what to do early ?²

[Chaise Tactique]

i hire advisors if i can, manage diplomacy, army, navy.
i blob if i can, and what ? from 1444 to 1450 you can only build forts. how am i suppose to get an economy at this point ?

[Marquoz]

Perhaps my beginner guide will help:

EU4 is a game that is both complex and deep. You won’t be able to master it quickly. It will take hundreds of hours of experience before you actually get good at it. And that’s fine! Make mistakes! Watch them wreck you! Lose! But learn from the process. It’s a fun experience.

Also, note that I strongly recommend you play the Ottomans for your first campaign. They aren’t the game’s most powerful nation, but they are the easiest to learn with. They have a simple start and are most forgiving of the mistakes a new player is going to make. They have no dangerous immediate neighbors, the ability to almost ignore religion, a strong ruler, a solid economy and military, and many options.

Before you even unpause the game, you should customize your message settings. Pretty much every message in the game is customizable, and many of them should be set to "Pop up and pause." Army reaches destination? Pop up and pause. Fleet reaches destination? Pop up and pause. Battle begins? Pop up and pause. Battle ends? Pop up and pause. Siege ends? Pop up and pause. War starts anywhere? Pop up and pause. Etc. etc. etc. Letting the game sail on while your military sits without orders will cost you wars, and being ignorant of what’s going on around you will cost you the game.

Another thing to do before you unpause is to decide on what your goal is for the campaign you’re about to start. Are you trying to get a specific ironman achievement? Do you want to learn about colonization? Unify the Holy Roman Empire? Show Europeans that Japan can beat them at their own game? Having a goal will provide focus to your game.

Your most important resource is your monarch points. You get these from your ruler’s stats, from your advisors, from estate privileges, and from power projection. These are complex topics that I won’t describe in detail here, but some high points are appropriate. First, note that monarch points come in three categories, Admin, Diplo, and Military. All three categories of points buy technological advancement and ideas, and all three also have additional uses. Admin is used to establish control of newly conquered land—to “core it” in game parlance. Diplo is used to peacefully integrate vassals and to hire naval leaders. And Military is used to hire army leaders. There are other functions, too, but those are most important. Getting as many monarch points as you can is crucial.

Advisors provide between +1 and +5 to their category every month. Small, poor nations can’t afford any. Strong starting nations like the Ottomans can hire +1’s immediately and soon grow to +3’s. And global powerhouses can afford +5 in all categories.

Estate privileges can provide an additional +1 to each category. Estates represent the great internal power blocs of your realm—the church, the nobles, the merchants, and so on. Estate privileges and crownland are also not a simple topic and I won’t go into great detail here. As a beginner, focus on keeping your crownland above 30% to avoid penalties, and increase that value by “seizing crownland” whenever you can. Be careful with the privileges you grant. In addition to the ones that boost monarch power, focus on those that increase estate loyalty at least as much as estate influence. The most important single privilege is probably “Supremacy over the Crown,” which is usually but not always a nobility privilege. It boosts all estates’ loyalty equilibrium by 10% at the cost of allowing them to call periodic diets (legislative sessions). These diets will force you to choose between three missions to keep your estates happy—but many of these missions are great and provide useful bonuses.

Speaking of missions, each nation has a mission tree that can guide your playthrough. You don’t have to follow it if you don’t want to, but the rewards for doing so are powerful. I recommend looking at it frequently as your game position changes to see if an available mission is near completion. Then you can focus your efforts on it.

The most important thing you can do on a strategic level is create a good alliance web. If you and your allies are stronger than your potential enemies, those enemies will be too afraid to attack you. If you’re weaker, you’re going to be a target. Pick your allies carefully, with an eye towards future expansion. Tunis makes a good ally for the Ottomans, for example. They have a powerful fleet, a decent army, and a helpful geographic position. They aren’t an early target of yours, but they’re close enough to help you against nations that you’ll fight soon (like the Mamluks). Also, note that alliances will shift during the course of the game. Today’s ally is tomorrow’s conquest target.

