't have had any impact on them.

[Malvastor]

Originally posted by bri:

Originally posted by grotaclas:

I'm saying that it wasn't a code change specifically for Russia. It was a code change for colonies in general which also happened to affect siberian frontiers.

But Siberian Frontiers didn't work on the "normal" colony rules so changing those shouldn't have had any impact on them.

Didn't they? I think the only real difference is that they were altered to not require a colonist (and, I think, to not have a native uprising chance). I imagine you could implement that and still have them operate on the default rules for handling culture/religion in colonies.

[grotaclas]

Originally posted by bri:

Originally posted by grotaclas:

I'm saying that it wasn't a code change specifically for Russia. It was a code change for colonies in general which also happened to affect siberian frontiers.

But Siberian Frontiers didn't work on the "normal" colony rules so changing those shouldn't have had any impact on them.

I think siberian frontiers followed the normal rules for colonial culture+religion in all game versions. I just did a test in 1.29.6 used siberain frontier on a province in a trade company region(Inhambane (1183)) and it kept the culture and religion of the province. And I tested 1.30.6 and in that version provinces in trade company regions which had a land connection to the capital seemed to get the primary culture+state religion (both with siberian frontiers and with normal colonists).

[RCMidas]

Frankly that entire bit of code should be taken out behind the chemical sheds and put down, then replaced with a more intelligent one.

[MasterYi]

I thought if the native population is less than 1000 the culture and religion will be mine.

But I checked, provinces with less than 1000 like 800 are still native culture and religion, why?

Do i just have to attack natives for safe measure regardless then?