Speaking of conquest, warfare is a complex topic. But some general tips will be helpful. Battle results are determined by the following factors:

--Relative tech levels. Even a difference of one point can have a huge impact. Make sure you are the one in the lead.
--The terrain you fight on. Always attack in plains. Always try to defend in hills, mountains, or forests. Don't cross rivers to attack. Make your enemies cross one to attack you.
--Generals. But not just any general will do. Siege pips are wonderful against forts but do nothing in a battle. Fire pips are useless until infantry develop good fire values and cannons advance a few levels. Shock pips are critical in the early game. Etc.
--Combat width and army composition. You want a front row of infantry + cavalry equal to your combat width. For most nations, a small number of cavalry (2 to 6, depending on combat width) is optimal. Your rear row should be exclusively artillery. At tech 7, when artillery first unlocks, you only care about the siege bonus they provide, but by the time you reach military tech 13+, you want a complete row if you can afford it.
--Sending in a second army to reinforce the first in large battles after significant damage has been done to your side.
--Making sure your troops are fully funded in wartime and have time to reach max morale.
--Drilling. The AI loves to drill, and the bonuses it provides are powerful. Once you can afford it, drill your armies in peacetime.
--Advisor and ruler bonuses
--National and military idea groups--but note that you can do VERY well in combat without either of these.

Once you really learn how combat works, you will go entire campaigns without losing a single battle.

Finally, I want to mention idea groups. As you move through the tech tree, you will unlock a series of eight idea groups. The groups you pick will play a big role in defining your playthrough. As the Ottomans, in order, I recommend Admin/Diplo/Influence as the first three that you choose. I call those groups “The Big Three” because they’re so useful. The reasons why won’t make much sense to you yet, but trust me, you can’t go wrong with them. Humanism makes a good 4th pick for the Ottomans. After that, it gets more complicated, but Expansion and Trade should be on your radar (if your game gets that far).

I hope this is of use. Feel free to ask specific questions on these forums as you learn the game. And remember the point I made at the beginning: EU4 is complex, and you’re going to be bad at it for a long time. Enjoy the learning process

[Magma Dragoon]

Smash that lower autonomy button whenever you can.

[Octopuses]

Get strong allies and use them to conquer. More land = better economy.

[Carefreegold3373]

dont be afraid to take loans and mercs at start
give estates priveleges during the early part which help you

[Marquoz]

I meant to post my economy guide as well. It's designed to follow the beginner guide and applies those principles. To sum up the following guide, get rich by conquering more land in ways that increase your trade income. Let trade guide your expansion.


Running your economy is probably the most complicated topic in EU4. Again, I suggest starting as a strong great power to make the learning process easier. But, in brief:

You have three main sources of income: taxation, production, and trade. Taxation is initially the most important and can be increased by building temples once you unlock them--and by conquering more land, of course. Production and trade become more important as the game advances. You boost production by building workshops and manufactories--and again, by conquering more land.

Trade is by far the biggest source of income by the mid and late game, but only if you expand well. Income from trade is collected at your home trade node. Merchants are used to steer trade from other nodes to that node. Their power to do so is primarily determined by how much of the land you control there. While light ships and marketplaces do increase trade power, it is always more efficient to just conquer every province of trade nodes that matter to you. My EU4 mantra is therefore "let trade guide your expansion."

While there are many ways to get more merchants, the two most important are to set up colonial nations and trade companies. With a few odd exceptions, trade companies can (and should) be created anywhere that isn't part of your home subcontinent. Once a trade company's provinces gain 50% of that node's trade power, they give you a bonus merchant. Colonial nations with 10 or more provinces to the same. Long chains of merchants steering trade to your collection node can produce incomes of many thousands per month. No, this is not an exaggeration.

Also, note that your initial collection node can be moved to a better one. For example, say you're playing Sweden. Sweden collects in the Baltic, but the Baltic is a pretty crappy node. It's much more effective for Sweden to take over every province of the Lubeck node and move there as a first step--i.e., conquer all of Denmark, Norway, and northern Germany. After that, take over the British Isles, northern France, and the Low Countries and collect in the English Channel instead. The English Channel is one of three "end nodes," trade nodes that trade enters but never exits. They make superb collection points, and the Channel is the best of the best because more of the world's trade can be sent there than anywhere else.

You have to balance your income and expenses in the long run to survive. Your main expense is your army. During peacetime in the early years, turn maintenance to the minimum. You'll save 50% that way. Don't build over your force limit without very good reason, because there is a large expense penalty for doing so. You should also mothball forts in peacetime, as well as dismantling any that aren't in useful locations.

Your fleet can also be a significant expense, especially if you build heavy ships. In general, they aren't cost effective. Galleys are enormously cheaper, especially to maintain, and have a big combat bonus in inland seas (and a lesser one on coast lines). Galleys are often the only warship I build, except for one heavy flagship. Light ships are used to boost trade power, but, as I mentioned earlier, conquest is vastly more effective in the long run than wasting your fleet capacity and cash on light ships. I'll use the ones I start with or capture, but I pretty much never build more and often dismantle the ones I do acquire to free up capacity for galleys and transports. Transports are necessary for overseas adventures, and I construct them in very large numbers to run multi-continent empires.

Anyway, this is very brief intro to how to make and spend money in EU4. Hit the wiki, ask questions, gain experience. And let trade guide your expansion.

Edit: oh, and one final note. You can also increase your income by using your monarch points to develop your own land. However, this is wildly inefficient compared to using those same monarch points to core conquests and annex vassals. You are MUCH stronger as a wide empire in EU4 than a tall one. Only develop your own land to force spawn institutions and to complete missions or estate agendas.

[Carefreegold3373]

Originally posted by Marquoz:

Edit: oh, and one final note. You can also increase your income by using your monarch points to develop your own land. However, this is wildly inefficient compared to using those same monarch points to core conquests and annex vassals. You are MUCH stronger as a wide empire in EU4 than a tall one. Only develop your own land to force spawn institutions and to complete missions or estate agendas.

how much devcost reduction would u think justifies devving

[RCMidas]

Enough to make developing a province THREE times cheaper than coring a single 3-Dev province.

[darkestkhan]

Originally posted by RCMidas:

Enough to make developing a province THREE times cheaper than coring a single 3-Dev province.

Especially when it comes to base tax development. Just for reference: the base cost of creating a core is 10 times the dev level of the province.

Worth noting that getting 35% core creation cost is trivial (admin ideas + claim, permanent claim is 25%).
Worth noting that the coring cost is capped at 30 dev (300 admin mana).
Also, the maximum reduction is 80%.

[dbond1]

I play differently. The question posed is how to get an economy going at the start. My answer is you really don't. The most effective way of making an 'economy' at this stage is to do everything you can to lower your costs. In the early going you do not yet have the tech needed to unlock buildings, and ideas groups. So you lower your costs through maintenance, deleting or mothballing forts, selling unwanted ships (are you really going to launch an invasion with four cogs?) and minding your spending.

Some nations have it better at the start than others, and if you are pulling a healthy profit by all means get an advisor or two. But some nations are dirt poor, and this is a luxury that will have to wait.

Lower autonomy is not something I use often. Sure it boosts your income from that province, but in the early going it isn't much. And when you fight rebels you are blowing all that money you just made by replenishing your troops, not to mention the precious manpower you lost. If you have high manpower, as some nations do, then maybe yes. But generally I don't use this button in the early game.

I hate taking loans. And I honestly don't care if it would help me get a better start. Hate 'em so avoid them whenever possible. When the Neumark event fires for Brandenburg early (before I've amassed 100 ducats) I'm more annoyed at having to take a loan than happy to have expanded by two provinces lol.

I mostly ignore estates, as I'm a crownland tramp. I usually do religious diplomats because it is so useful, and here and there I'll use one when it is vital to do so in specific circumstances, like to grab a vital ally or fulfill a mission. By the age of absolutism I'm usually sitting on 90% crownland and that's how I like it.

In the early going, say before ADM tech 5 anyway, the only reliable ways to expand your economy are conquest and dev. Conquest costs more to accomplish than you're going to get out of it, for a while. The idea of course is to keep building your base so it snowballs down the line. And it will. And dev is taking the points you need to tech up, core, buy stab etc, hire generals, etc. Taking money in peace deals (plus reparations) is the real money maker in the early game.

So I'd say in the early game you want to mind your spending, cut costs, build to force limit and get your merchants in the most advantageous nodes. Experiment by moving them around if you have to, to see which arrangement is most profitable. Have a fort on your capital since it gets a boost, but the others might have to go. Hold off on building more cavalry, use infantry instead.

[Chaise Tactique]

(Dont mind about my pseudo, CS2 ♥♥♥♥)
After a while scrolling down all your comments, thx for all of your answers

I unfortunately can't let me play a bigger nation as ottomans, for some reason, in all pdx game I hated big nation games.

So I try with Breizh (ATAOO !), The ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ located in the west part of France. I didn't have its English name.

Anyway, I manage to be as peaceful as possible, 15y without any kind of war for me, I wanna take time to get every single mechanics without be charged by monkeys around me

The only run I tried as ottoman ended up In a BIG coalition of +40k mens for beating my ass after I take Valachia, tho...

[Chaise Tactique]

However it's looks very cool atm, I'm rich, at a point that everyone asking me for money, I'm an European bank.

+5 Ducats income per month, I manage tech while everyone around is burning each other

[Carefreegold3373]

Originally posted by dbond1:

I play differently. The question posed is how to get an economy going at the start. My answer is you really don't. The most effective way of making an 'economy' at this stage is to do everything you can to lower your costs. In the early going you do not yet have the tech needed to unlock buildings, and ideas groups. So you lower your costs through maintenance, deleting or mothballing forts, selling unwanted ships (are you really going to launch an invasion with four cogs?) and minding your spending.

Some nations have it better at the start than others, and if you are pulling a healthy profit by all means get an advisor or two. But some nations are dirt poor, and this is a luxury that will have to wait.

Lower autonomy is not something I use often. Sure it boosts your income from that province, but in the early going it isn't much. And when you fight rebels you are blowing all that money you just made by replenishing your troops, not to mention the precious manpower you lost. If you have high manpower, as some nations do, then maybe yes. But generally I don't use this button in the early game.

I hate taking loans. And I honestly don't care if it would help me get a better start. Hate 'em so avoid them whenever possible. When the Neumark event fires for Brandenburg early (before I've amassed 100 ducats) I'm more annoyed at having to take a loan than happy to have expanded by two provinces lol.

I mostly ignore estates, as I'm a crownland tramp. I usually do religious diplomats because it is so useful, and here and there I'll use one when it is vital to do so in specific circumstances, like to grab a vital ally or fulfill a mission. By the age of absolutism I'm usually sitting on 90% crownland and that's how I like it.

In the early going, say before ADM tech 5 anyway, the only reliable ways to expand your economy are conquest and dev. Conquest costs more to accomplish than you're going to get out of it, for a while. The idea of course is to keep building your base so it snowballs down the line. And it will. And dev is taking the points you need to tech up, core, buy stab etc, hire generals, etc. Taking money in peace deals (plus reparations) is the real money maker in the early game.

So I'd say in the early game you want to mind your spending, cut costs, build to force limit and get your merchants in the most advantageous nodes. Experiment by moving them around if you have to, to see which arrangement is most profitable. Have a fort on your capital since it gets a boost, but the others might have to go. Hold off on building more cavalry, use infantry instead.

if you dont lower autonomy you will even get lower manpower etc harming you more
you might not like playing big nation but you might play them just to learn mechanics properly after which as marquoz says u can do world conquest with any opm

[dbond1]

But is that true? How much additional manpower do you get from lowering autonomy with one click? How much manpower did you have to replace when you fought the rebel stack that you likely triggered? Maybe that drained 3-4k fighting them. It's going to take a long time to make that up at 25 soldiers per tick.

If autonomy didn't tick down on its own, albeit very slowly indeed, then clicking this button would be mandatory. As it is, it is optional, and since we are speaking in this thread about what to do in the early game, which I assume means the first 20 to 40 years, then I think lowering autonomy will not net a big gain in manpower and so advised. If you just took Paris or Constantinople, then yeah, maybe. But the average province in 1460 is not going to be well developed and lower autonomy isn't going to be significant. By all means do this if you think it will maximize your potential, but I would consider it optional in the 1400s. In 1660 sure, go wild, you've got gobs of troops to crush all revolts and replace them fast without batting an eye at the cost. Fifteen years in to your run it might be something to think twice about.

[Carefreegold3373]

Originally posted by dbond1:

But is that true? How much additional manpower do you get from lowering autonomy with one click? How much manpower did you have to replace when you fought the rebel stack that you likely triggered? Maybe that drained 3-4k fighting them. It's going to take a long time to make that up at 25 soldiers per tick.

If autonomy didn't tick down on its own, albeit very slowly indeed, then clicking this button would be mandatory. As it is, it is optional, and since we are speaking in this thread about what to do in the early game, which I assume means the first 20 to 40 years, then I think lowering autonomy will not net a big gain in manpower and so advised. If you just took Paris or Constantinople, then yeah, maybe. But the average province in 1460 is not going to be well developed and lower autonomy isn't going to be significant. By all means do this if you think it will maximize your potential, but I would consider it optional in the 1400s. In 1660 sure, go wild, you've got gobs of troops to crush all revolts and replace them fast without batting an eye at the cost. Fifteen years in to your run it might be something to think twice about.

it is not about immediate effects but long time
and single province wont but when you do it for every province you will reap significant benefits
but the game is about choices

[Octopuses]

I don't see value in lowering autonomy. You lose manpower and a lot of money on reinforcing troops for very little gain. Autonomy ticks down over time anyway. Also, you want to have your soldiers on the frontlines and not playing whack a mole with the rebels.